failed out. What to do?

[esmith]

i failed out of PA school. The 2nd semester i was put on probation for cum. gpa below 3.0. 3rd semester i was unable to raise my gpa. I tried my hardest and studied non-stop. I can't image having worked harder.

Now I am 31 years old and over $220,000 in debt due to educational expenses. I have a bachelor's and a master's degress in Biology, which are both pretty worthless in solving my financial scenario. I have not idea what do to

[rev ronin]

First, stop, take a deep breath, and don't rush into anything.  What's done is done, and waiting a few weeks to decide where to go from here is hardly going to make anything any worse.

 

Next, let's get a bit more detail on your program: are they offering to let you restart in a future class, or are they just telling you to hit the road?  Honestly, if you've failed out of one program, the program that's most likely to take you is going to be the one who kicked you out.  Whether or not you want to go is a separate matter--the first question is *CAN* you try again?

 

If you haven't already, I highly recommend buying a current copy of What Color Is Your Parachute? and both reading it cover-to-cover and doing the exercises.  On the chance that you are not going to be able to get into PA school at all, you need to have some alternatives.

You also need to let your support network, whomever that is for you, know that you've had this setback.  Not that they'll be able to fix anything, but they probably care enough to help in meaningful ways, that may vary based on what your situation and needs are.

[esmith]

I did not meet the GPA requirement after being placed on academic probation. They said I can reapply for the class that begins in 12 months but their is no guarantee I will be accepted. I will try again but they insisted I apply to other schools, as well. I do not have any alternatives, unless I want to go the RN->BSN->NP route.

[LT_Oneal_PAC]

Getting back into PA school is going to be tough. I recommend going either somehow using you're bio degree or going the RN route. There are accelerated one year BSNs for people with science degree. Then I would into consolidating loans with fedloans, doing "pay as you earn@ repayment plan, and working for the gov't or other 501c non profit (public universities and hospitals count) and doing public service loan forgiveness.

 

I know it is not a "follow your dream" advice, but just looking at this from a pragmatic point of view.

[pahopeful_1]

If I was in your place, I would give it a shot applying to that school again and if becoming a PA is really your dream (and your best chance at this point) so why not do everything possible that is in your hands?  However, another school accepting you is a low yield scenario, but not sure if its impossible. Have you considered direct-entry NP programs? There aren't many of them (I think there maybe 7 in the entire nation. Found out about this when I was looking for back-up just in case I don't get in PA school). Boston College has one and it is only 23 months. You get your RN and NP in 23 months, but it is an expensive program (80K I think).

 

Another thing you want to consider is the debt you have already. $220K is really A LOT of money. I know you can't do much with a Masters in Biology. If you want to start working, have you considered teaching at a community college? Professors that teach at community college have a decent salary. Whatever you decide, I want to wish you all the best with all your endeavors!

[MT2PA]

I did not meet the GPA requirement after being placed on academic probation. They said I can reapply for the class that begins in 12 months but their is no guarantee I will be accepted. I will try again but they insisted I apply to other schools, as well. I do not have any alternatives, unless I want to go the RN->BSN->NP route.

If this is your plan (which is fine) your biggest obstacle will be proving that you have figured out how to succeed this time.  Both the school you attended and others you apply to will want to know that you've identified what issues you may have had and how you have fixed them.  If you were studying non-stop and still didn't get the grades you need, did you seek help in finding new ways to study?  Tutors?  Study groups?  Would you benefit from speaking to someone about test anxiety?  Or anxiety in general?

 

Unfortunately, making the grades is just part of the deal for PA school.  I don't know about your program, but it sounds like bad news to me that they encouraged you to apply to other programs - they may not be inclined to accept you again knowing you struggled academically and instead give that spot to someone who could potentially make the grades.  Granted, that could be true of any program.  If being a PA is truly what you want to do, and not just because you feel you're in too deep at this point, you need to put the leg work in to prove you CAN do it.

 

If you want to pursue other options and cut your losses, I would say step one is to find a job, ASAP.  Will it be your passion or lifelong career job at this point?  No, but it will be income while you decide what to do.  Assuming you won't be making something like a PA salary, you could qualify for financial hardship and income based repayment on your loans - so don't stress too hard about that aspect of it.  There ARE other things you can do with bio degrees, research, laboratory, sales, etc.  It's not being a PA, but it's something.

[had1118]

First of all, I am sorry.  You are in a difficult situation, but definitely not insurmountable!

 

Medical device, pharmaceutical sales, or the like pay well.  Again, it is probably not your dream job, but you might make 80K a year doing so.  I have several acquaintances in device sales that have flourished and make six figures-grant it took a year or two to get there.  Still, that could be a quick fix for knocking down your debt.  Biology degrees are common in that field. Work a bit and decide which route will work best from here.

