Most common Pre-Reqs

[MedicinePower]

EMEDPA, my friend ;-), do you really think physics, microbiology, and psych should be required?  Also, math and writing are part of core curriculum at most all institutions so no need to require them.  Can't say its evident based on some graduate papers I've read but it is required.  

 

Since our discussions and this board discussion I was re-evaluating the whole organic chemistry requirement and lean toward it NOT being required to enter a PA program.  but I don't agree physics and psych.  For me, this is what I have decided should be industry wide.  Just my opinion.  

 

1.  A and P - two classes either together or one of each separate

2.  General biology - two classes with lab

3.  General chemistry - two classes with lab (i still think labs have some value here)

4.  Statistics

5.  Medical terminology (waived when appropriate)

 

These foundations allow us to teach the rest.  Also, PA programs are required to teach genetics, ethics, microbiology, etc. so there is no reason to make students take these as a prerequisite.  They should learn it relevant to medical practice.  Heck, these aren't required for med school entry.  etc. etc.

 

So, I like this honed concept.  I am sure some won't.  and that is fine.  But it would be nice if programs could agree on a foundation related to entry requirements.  It would be fitting for our profession.

 

How does knowing a Principal Quantum Number, Angular Momentum, Magnetic Quantum Number, or Electron Spin Number (in Gen Chem 1) help a person with medicine? One semester of Organic Chemistry allows one to learn the basis of organic reactions which is far more important to disease process and pharmacology. I would definitely scrap any requirement of general chemistry and instead include one semester of Organic Chemistry and one semester of Biochemistry or Cellular Biology. They are far more applicible to a complete understanding of human biology and pharmacology, while General Chemistry does not achieve that.

 

I would certainly replace Gen Chem with microbiology. Microbiolgy is far more applicable to one's knowledge of bacteriology, virology, and the study of yeast. In the micro courses that I tutor we spend a great deal of time on bacteriology, gram staining, differences in cell walls, why/how antibiotics works, horizontal gene transfer, bacterial resistance, fomites, HAIs, viruses, antivirals, fungus, antifungals, etc. The students come away with a strong appreciation and knowledge for the differences of bacteria vs virus vs yeast and the ways to differentiate them and treat them. We always ask the question, "why do antibiotics not work on fungal infections?" and they are able to answer prokaryotic vs eukaryotic. They can do the same for antibiotics vs viral by understanding where viruses work and how/where antibiotics do their jobs. This is vital for clinical knowledge while Principal Quantum Number, Angular Momentum, Magnetic Quantum Number, or Electron Spin Number don't.

[LESH]

 

Some will say, the program is trying to educate PAs that can meet the demographics of a specific area.  That is a good idea.  But, research suggests only 40% of med school graduates work in the state in which they graduate.  How many stay in the community where the school is located?  We see similarities in the PA profession.

 

 

Some will say that because it is true. According to the California Office of Statewide Health Planning and Development (OSHPD)Spanish speaking patients make up a large majority of ESL patient encounters for California PA students. Most of the FQHCs, RHCs, CHCs and MHCs where California PA students do primary care rotations prefer students that can speak "some" Spanish. Those facilities make up a significant number of clinical training sites used by PA programs. IMHO for California programs it makes sense to have this as a requirement. As far as retention,>40% of California  PA graduates stay in state to practice. Again according to OSHPD data its approximately 85-90% the last time I looked.

[G. Davenport]

Hmm. You have to take General Chem to take organic and in most places organic to take biochem. Where do you draw the line between prepared to enter PA school and what a PA program should teach? Let's add calculus based physics too.

 

I'm sure you will do well with your perpetration as you enter training. But, a line in the sand must be drawn and considering where to place it requires a thorough understanding of PA curriculum and accreditation mandates.

 

Good times and good discussion.

[MedicinePower]

Hmm. You have to take General Chem to take organic and in most places organic to take biochem. Where do you draw the line between prepared to enter PA school and what a PA program should teach? Let's add calculus based physics too.

 

I'm sure you will do well with your perpetration as you enter training. But, a line in the sand must be drawn and considering where to place it requires an understanding of PA curriculum and accreditation mandates.

 

Good times and good discussion.

 

True but it's a myth that one has to take gen chem in order to understand orgo. I know students who have taken orgo 1 and gen chem 1 simultaneously and wonder why they are doing so well in orgo without having any gen chem knowledge. They then realize the myth.

 

Calc based physics for PA school? O.o

[fakingpatience]

While there is no doubt fluency in Spanish would be invaluable for a PA in certain areas, is 1 year of Spanish really going to make a difference enough that it should be a requirement?   Yes, you'll be able to ask the patient questions to do an assessment, but will you have enough Spanish to understand their answers?  And then what are the schools provisions for a prospective student who can prove competency in Spanish with out taking the year of college class?

