AAPA Elections Still Relevant?

[EMEDPA]

^^^. Amen. I have to say that if I were starting out today, I would have taken a separate pathway knowing what I know now. There wasn't the track record then that there is now.

yup, me too. I should have done med school. I would have ended up much happier for the last 15 years. it's not about the money it's about the blatant disrespect from physicians and other staff from day 1 just because of the initials after our name.. also having everyone think that I am a medical assistant despite ten years of post high school education (a paramedic cert., 2 bs degrees, a masters, 3 graduate certificates, and most of a doctorate) really sucks. after 27 years in medicine I finally found a job that I like that gives me an appropriate scope of practice and does not limit me with arbitrary rules that says PAs don't do X. solo rural em. great gig. I run the dept, I admit who I want, I do the procedures that I want to do. highly recommend it. hope to move to that job full time asap.at both my current rural per diem jobs  I am treated like a full fledged medical provider with a brain and not some second string fast track jockey...

[cinntsp]

 

"I don't see or hear any ads from "Nurse Practitioners for Tomorrow" on the TV or radio. But that profession is steamrolling ahead."

 

that's because they have an effective national organization that fights aggressively for them and actively goes after anyone who says they are not quality providers of medical services. They fund studies to show they deliver quality care and then make sure everyone hears abut them, they don't need an NPs for tomorrow....they are already at tomorrow while we are still in 1970.....

 

 

Hear, hear!

[burnpac]

the NPs have a huge marketing budget. they even have organizations like Johnson and Johnson placing ads for them. they have organizations like the institute of medicine and the rand corporation studying them and saying they need better scope of practice and autonomy. we need all this.

until the avg american knows what a pa is (and that we are not medical assistants)  we will be stuck in the role of 3rd tier assistants. we will keep getting overlooked by a congress that still thinks of us as assistants and doesn't see why assistants need to order home health care or get reimbursed for EMR use.

what we are doing now isn't working. we need to try something else. every time we win a little battle we lose several big ones.

re: marketing style: the current online approach and "one pt at a time" approach IS NOT WORKING. what do avg americans do? they watch stupid late night reality shows and read magazines in doctors waiting rooms. that's why I mention those mediums. the DOs launched a huge marketing project around a decade ago(using print, radio, and TV) and now everyone knows DO's are doctors and not holistic providers. there are many more PAs than DOs. our available marketing budget must be larger than theirs. their campaign was run by the same firm that did the "got milk?" ads with stars with milk mustaches.

 

And just why do you think they have "a huge marketing budget?" Because the cadre of NPs is also supported by the ANA and all RNs, with nearly 3.1 million RNs in the US, and and nearly 2.6 million RNs currently employed in the US. There are 95,000 PAs. If you have any bright ideas about how level the playing field when we are outnumbered over 32 to 1, I'm all ears.The battles that we have lost have not been because we didn't try, or that we were not at the table. It was because we are not powerful enough, nor do we have enough money as a profession to compete with organized medicine and nursing. We have to be smarter. The change that is coming with the ACA has shifted this balance of power a little in our favor as we can field qualified providers faster and cheaper than nursing or physicians. Legislators are now looking at what is politically expedient to create more human resources to care for all the patients being covered, and this gives our fledgling profession an advantage we can exploit.

 

The AAPA hasn't been pushing the " one patient at a time" educational for some time, so please stop asserting this. Also, you keep extolling the virtues on this fabulous DO marketing campaign (which I didn't know existed until you discussed it, and have never seen anything related to it). Show me one shredlette of objective date that "everyone" knows that a DO is a doctor. Everyone at our facility know that they are a doctor because the act and look like doctors. The average person doesn't know the difference between a DO and an MD, nor do they care one iota. The only thing the patient knows and care about is that the provider in front of them can care for them and meet their HC needs. And this goes for PAs too.

[cinntsp]

The general public are not the ones stonewalling our progress. 

 

Of course they aren't, since most of them don't even know who we are.  Why aren't we educating the public to ask serious question of their legislators about how PAs are constantly left in the dust despite providing equivalent outcomes at a lower cost?  I wonder what a "part of the answer to cutting healthcare costs is already here" campaign could do.  People are riled up about healthcare reform presently and we should be wielding that to our advantage.

 

I do agree with you that we have to target state/national legislatures, but feel it's only part of the battle.  We need a two-pronged approach here.

[EMEDPA]

 

 

The AAPA hasn't been pushing the " one patient at a time" educational for some time, so please stop asserting this.

Steve- we were promised a PR campaign by the aapa around the time of the last election. we were also told we would be able to contribute to a special PR fund with our dues statements. I have not seen that yet. please detail for me what has been done with regards to PR in the last 2 years, maybe I missed it. thanks.

