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G. Davenport

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G. Davenport last won the day on September 13 2014

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About G. Davenport

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    Physician Associate

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  1. G. Davenport

    New DMSc program in Oregon

    HI all, I am the one who is behind the GFU doctorate and there is good reason for correcting this issue. First, you need to understand that academic awards are based on regional accreditation. Here is what the Northwest Commission on Colleges and Universities states: Degree Levels Associate A lower division undergraduate degree normally representing two years (approximately 60 semester credits or 90 quarter units) of lower‐division collegiate study, or its equivalent in depth and quality of learning experience. Baccalaureate An undergraduate degree normally representing four years (approximately 120 semester credits or 180 quarter credits) of upper‐ and lower‐division collegiate study, or its equivalent in depth and quality of learning experience. Masters A graduate degree representing approximately 30 semester credits or 45 quarter credits of post‐baccalaureate study, or its equivalent in depth and quality. Doctorate A terminal degree representing three or more years [90 SH] of graduate study that prepares the recipient to conduct original research, engage in scholarship, create artistic expressions of human emotions, or apply knowledge to practice. -- The type of degree awarded has nothing to do with the practice as a PA. That is governed by the state medical board and legislation. It does have everything to do with standards of regional accreditation. It is not degree creep, it doesn't change what needs to be done. It is simply applying the standards of regional accreditation and academic aptitude. oh, and the degree is a doctor of medical science. Not PA Medicine. And the tuition cost is similar to all regional costs (extrapolated out to 2021); the program has no fees. And finally, I was a "certified PA." Please don't get caught up in the falsehood of degree creep or thinking the university makes more doing this. Neither are true. The cost is the same. In fact, it is easier for me to build a Master's degree. But, I am an academic and I intend to pursue a program that meets regional accreditation standards as listed above. Hope this helps. Greg
  2. G. Davenport

    Do I have a shot at all?

    One more thing. The courses you listed are typical for med school. Pa programs rarely require physics. Many don't require organic. Best to look at the programs you are considering to see what they require. For example, we require genetics and microbiology in addition to a and p, chemistry, and biology. Again. Good luck. Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
  3. G. Davenport

    Do I have a shot at all?

    Sorry to be blunt but it is highly unlikely you will get into a program with the grades you listed. PA school is a medical school (slightly shorter but very similar) with no residency expectation after you graduate. The competition is tough. On average the cumulative GPA is mid to high 3 (3.5 to 3.6) and the pre-requisites science cumulative is also 3.5 or higher. To be interviewed you have to be academically competitive. Best advice is to retake every course (pre-requisites) with a B- or lower. Simply stating you did poorly because you were busy won't do it. Good luck. Sent from my XT1254 using Tapatalk
  4. G. Davenport

    New PA Program in Upstate SC

    Hi Iccalbert, I will refer you to the ARC-PA FAQ page related to a program with Accreditation-Provisional. The page is: http://www.arc-pa.org/frequently-asked-questions/student-questions/ and it states, "Provisional accreditation is an active accreditation status... in order to be eligible to take the PANCE, students must successfully complete a program that was accredited at the time the student matriculated... " in other words, if the program has accreditation-provisional when you matriculate you are eligible to sit for the PANCE (provided you successfully complete the program). I hope this helps. No matter what you decide, good luck in your pursuits. The North Greenville University Physician Assistant Program has applied for Accreditation – Provisional from the Accreditation Review Commission on Education for a proposed Physician Assistant (ARC-PA). The North Greenville University Physician Assistant Program anticipates matriculating its first class in January 2017, pending receipt of Accreditation – Provisional by the ARC-PA in September 2016 of ARC-PA commission meeting. Accreditation-Provisional is an accreditation status for a new PA program that has not yet enrolled students, but at the time of its initial accreditation review, has demonstrated its preparedness to initiate a program in accordance with the accreditation standards. The program will not commence in the event that this provisional accreditation is not received.
  5. Hi all, just wanted to let you know that North Greenville University PA program is taking applications through CASPA. If you are interested, check us out at http://www.ngu.edu/pa-medicine.php. Greg Dr. Gregory Davenport Dean for the Graduate School of Health Sciences Program Director for the Department of PA Medicine 1400 Locust Hill Road Greer, SC 29561 Phone: (864) 663-0275 E-Mail: gdavenport@ngu.edu The North Greenville University Physician Assistant Program has applied for Accreditation – Provisional from the Accreditation Review Commission on Education for a proposed Physician Assistant (ARC-PA). The North Greenville University Physician Assistant Program anticipates matriculating its first class in January 2017, pending receipt of Accreditation – Provisional by the ARC-PA in September 2016 of ARC-PA commission meeting. Accreditation-Provisional is an accreditation status for a new PA program that has not yet enrolled students, but at the time of its initial accreditation review, has demonstrated its preparedness to initiate a program in accordance with the accreditation standards. The program will not commence in the event that this provisional accreditation is not received.
  6. G. Davenport