 

Best of luck to you!  Keep your head up. 

[bike mike]

When I was in PA school we had several classmates fail out. All but two were allowed to return the next year if they so desired. AS Rev mentioned, I would speak with the directors of your program and just see what chance you have of being offered a seat in next years class. It is unlikely another PA program is going to accept a student that has failed out. 

[winterallsummer]

Is your heart set on becoming a PA? Medical school is actually much more forgiving than PA school if you wanted to change paths. The other option would be get your PhD since you have your MS already and go into academia or research. That way you could work at a non profit and pay the minimum on your loans using the Pay As You Earn and in ten years your debt is written off.

 

If you want to go back to PA school I would find a three year program with a high completion rate.

 

Sorry to hear your struggle. Sometimes taking time off to sort your thoughts out is better than rushing into something else to "fix things."

[cinntsp]

I think the suggestions of going to NP or med school are a bit unrealistic, at least in the short term. 

[LT_Oneal_PAC]

Agreed. I see three options, use you're bio degree, get an RN degree, or retry for PA. Whatever the case, NEED to do the PSLF with PAYE repayment.

[greenmood]

I'd use the bio degree for something. Stop accumulating debt, because you're only hurting yourself. The answer is not more school, at this point.

[NEB1985]

I'd use the bio degree for something. Stop accumulating debt, because you're only hurting yourself. The answer is not more school, at this point.

For what though? I've been out of undergrad for 4 years, starting PA school in May, and I quickly realized that a degree in Biology isn't good for much other than getting you into some sort of grad school. The medical device sales is an interesting possibility, as I've heard it can be very lucrative and only requires a bachelor's, but how do you go about getting into that field? I ended up doing totally non-related work in nuclear plants, because any biology/healthcare-related jobs I could find with just a bachelor's all paid around $12-15 an hour; good luck getting out of debt on 25-30k a year... I would personally suggest the accelerated BSN programs. You can be out in 12-18 months with a solid paying job, and the ability to go back for NP, while still working and earning money, if that's what you really desire.That was my fallback option if I was unable to get into PA school.

[cinntsp]

For what though? I've been out of undergrad for 4 years, starting PA school in May, and I quickly realized that a degree in Biology isn't good for much other than getting you into some sort of grad school. The medical device sales is an interesting possibility, as I've heard it can be very lucrative and only requires a bachelor's, but how do you go about getting into that field? I ended up doing totally non-related work in nuclear plants, because any biology/healthcare-related jobs I could find with just a bachelor's all paid around $12-15 an hour; good luck getting out of debt on 25-30k a year... I would personally suggest the accelerated BSN programs. You can be out in 12-18 months with a solid paying job, and the ability to go back for NP, while still working and earning money, if that's what you really desire.That was my fallback option if I was unable to get into PA school.

 

People keep suggesting someone who failed out of a PA program can just immediately waltz into nursing/NP/med school.  That's is wishful thinking IMO.  The best route would be to start IBR and get ANY job at a non-profit and have the loans discharged in 10 years under PSLF.

[NEB1985]

I'm not suggesting waltzing into med school or an NP program. But if the person was able to get into a PA program, I think they'd also be able to get into a fast track nursing program fairly easily and I think the curriculum would be easier to handle.

[MT2PA]

For what though? I've been out of undergrad for 4 years, starting PA school in May, and I quickly realized that a degree in Biology isn't good for much other than getting you into some sort of grad school. The medical device sales is an interesting possibility, as I've heard it can be very lucrative and only requires a bachelor's, but how do you go about getting into that field? I ended up doing totally non-related work in nuclear plants, because any biology/healthcare-related jobs I could find with just a bachelor's all paid around $12-15 an hour; good luck getting out of debt on 25-30k a year... I would personally suggest the accelerated BSN programs. You can be out in 12-18 months with a solid paying job, and the ability to go back for NP, while still working and earning money, if that's what you really desire.That was my fallback option if I was unable to get into PA school.

Lab.  Some states/hospitals/companies will hire bio degree grads to work as medical technologists - many require certification, but some don't.  You should start at over $20/hr easily.  It's not a PA salary, but if you're willing to work 2nd/3rd shift to make differential or have a FT job with another on the side, you can pay down debt.  

 

The key for anyone reading though is to have a clear career plan if you're going to rely on a bio degree only. 