[G. Davenport]

And just FYI I have had calculus based physics, differential equations, most chemistry, and bio.

 

But the smartest people in my PA class were paramedics, nurses, and so one. None had more than one gen chem course. They all had clinical experience which seemed to help more than prior science training.

 

I was a military Survival, evasion, resistance, and escape (SERE) specialist. I didn't know much

[whoRyou]

True but it's a myth that one has to take gen chem in order to understand orgo. I know students who have taken orgo 1 and gen chem 1 simultaneously and wonder why they are doing so well in orgo without having any gen chem knowledge. They then realize the myth.

 

Calc based physics for PA school? O.o

OK maybe it's late, but am I missing something here? What myth?

[MedicinePower]

OK maybe it's late, but am I missing something here? What myth?

It's a myth that one needs to take gen chem before orgo chem.

[EMEDPA]

EMEDPA, my friend ;-), do you really think physics, microbiology, and psych should be required?  Also, math and writing are part of core curriculum at most all institutions so no need to require them.  Can't say its evident based on some graduate papers I've read but it is required.  

 

Since our discussions and this board discussion I was re-evaluating the whole organic chemistry requirement and lean toward it NOT being required to enter a PA program.  but I don't agree physics and psych.  For me, this is what I have decided should be industry wide.  Just my opinion.  

 

1.  A and P - two classes either together or one of each separate

2.  General biology - two classes with lab

3.  General chemistry - two classes with lab (i still think labs have some value here)

4.  Statistics

5.  Medical terminology (waived when appropriate)

 

These foundations allow us to teach the rest.  Also, PA programs are required to teach genetics, ethics, microbiology, etc. so there is no reason to make students take these as a prerequisite.  They should learn it relevant to medical practice.  Heck, these aren't required for med school entry.  etc. etc.

 

So, I like this honed concept.  I am sure some won't.  and that is fine.  But it would be nice if programs could agree on a foundation related to entry requirements.  It would be fitting for our profession.

I'm ok with your list(dropping psych, physics, and writing) as long as there is an essay day of interview. being able to write a paragraph that makes sense is important and not a skill taught in PA school. I say "day of interview essay" both because my program did it and because many folks have significant "help" with their PA school essays(some even pay others to write it).

[whoRyou]

It's a myth that one needs to take gen chem before orgo chem.

[cinntsp]

While there is no doubt fluency in Spanish would be invaluable for a PA in certain areas, is 1 year of Spanish really going to make a difference enough that it should be a requirement?   Yes, you'll be able to ask the patient questions to do an assessment, but will you have enough Spanish to understand their answers?  And then what are the schools provisions for a prospective student who can prove competency in Spanish with out taking the year of college class?

 

Agreed.  Plus...half of the country's PA programs will be off limits to non-speakers if it's used as a requirement because of particular demographics.

[G. Davenport]

I'm ok with your list(dropping psych, physics, and writing) as long as there is an essay day of interview. being able to write a paragraph that makes sense is important and not a skill taught in PA school. I say "day of interview essay" both because my program did it and because many folks have significant "help" with their PA school essays(some even pay others to write it).

 

Of course.  In fact, I am against a 'personal statement' requirement as part of the application because you just don't know who wrote it and they often read like a harlequin romance.  Many are edited and written here on this forum ... a place where people advocate embellishment and push the author to a goal not a story.  

 

I believe you determine who to interview based on pre-requisites.  The stories need to be told at the time of the interview where they have more value (if told at all).  

 

As for writing skills, I also believe applicants should write a 30 minute argumentative paper on the interview day (hand written).  This serves many purposes -- one is ability to write a sentence.  It surprises me how many college graduates can't do this.  

[carlyb117]

Does anyone have suggestions about where to take medical terminology? I was a bio major in college, so I dont feel like I actually need this course, but some schools require it. I was looking at UCSD extension school online. Has anyone done that course before? 

[Maynard]

Does anyone have suggestions about where to take medical terminology? I was a bio major in college, so I dont feel like I actually need this course, but some schools require it. I was looking at UCSD extension school online. Has anyone done that course before? 

I took MEDT at University of New England and found the class to be straightforward and manageable: just memorize everything he goes over in lecture until you know it cold. It's not necessarily the best choice if you want something economical.

 

Another factor to consider is that some of these online courses (including UNE's) allow you to go at your own pace. This way you're not obligated to enroll in January to cover prereqs for schools you haven't even interviewed at. I was wait listed at a school that requires MEDT and put the class off, hoping the school would give me an update I could act on. About a month before the school's prereq deadline, I took the entire class in 2 weeks with intensive studying and finished with an A.