    For PAs making >130k/yr

    My friend. Although I have worked in the places you describe, YOU are sick. Hmm, maybe it is the 10 years of so that I have on you. Or it could be my two sets of twins ages 8 and 6. Nah, you're just sick! And to think we have hiked together, how do you find the time? Greg
  7. G. Davenport

    For PAs making >130k/yr

    Wow, I find this a very interesting topic. Perhaps a topic of youth. At 56, I prefer to identify with how much time I spend with my family and what was the last hike I went on. Of course, I understand the question was specific and simply being answered. I once made big money in practice. But I missed birthdays, holidays, and worked while sick. It simply isn't worth it. If I were seeking a new job, I would look for balance between life, family, and needed income and seek longevity which equals survival. It is hard to survive 200 plus hours a month or 12 hour shifts with no breaks, no lunch and every patient ticked off due to a five hour wait. Just my opinion. Seek that balance. Smile and capture life. Enjoy! BTW, I am hiring faculty now :-)
  8. G. Davenport

    Doctoral Degree for PAs

    Thank you again for the discussion LESH. In reply, I must say, however, that your concerns have not materialized. It appears our profession is the limiting player, not the regional accreditation body. Speculation only goes so far. The best answer comes from the subject matter experts. Also, the doctorate option is just that, it does not force the profession (as a whole) to convert. The world isn't that black and white. Again, good debate, good discussion. Thanks. G
  9. G. Davenport

    Doctoral Degree for PAs

    HI LESH, You pose an excellent question. I have had preliminary discussions with people heavily involved in my regional accreditation area. According to them, if the change is simply a degree status, program faculty would be able to remain as it had before. I will, however, need to do much more research on this specific question before I can give a definitive answer. This includes a thorough review of the regional accreditation bylaws and mandates. Excellent question. G
  10. G. Davenport