Emedpa, DFAAPA

[burnpac]

 

"I don't see or hear any ads from "Nurse Practitioners for Tomorrow" on the TV or radio. But that profession is steamrolling ahead."

 

that's because they have an effective national organization that fights aggressively for them and actively goes after anyone who says they are not quality providers of medical services. They fund studies to show they deliver quality care and then make sure everyone hears abut them, they don't need an NPs for tomorrow....they are already at tomorrow while we are still in 1970.....

 

 

I have been a practicing PA for 33 years, and if you think that we are still stuck in 1970, you obviously haven't studied your PA history. This past year, 42 states and the District of Columbia all achieved PA positive legislative gains. The momentum is continuing into 2014, fueled in part by the ACA, and states' desire to solve the problems  related to delivering HC to their populations in a meaningful cost-effective manner. The PA profession is in a rock solid position from my perspective.

[PandaBear]

"I don't see or hear any ads from "Nurse Practitioners for Tomorrow" on the TV or radio. But that profession is steamrolling ahead."

 

I caught this ad on a national news network one morning as I was getting ready for school.  Ironically, it aired during PA Week.

 

 

 

[EMEDPA]

Panda- thank you for proving my point. you saw it 3 months ago. it made an impression.

[cinntsp]

And just why do you think they have "a huge marketing budget?" Because the cadre of NPs is also supported by the ANA and all RNs, with nearly 3.1 million RNs in the US, and and nearly 2.6 million RNs currently employed in the US. There are 95,000 PAs. If you have any bright ideas about how level the playing field when we are outnumbered over 32 to 1, I'm all ears.The battles that we have lost have not been because we didn't try, or that we were not at the table. It was because we are not powerful enough, nor do we have enough money as a profession to compete with organized medicine and nursing. 

 

Not to spout too much rhetoric but if we are small, poor, and not powerful enough then we need to somewhat change our approach akin to guerilla warfare.  Trying to sit at the table and just hoping we're heard isn't working.  We need to rile up the population to support us and make a few loud victories to rally more PAs to the cause.  The victories we need may have to be some that aren't necessarily the most important for the profession, but attract more PAs to AAPA and consequently increase funds/support.  I will say that AAPA has made some good moves lately and the tune is slowly changing.  We just need to keep going in that direction and turn up the volume.

[EMEDPA]

 I will say that AAPA has made some good moves lately and the tune is slowly changing.  We just need to keep going in that direction and turn up the volume.

agree. I am not anti-aapa, I just want them to get on the ball with making us a known quantity in american healthcare separate from our affiliation with physicians.

[burnpac]

Steve- we were promised a PR campaign by the aapa around the time of the last election. we were also told we would be able to contribute to a special PR fund with our dues statements. I have not seen that yet. please detail for me what has been done with regards to PR in the last 2 years, maybe I missed it. thanks.

Emedpa, DFAAPA

 

You will have to ask the AAPA as I haven't been a leader since 2011. My point is that no one that I know at the AAPA or in leadership is suggesting that we market one PA at a time. The AAPA has ongoing PR activities and budget, and I know this is a strategic budget priority for Academy and has been for many years. I agree completely with HLReed above.

 

It doesn't matter what the AAPA does from a PR standpoint, as you won't be satisfied unless it is to do exactly what you think should be done to "market" the profession. That is not going to happen (nor do I think that it is an effective use of limited financial resources), so you will continue to assert that the AAPA doesn't have a marketing campaign.

[EMEDPA]

why is it that most PAs want a national PR campaign and most in aapa leadership say it is not a priority? and why are they minimizing the recent move by the VA to move PAs to collaboration. that should have been huge news all over the aapa website and was not even mentioned until a pa from this board contacted them. that is the biggest news for PAs in a decade and where all PAs should be moving to in terms of future scope of practice and accountability.

this is why the aapa is losing members. they don't listen to the ones they have....and they were completely asleep at the wheel when we missed out on the emr reimbursement. just on this forum alone there are many PAs who each personally lost > 25k because of this.

also when aapa leadership doesn't follow through on campaign promises they lose big points. the current president said it was a priority to investigate costs associated with pa name change to see if it was feasible. it was in his position statement and why I and many others voted for him. hasn't happened....

[Guest JMPA]

I think most of the 34,000 PAs on this forum agree with EMED in his above statements. AAPA has adopted a reputation of doing nothing. Other associations will form and the profession will move on with or without them. The majority of PAs are very intelligent individuals and when the masses speak, they should be acknowledged. And telling people that they are to ignore their moral and religious obligations as part of a requirement to practice medicine is completely outrageous. I am totally in agreement with you Paula. Thank you for the contribution to the discussion.