[LaurelAllison]

Do you mind if I ask what school? I'm very sorry you went through that. I know you must be devastated. But its not the end of the road! I would look for a program with a low attrition rate. I picked my school because they basically said we don't let you fail out. You would have to just not try to fail out here. So maybe a different program really would be the best route 

[db_pavnp]

Lab.  Some states/hospitals/companies will hire bio degree grads to work as medical technologists - many require certification, but some don't.  You should start at over $20/hr easily.

 

I have seen this posted before, maybe it was you, and I have commented on this before - OP, you might be able to pull this off, but you're going to have to do some serious digging in BFE to find it.

[MT2PA]

I have seen this posted before, maybe it was you, and I have commented on this before - OP, you might be able to pull this off, but you're going to have to do some serious digging in BFE to find it.

I know for certain Mayo Clinic in MN hires this way (or used to).  The state of MN doesn't require the MT cert (Florida, for example, does) and they are such a large employer of lab personnel that they couldn't fill their staff if they were restricted to those with certifications.  As long as the state itself doesn't mandate the certification - I think about 13 do -  opportunities can be found.  Or take a year to get the cert and have literally options everywhere.

[db_pavnp]

I live in a state that doesn't require the certification, but city jobs won't touch a non-cert and there are so many unemployed certified individuals they won't ever need to.

 

It can probably be done, as you say, if you hunt.

[cinntsp]

I know for certain Mayo Clinic in MN hires this way (or used to).  The state of MN doesn't require the MT cert (Florida, for example, does) and they are such a large employer of lab personnel that they couldn't fill their staff if they were restricted to those with certifications.  As long as the state itself doesn't mandate the certification - I think about 13 do -  opportunities can be found.  Or take a year to get the cert and have literally options everywhere.

 

This doesn't sound right.  Are you sure these folks aren't being hired on to fill an MLT role?  Or are you stating that these are folks that have completed a CLS program and eventually let their cert lapse?  Folks can't just walk in off the street and sign off on results.

[db_pavnp]

I'm not an expert on this and god knows it is a muddy topic, but, far as I understand it... many states have no formal educational requirement for the role.  Labs may hire anyone they wish to run tests and release results *provided* the lab can show documentation of training plus yearly competency results (Joint Commission requirement or some such business).  In general, most labs hire people with something along the lines of a certification to avoid a lengthy training period and there are plenty of unemployed lab people living under bridges, but there is little protection for who can and cannot release results in many states.

[Joelseff]

A RN from our class failed out of our program and seemingly "waltzed" into a NP program (a very reputable one at that) and graduated around the same time we did... Having said that, I agree that it's not automatic and I'm sure you really have to sell it but it us possible and it does happen.

 

Sent from my S5 Active...Like you care...

[MT2PA]

This doesn't sound right.  Are you sure these folks aren't being hired on to fill an MLT role?  Or are you stating that these are folks that have completed a CLS program and eventually let their cert lapse?  Folks can't just walk in off the street and sign off on results.

I'm sure.  You still get on the job training regardless, it's just that those with a CLS degree and the MT certification are usually easier to train as their education was more directed to clinical lab work.

 

It's not like it's rocket science....a lot of machines auto verify results anyway assuming they are within the programmed normal ranges.  Are they going to let a bio degree come in and work in a blood bank?  Maybe not because that requires more specialized training.  I know plenty of people with gen bio or chem degrees that  could EASILY be trained to work as an MT in a variety of areas.  I've worked with several who were better lab personnel than people who had the CLS degree and cert.  It just comes down to either state law or company policy on what they are allowed to hire.

 

To be fair, a 4 year degree in a biological science of some sort (a psych major isn't going to cut it) is almost always required (save for the MLT which is usually 2) and all labs have an established hierarchy overseen by a medical director, lab managers and supervisors, etc to be compliant with several accrediting agencies (College of American Pathologists (CAP) is one of the main ones in addition to FDA, AABB, OHSA, etc) with very well established training requirements...so it's not like just ANYONE is running lab tests.

[Mermaid]

I'm not in PA school yet, but I do have many years working in health care. My question for your to ponder is.........do you really want to work in healthcare? And as a provider?  I would question your motivation as to "why" PA school. Also, since you feel as though you studied as hard as you possibly could and still couldn't manage an increase, pursuing other programs of a similar caliber may not be setting you up for success. 

 

I know you want to make money and are overwhelmed with debt, but narrowing your options will not help in the long run.

 

Have you considered IONM? ( intraoperative neuromonitoring ) You could most definitely secure a job offer with your educational degrees, and the majority of the companies will pay you to train and help with relocation, etc. Something to think about that requires no further money invested, and involves the medical field with the opportunity to make a very good wage and even 6 figures for the right folks.