    Doctoral Degree for PAs

    There is always so much emotion in this topic. This emotion almost always leads to speculation that may or may not have data to support it. As a PA and Dean, I prefer to approach this from topic based on research. Also, I DO NOT look at it as a (1) degree creep or (2) method for increased university revenue. So, before I provide research data on this topic let me talk for a minute about the author, me. In 1993 I completed PA training at MEDEX NW and was certified in the field. I had no degree (bachelor or otherwise). I firmly believe the field is competency based and did not agree with moving to a graduate degree. But we made the move. I don't agree with how the move was made. I believe a PA graduate program NEVER met criteria for a Master's degree. I believe it always met criteria for a doctorate. Given this, I am not proposing any change in our present program structure, pre-requisites, curriculum, cost, or outcomes. My thoughts are simple. If we are a graduate program, we should award (or allow programs the option to award) an appropriate graduate degree and that is a Doctorate. My supporting argument follows: Introduction Based on academic workload alone, PA graduates have earned a doctorate degree (not to be confused with a Medical Doctorate or Doctor of Osteopathic medicine degree). Note: Regardless of the degree earned, it would NOT change state law or medical board mandates or pose a threat to the physician/PA relationship. This is about academics, not status in an exam room. This is about awarding the level of degree a student earns. Quick PA Certification to Degree History PA education is a competency-based concept that prepares health care professionals to qualify and pass the national certifying examination to meet state licensing board requirements. In its early years it was considered a certification process and graduates were NOT awarded any academic degree. In 1970, Alderson Broaddus College awarded the first PA academic degree based on 2 years of general college and a 2 years professional phase. In 1973 the University of Colorado’s Child/Health Associate PA program awarded the first PA master’s degree. Presently, programs accredited prior to 2013 – that do not currently offer a graduate degree – must transition to conferring a graduate degree before the 2020 cohort matriculates (ARC-PA’s Accreditation Manual, 4th Edition, 2014). ARC-PA Wordage on the Graduate Degree Accreditation Manual, 4th Edition (December 2013) ARC-PAs Accreditation Manual, 4th edition (under the ‘Introduction’ heading, page 17), states, “Institutions that sponsor PA programs are expected to incorporate this higher level of academic rigor into their programs and award an appropriate master’s degree.” This is more specific than what is found under the ‘Eligibility’ section. ARC-PAs Accreditation Manual, 4th edition (under the ‘Eligibility’ heading, page 18), states.[The institution] must be accredited by a recognized regional accrediting agency and must be authorized by this agency to confer upon graduates of the PA program a graduate degree. Sponsoring institutions applying for provisional accreditation of a new PA program must be accredited by, and in good standing with, a recognized regional accrediting agency and must be authorized by that agency to confer upon graduates of the PA program a graduate degree. ARC-PA Accreditation Manual, 4th Edition (under the ‘Program Review’ heading, page 18), states, “Accreditation of PA programs is a process initiated by the sponsoring institution. It includes a comprehensive review of the program relative to the Standards and it is the responsibility of the PA program to demonstrate its compliance with the Standards. Accreditation decisions are based on the ARC-PA’s evaluation of information contained in the accreditation application, the report of site visit evaluation teams, any additional requested reports or documents submitted to the ARC-PA by the program and the program’s accreditation history. ARC-PA Accreditation Manual, 4th Edition (under the ‘Standards Degree Issue Clarification’ heading, page 18), states,All students who matriculate into any currently accredited PA programs after December 31, 2020 will be awarded a graduate (master’s) degree upon successful completion of their PA curriculum and graduate degree requirements. (The definition of “matriculate” is to enroll or register. Thus, students who matriculate after December 31, 2020 are those who first enroll or register in PA coursework on or after January 1, 2021) Currently accredited PA programs sponsored by institutions that can, but at present are not awarding a graduate degree, will be diligently working toward compliance with the degree requirement, within the institution, state and regional accreditation bodies, as appropriate. The institution should work within its framework to evaluate the PA program curriculum and adjust it as necessary for suitability, such that the institution will be able to confer a graduate degree to PA students who matriculate after December 31, 2020 and successfully complete the PA program. ARC-PA Policies ARC-PA Policies, Version 6 (01.15.14), states, “ARC-PA is the recognized accrediting agency for Physician Assistant entry-level program education leading to the professional credential (PA) and provides accreditation services to institutions that sponsor PA programs.” What the Words Mean The crux to ARC-PA’s stance on this issue is most likely seen when they apply the word, “master’s” in parenthesis between graduate and degree (in the ‘Standards Degree Issue Clarification’). They also refer to a “master’s degree” in the introduction to the accreditation manual (pg. 17). Elsewhere, however, the wordage is more liberal, stating the institution must qualify to award a graduate degree. Ultimately, ARC-PA accredits an institution-based on compliance with standards (see ‘program review’ on preceding page). The question, therefore, must be, is the master’s degree a limiting standard for PA program accreditation? If it is, then this conversation is moot. PAEA Stance on PA Doctorate This issue cannot be considered without also looking at the Physician Assistant Education Association stance of the PA doctorate. In 2009, PAEA was asked, “[is] the clinical doctorate appropriate as an entry-level [PA] degree, as a postgraduate degree, or not at all.” PAEA response was, “The PA educational model has adapted over 40 years to produce PAs who provide high quality, cost-effective, patient-centered care. Both physicians and PAs practice in the domain of medicine; therefore, the entry-level