[burnpac]

why is it that most PAs want a national PR campaign and most in aapa leadership say it is not a priority? and why are they minimizing the recent move by the VA to move PAs to collaboration. that should have been huge news all over the aapa website and was not even mentioned until a pa from this board contacted them. that is the biggest news for PAs in a decade and where all PAs should be moving to in terms of future scope of practice and accountability.

this is why the aapa is losing members. they don't listen to the ones they have....and they were completely asleep at the wheel when we missed out on the emr reimbursement. just on this forum alone there are many PAs who each personally lost > 25k because of this.

also when aapa leadership doesn't follow through on campaign promises they lose big points. the current president said it was a priority to investigate costs associated with pa name change to see if it was feasible. it was in his position statement and why I and many others voted for him. hasn't happened....

 

PR is a priority in the AAPA and always has been. The AAPA discussed the VA guidelines (published 12/24/2013) in a press release 1/6/2014. I doubt very seriously that the AAPA was not working on a response to something so momentous to the profession and federal PAs until a forumite contacted them. It may not have come out as timely as some would have liked, but I assure you that the AAPA was aware of this matter at the time it was published and worked on a response over the Holidays for distribution.

 

The AAPA fought for the HITECH money from day one. Just because we want something and it is a good idea, doesn't mean that Congress is going to give it to us. I was pissed at this too, and it related to a misunderstanding of the roles of PAs in the modern HC system. Stuff like this is infuriating, and as a profession, we have experienced it many times. You can say that the AAPA didn't get it done, but you can't say that the AAPA was "asleep at the wheel" and didn't work hard on the problem to effect legislative change.

 

For the record, the AAPA is not currently losing members, and the number of members is expanding because they are listening to their members and changing.

 

If you have an issue with campaign promises, take it up with your elected leaders. I for one think that President Herman has been doing a great job moving the profession and the Academy forward. You need to remember that before you hang Larry in effigy, he is one vote on a 13 member board. Nothing happens or gets passed without his vote and six other board member's votes.

[EMEDPA]

1.  it related to a misunderstanding of the roles of PAs in the modern HC system. Stuff like this is infuriating, and as a profession, we have experienced it many times. ...

2. For the record, the AAPA is not currently losing members, and the number of members is expanding because they are listening to their members and changing.

3.  I for one think that President Herman has been doing a great job moving the profession and the Academy forward.

see my responses to #s above:

1. why does this misunderstanding persist?

2. I am glad the aapa is gaining members. it will get us a better seat at the table.  I tell all my students to join aapa, their state org, their professional society, and PAFT.

3. overall I am happy with what the current president has been doing and the way the aapa has started to pay more attention on many matters other than PR. I just would have liked to have seen him pursue this item from his position statement, even if others opposed him. to the best of my knowledge once the election was over he never mentioned it in print again. a letter from the president on the issue in jaapa would have been appreciated even if it just said" I tried but was unable to make this an agenda item because of xyz". it's important to a lot of us and even you know it won't go away until it gets a fair evaluation. I do appreciate your attempt to make that happen despite the fact that it was voted down. as a side note many of us tried to get a vote tally to support those who stood up for this but a formal tally was not recorded on this issue. I thought that was standard rules of order kind of stuff.... where would we be come election day if we were not allowed to know how our state senators voted?

[burnpac]

I think most of the 34,000 PAs on this forum agree with EMED in his above statements. AAPA has adopted a reputation of doing nothing. Other associations will form and the profession will move on with or without them. The majority of PAs are very intelligent individuals and when the masses speak, they should be acknowledged. And telling people that they are to ignore their moral and religious obligations as part of a requirement to practice medicine is completely outrageous. I am totally in agreement with you Paula. Thank you for the contribution to the discussion.

 

Really? How do you know that? OK. I give you that there are 34,000 registered users on this forum. They are not all graduate PAs or PA students, and by and in large, only a fraction of PA Forum usernames actually participate in any meaningful way. I enjoy the collegial discussions with my fellow PAs, but don't throw this number out there without any qualification and expect me and others on this forum to accept that it represents more than it does.

 

Show me one instance where the AAPA, I, Jim, or others have told PAs that they are  "to ignore their moral an religious obligations as a part of a 'requirement' to practice medicine...." Be outraged all you want, but you need to think about the true meaning of ethical, and moral behavior, and put the needs of the patients who present and rely on you for care, ahead of your own needs and beliefs. If you can't do that, don't put your self in those ethically difficult situations, and refer the patient to a provider who can better serve the needs of the patient in the context of the patient's values and beliefs.

 

That is all the Guidelines for Ethical Conduct of the PA Profession is about. It is also the mark of a true profession.

[Guest JMPA]

Really? How do you know that? OK. I give you that there are 34,000 registered users on this forum. They are not all graduate PAs or PA students, and by and in large, only a fraction of PA Forum usernames actually participate in any meaningful way. I enjoy the collegial discussions with my fellow PAs, but don't throw this number out there without any qualification and expect me and others on this forum to accept that it represents more than it does.

