Moderator EMEDPA Posted January 22, 2014 Moderator Share Posted January 22, 2014 EMEDPA - your thoughts? Will you be a better clinician upon completion of your DHSc? Unless we can say that our doctoral training makes us more knowledgable and more skilled clinicians, and convince the public that this is in fact true, We're still in the same mess, even with DHSc after our name. The DHSc is very similar to a doctorate in public health. we have courses in research methodology, biostats, epidemiology, leadership and conflict resolution, etc. I think this is a viable doctorate program to produce folks wanting to work in academic, research, education, or global health settings. it is not a clinical program by any means but there are clinical elements. I took an alternative medicine course and now know much more about acupuncture, chiropractic, etc and the real indications for each modality. my applied research project involves working in an austere medical setting in a developing nation. that work will make me a better team leader and I will be exposed to more pts with diseases I have not seen before.I am working towrads increasing the efficiency of a rural clinic so they will be able to see more pts/day and see those pts with specific needs in more appropriate ways. I think I will be a more knowledgeable clinician and leader when I am done with the program as that has been my focus. others focus on becoming educators, etc. I would be willing to hold my 61 unit doctorate up to comparison with any of the DNP programs out there, most of which have 35-45 credits. no one will look at my CV which lists fieldwork, etc and think it does not compare favorable against a DNP. is it a residency or bridge program to md/do? certainly not. but it does get me where I want to be in the long term; working with underserved populations both domestically and internationally, potentially in a leadership and/or teaching role. after completing the program I also intend to teach a bit at a local PA program and certainly feel I will be well prepared to do that as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avalon Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Thanks for the thoughtful reply, EMEDPA. I agree completely - the DHSc degree is appropriate for your needs and certainly compares very favorably with, if not markedly exceeds, the requirements of the DNP. I might add that the niche to which you aspire desperately needs people like you and I have no doubt that you will excel in that niche. As you noted, however, this approach is not intended to be a PA to DO/MD bridge, nor is it a clinically focused residency. This is what I fear by using the DHSc approach in the current political climate: By promoting as an option a degree that is inherently (and appropriately, for its designed purposes) not a clinical degree, we set ourselves up for the same criticism that has repeatedly been leveled against the DNP degree - namely that it is a theorectical, academic degree that offers no meaningful advancement in the depth or breadth of medical knowledge, and in clinical skills, over that already acquired by the master's prepared PA. Isn't this exactly why we as a profession criticize the DNP and suggest it is "faulty advertising" to both legislators and to the public? Please do set me straight if I am missing something here. I simply do not see how the option of earning a DHSc serves the PA profession as a whole, although EMEDPA and many others may find it serves well their individual professional goals (e.g., academic aspirations, global medicne, leadership opportunities). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted January 22, 2014 Moderator Share Posted January 22, 2014 The DHSc is not a PA specific degree like a DNP is NP specific. many of my classmates(more than 2/3) are not PAs. many come from backgrounds in public health, medical research, nursing, dental health, resp. therapy, radiologic technology, alternative medicine, etc. We have physicians in the program as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MedicinePower Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Is it just me or does the Lynchburg program no longer mention the option 9 month doctoral program? I just went looking through their website and can't seem to find it. Wondering if I need another cup of coffee? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AREID Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Is it just me or does the Lynchburg program no longer mention the option 9 month doctoral program? I just went looking through their website and can't seem to find it. Wondering if I need another cup of coffee? Yup, it's gone. Wonder what happened... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MedicinePower Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 Yup, it's gone. Wonder what happened... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Strange. Perhaps they were premature in announcing it? I see found this news article: http://www.dailyprogress.com/news/local/lynchburg-college-to-offer-doctor-of-physician-assistant-degree/article_fc4962ce-7fa1-11e3-993f-0019bb30f31a.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMD16 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 I think this is a viable doctorate program to produce folks wanting to work in academic, research, education, or global health settings. my applied research project involves working in an austere medical setting in a developing nation. that work will make me a better team leader I would be willing to hold my 61 unit doctorate up to comparison with any of the DNP programs out there, most of which have 35-45 credits. no one will look at my CV which lists fieldwork, etc and think it does not compare favorable against a DNP. is it a residency or bridge program to md/do? certainly not. but it does get me where I want to be in the long term; potentially in a leadership and/or teaching role. Hence the reason I advocate that we should all pursue a doctorate whether it's PhD or DHSc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalPA Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 The DHSc is not a PA specific degree like a DNP is NP specific. many of my classmates(more than 2/3) are not PAs. many come from backgrounds in public health, medical research, nursing, dental health, resp. therapy, radiologic technology, alternative medicine, etc. We have physicians in the program as well. This is the same rationale I was thinking for the Doctorate of Medical Science.....less restrictive than Doctorate of Physician Assistance. You could be competitive when applying for Director of Health Services, Asst EMS Director, Deputy Director - Health and Human Services Dept etc. Not to mention you could teach at the University level and attain a higher level professorship Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted January 23, 2014 Moderator Share Posted January 23, 2014 This is the same rationale I was thinking for the Doctorate of Medical Science.....less restrictive than Doctorate of Physician Assistance. You could be competitive when applying for Director of Health Services, Asst EMS Director, Deputy Director - Health and Human Services Dept etc. Not to mention you could teach at the University level and attain a higher level professorship agree completely. I think a title without the word assistant in it would appeal to a broader audience of students and garner more respect from the academic community as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joelseff Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 Yup, it's gone. Wonder what happened... Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk I think the site got hacked. I clicked on the link from the OP and it brought me to a google warning "get me out of here" page. Maybe some SDN kids got into it LOL J/K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpackelly Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 It’s gone. Obviously some feedback was received that was not anticipated. There were a number of newspaper articles than can still be reached but it is no where on their web site, just the master’s component. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 ^^^^^^^^^We talk too much on this site!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SocialMedicine Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 The didactic leader at this college is not a PA... she is an RN .... did anyone pick up on this ? Very concerned about the direction of this profession given all these new programs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 I noticed the RN, too. Does anyone know if RNs teach at any PA schools? Mine had an MSN as a guest lecturer on lead poisoning in my pediatrics class. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FamilyPAC Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 My PA school was fairly new. We had a RN, MSN as a full time faculty member, also served as course director and primary instructor for one class and was a lecturer and course assistant in various others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted February 10, 2014 Moderator Share Posted February 10, 2014 DPAM Postgrad page back up: http://www.lynchburg.edu/department-physician-assistant-medicine/physician-assistant-doctoral-option-dpam-0 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator ventana Posted February 12, 2014 Moderator Share Posted February 12, 2014 Physician Assistant Doctoral Option (DPAM) Lynchburg College is excited to be in the developmental stages of a doctoral degree as a post-professional option for students that have graduated from the Lynchburg College Master of Physician Assistant Medicine program (MPAM). This program is not an entry level doctoral program. Physician Assistants interested in this program must have previously completed the Lynchburg College MPAM degree, completed all of their PA professional education, and successfully passed the National Commission on Certification of Physician Assistants (NCCPA) Physician Assistant National Certifying Exam (PANCE). Program Outline 9 months additional instruction post-master’s degree Coursework in leadership training in area including healthcare management and law, organizational behavior, disaster medicine, global health Clinical fellowship Please continue to visit this website for more information as it develops. certainly looks like a set up for a bridge program once they get the wrinkles ironed out - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMD16 Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Way to go. The NP are doing it. We might as well do the same. We are going to be called doctors both inside and outside clinical setting. Let confuse the heck out of the patients. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BruceBanner Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Sounds like another higher ed scheme to me. More classes = more money coming into the program = a novel "doctorate" degree with questionable usefulness. The end result is a clinical PA with 'doctor' somewhere in their title.... I think it's analogous to the dual PA/MPH degree. It's a money sink. Students spend 3 years instead of 2 paying outrageous tuition and taking bullsh!t courses and come out with essentially the exact same employment value as the rest of the class. So what do they get for all their extra work? A hollow degree and a standard PA job like the rest of us. It's a farce and I think this DPAM is no different. I support established, legitimate doctoral programs but these 9-month tours of duty in arbitrary doctoral studies are a waste of PAs money. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMD16 Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 ^^ Completely in agreement with your analysis and take on the issue. Is it fair to say that master level PA program is a scheme as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted February 12, 2014 Moderator Share Posted February 12, 2014 The DPAM is essentially a 9 mo residency in the student's field of choice + a few concurrent didactic courses. there is also a fairly good chance that the student will receive a stipend for the clinical time, offsetting the added price for the degree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghazni Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 Please divert from this doctoral path. Otherwise no one will want to be a PA. I know many RNs that are taking the PA route to avoid the DNP program. This will be even more a deterrent for future healthcare providers. I understand the intent, but this does not create opportunities or a wider scope of practice. Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted February 12, 2014 Moderator Share Posted February 12, 2014 a doctorate in and of itself does not increase scope of practice. when tied to a residency, it does. the future is all abut proving what skills you can do. nothing demonstrates that better than completing a residency and CAQ exam. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avaya24 Posted February 12, 2014 Share Posted February 12, 2014 The MD side won't propose - it we want it, PAs need to jump in and scramble for it. Make noise, insist on exploring the opportunity, make it happen. Waiting for the MD/DO side to do it won't happen. After 50 years, they barely recognize we're on their side. Time we do for ourselves. We've already been doing it for 50 years - time to say it out loud without worrying if we irritate physicians..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted February 12, 2014 Moderator Share Posted February 12, 2014 the real proponents for us on the doc side are PAs who become docs, like the director of the LECOM PA to DO bridge program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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