doctorate for the practice of medicine is the MD/DO. Almost all PA programs now award a master’s degree or are planning to.” A memorandum related to the 2009 forum stated, “Accordingly at the Education Forum in November 2009, PAEA adopted two position policies, which were consistent with the recommendations from the summit. These position policies specifically state that 1) PAEA endorses the master’s degree as the entry-level and terminal degree of the profession; and 2) PAEA opposes the entry-level doctorate for physician assistant.” Should PA Education Seek a Doctorate Option (In Addition to the Master’s Degree) Typical Master’s Degree Most master’s degree programs average 30 and 36 semester hours of academic workload. Healthcare degrees, however, can often be more. For example: Typical Academic Workload for a Master’s Degree in Healthcare The University of South Carolina master’s degree in Acute Care Nurse Practitioner – 37 Semester Hours The University of South Carolina master’s degree in Primary Care Family Nurse Practitioner – 45 Semester Hours The University of South Carolina master’s degree in Public Health – 42 The Clemson University’s master degree in Family Nurse Practitioner – 46 Semester Hours The Clemson University’s master degree in Adult/Gerontology Nurse Practitioner – 49 Semester Hours The Loma Linda University master’s degree in Rehabilitation – 42 Semester Hours Clearly, PA education far exceeds the typical healthcare master’s degree program. Why PA Education Meets the Doctorate Muster According to ARC-PA’s website there are 187 accredited programs. To determine statistical significance related to academic workload, a quick Internet search was performed and the following table created. An academic workload threshold of 120 semester hours was set and the search was stopped when 10% of programs supported this value or higher (19 programs). This is significant given that the average academic work load for the before mentioned health care related master’s degrees is 43.5 semester hours. To put this into perspective, the PA programs listed here carry an academic load that is 2.8 times that of almost all other health related master’s degrees. School Semester Hours Bethel University 147 University of Oklahoma College of Medicine 139 Keiser University 138 UNT Health Science Center 134 Methodist University 131 Pacific University 131 Mercer University 128 Marquette University 128 University of Arkansas Medical Sciences 128 Touro College 127 Emory University 126 Murphy Deming College of Health Science 126 University of Nebraska 123 Georgia Regents University 122 University of South Alabama 121 Campbell University 120 University of Maryland 120 Idaho State University 120 Heritage University 120 The next step in this evaluation was to consider how the PAs academic workload and education complexity compared to other non-physician doctorate programs. The following list outlines similar doctorate programs in health care. Each has an equal or significantly less academic workload. In addition, it should be noted that most, like the PA, work with physicians and are regulated by a governing board and state laws. Typical Academic Workload for a Doctorate in Healthcare The South Carolina College of Pharmacy Doctorate of Pharmacy – 146 Semester Hours The University of South Carolina Doctor of Physical Therapy – 124 Semester Hours The University of South Carolina Doctor of Nurse Practitioner – 75 Semester Hours The Medical School of South Carolina PhD in Nursing – 62 Semester Hours Each of the preceding examples is bachelor to doctorate options (no master’s degree required). To help put this into perspective, minimum standards for a PhD at Clemson and the University of South Carolina were reviewed. In both instances, these requirements are much less than all operational PA programs. Granted these degrees are research and not applied doctorates but the significance of relevant academic workload cannot be overlooked. Typical Academic Workload for a Doctor of Philosophy Degree (PhD) At Clemson, the minimum requirement for a PhD is 65 Semester Hours post baccalaureate degree. At the University of South Carolina, the minimum requirement for a PhD is 60 Semester Hours post baccalaureate degree. Closing Remarks In summary, this document supports a doctorate option for PA programs while suggesting no change to the existing pre-requisites, curriculum, cost, or outcomes. The option would not impact state laws or medical board mandates on PA practice and would not change the physician/PA relationship. It simply respects the work done and degree earned. Above all things, a PA program seeking doctorate status MUST meet regional accreditation criteria and fulfill all ARC-PA standards to operate. Please do NOT let words on a diploma hold the PA’s academic accomplishments hostage. These words do not and will not compromise the strong and longstanding physician/PA practice. NOTE During the upcoming PAEA annual conference, PAEA will debate the doctorate option on October 16, 2014 (Thursday) and vote to re-affirm the 2009 memorandum (supporting the Master’s degree and opposing the Doctorate degree) on Saturday October 18, 2014 (during the PAEA business meeting). If you are a voting member, you should let your voice be heard. Finally, please, I ask all parties concerned to be civil about this debate and to use this time to work together. OK….
  11. G. Davenport

    Elon University PA Program

    SSmith. Elon is a great program. I have (and will again in late October) lectured on environmental injuries there. Good luck. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  12. G. Davenport

    New pa program in nc

    EMEDPA, North Greenville University is in SC.
  13. G. Davenport

    Should I just stick to nursing?

    BSN to MSN makes no sense when you can go from BSN to DNP for about 70 SH (and in some cases less). MSN to DNP will only reduce that 70 by about 10 to 15 SH. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  14. G. Davenport

    Questions to ask new PA program?

    Just be careful so as to not come across smug. Ok to ask. Good to ask. But ask like you want the answer instead of waiting to hear what you think the answer should be. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
  15. It's really about management. If they use drugs that potentials opiate treatment, how can you manage it? I would terminate treatment for any threat to include benzodiazepine, amphetamines, other opiates, street drugs, etc. But that's just me. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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