 

Show me one instance where the AAPA, I, Jim, or others have told PAs that they are  "to ignore their moral an religious obligations as a part of a 'requirement' to practice medicine...." Be outraged all you want, but you need to think about the true meaning of ethical, and moral behavior, and put the needs of the patients who present and rely on you for care, ahead of your own needs and beliefs. If you can't do that, don't put your self in those ethically difficult situations, and refer the patient to a provider who can better serve the needs of the patient in the context of the patient's values and beliefs.

 

That is all the Guidelines for Ethical Conduct of the PA Profession is about. It is also the mark of a true profession.

so typical of you to insult the members of this forum and refer to them as "unqualified".  liberal beliefs have no role in this discussion. this thread is for discussing AAPA and that is just what i was doing. whether you like my response or not is trivial and has little to no bearing on the discussion. Who are you to decide whos morals or beliefs are more important? you need to mind yourself and stop being rude and confrontational to fellow members. I know the true meaning of ethical, and your my friend are not. Whom is AAPA to set the guidlines for ethical conduct? State law sets the ethical guidline standards not the AAPA.

[EMEDPA]

I think it is fair to say that if a patient asks us about an issue we don't feel comfortable discussing( like birth control or abortion or sex reassignment surgery, etc) that it is our duty as providers to point them in the direction of other resources without being judgmental of their decisions or lifestyle choices.

[Guest JMPA]

lets not be diverted, his intention was to misdirect the original discussion. In my opinion, no the aapa elections are not relevant to me at this time for the previously stated reasons.

[GetMeOuttaThisMess]

^^^ (EMEDPA). It can be handled respectfully without impinging on ones own moral beliefs.

[EMEDPA]

^^^ (EMEDPA). It can be handled respectfully without impinging on ones own moral beliefs.

no argument from me.

[burnpac]

lets not be diverted, his intention was to misdirect the original discussion. In my opinion, no the aapa elections are not relevant to me at this time for the previously stated reasons.

 

JMPA - I apologize to you. My intent was not to insult you or anyone else on this forum, or denigrate anyone's beliefs or values. I participate in this forum from time-to-time to give a different perspective, one that I feel is missing. For the record, this discussion got misdirected on page one in the first posts by others (which is not unusual in my experience on this forum!). I have just responded to what others said, to correct what I perceive to be misconceptions. If my responses to other's statements / assertions took us farther off topic, I apologize for that also. Take what I say with a grain of salt, and let's just agree to disagree on some issues. In my experience over the years, I have found that PAs have vastly more in common than the few things on which we disagree. All the best to you.

[KMD16]

yup, me too. I should have done med school. I would have ended up much happier for the last 15 years. it's not about the money it's about the blatant disrespect from physicians and other staff from day 1 just because of the initials after our name.. also having everyone think that I am a medical assistant despite ten years of post high school education (a paramedic cert., 2 bs degrees, a masters, 3 graduate certificates, and most of a doctorate) really sucks. after 27 years in medicine I finally found a job that I like that gives me an appropriate scope of practice and does not limit me with arbitrary rules that says PAs don't do X. solo rural em. great gig. I run the dept, I admit who I want, I do the procedures that I want to do. highly recommend it. hope to move to that job full time asap.at both my current rural per diem jobs I am treated like a full fledged medical provider with a brain and not some second string fast track jockey...

Agreed!

[burnpac]

this is why the aapa is losing members. 

 

EMEDPA - A just talked with Larry, and membership growth at the AAPA was up 13% December 2012 to December 2013, the most recent period for which there is data. When I involved in state leadership in the 1990s, it was always my mantra that it you want members to join CAPA, create an organization of which PAs want to be a member. Let's hope that this trend continues at the national level, as it is vital to the current battles, and battles yet to come to promote the profession. Let's also hope that it also represents that the AAPA is evolving in the right direction, and becoming a more attractive option to non-members and new grads. Our future depends on it. Thanks for being a member.

[cinntsp]

EMEDPA - A just talked with Larry, and membership growth at the AAPA was up 13% December 2012 to December 2013, the most recent period for which there is data. 

 

That seems to be the response to anyone who says PAs aren't joining.  Who are those new members?  The data over the past six or seven years up through April 2013 shows an overall drop of fellow members, though not by much, so it's safe to call it pretty stagnant.  The increase in membership is due to "others," which are primarily students.  I'm sure that's the same case for what you were just told based on all of the new programs popping up.  While any increase in membership for AAPA is great, it looks like students keep their membership until it lapses and then the next batch of graduating students take their place.  It would make sense for the number of fellow members to proportionately increase if all these new student members end up staying members upon graduation.  We need to figure out how to retain them upon graduation because students don't pay much in dues and don't have much money to donate to the PAC.