new program not what I expected and I want out

[just_me]

So you guys brought a situation to their attention, they handled it inconspicously and youre mad because they didnt tell when, how they were going to handle it?

 

You do know in situations where someone can be dangerous and attack, it is best to do it inconspicously because if you draw too much attention, much liked a scared dog backed into a corner, they could snap and attack. Just because they didnt announce it over the intercom, pass out fliers or rush in guns blazing....doesnt mean they handled it incorrectly.....they just didnt do it the way YOU wanted to them to do it.

 

And seriously...quit saying people WILL get kicked out for reporting uethical behavor because thats simply not the case. A school cant focus on just getting your money AND kicking people out over honesty....pick one and stick to it.

[ugh]

So you guys brought a situation to their attention, they handled it inconspicously and youre mad because they didnt tell when, how they were going to handle it?

 

You do know in situations where someone can be dangerous and attack, it is best to do it inconspicously because if you draw too much attention, much liked a scared dog backed into a corner, they could snap and attack. Just because they didnt announce it over the intercom, pass out fliers or rush in guns blazing....doesnt mean they handled it incorrectly.....they just didnt do it the way YOU wanted to them to do it.

 

And seriously...quit saying people WILL get kicked out for reporting uethical behavor because thats simply not the case. A school cant focus on just getting your money AND kicking people out over honesty....pick one and stick to it.

 

No, you're wrong. You had to have been there, and again there's things you do not know. Believe what you want to believe. I simply do not care anymore.

[just_me]

Youre right.....I can only draw my conclusion from the things you have said....in order for someone to fully understand either they need the whole story or you just keep it all to yourself.

 

You cant give people 1/4 of a story and expect them to feel the same way you do about a stituation. Whithout the facts you come off as a complaining, bitter person. This of course may not be the case at all BUT with only a piece of a story, everything else is left up to interpretation

 

No, you're wrong. You had to have been there, and again there's things you do not know. Believe what you want to believe. I simply do not care anymore.

[ugh]

Youre right.....I can only draw my conclusion from the things you have said....in order for someone to fully understand either they need the whole story or you just keep it all to yourself.

 

You cant give people 1/4 of a story and expect them to feel the same way you do about a stituation. Whithout the facts you come off as a complaining, bitter person. This of course may not be the case at all BUT with only a piece of a story, everything else is left up to interpretation

 

Yes, you're right. People can't draw the appropriate conclusion without all the facts. What happened at my school no longer belongs in these blogs. I guess I am bitter not just about that situation but that I was so naieve, and I always want to believe that most people and things are good. So, maybe I'm mad at myself about being so "gullible." When I read blogs like this or when people tell me in person about their bad experience in school I think that they're just bitter and immature and could not handle the curriculum, etc. I actually thought one person talking to me was crazy. I'm the type of person who has to see it to believe it (i.e. I'm not going to assume a school is bad because a student is telling me about his or her bad experience). But, when SO MANY people said the same thing that should've raised a red flag. How would I have known that what these people said was exactly true. What they were saying seemed almost too weird to be true and therefore just blew it off. But, they really were right, and it blows me away that with all that I saw and what previous students have experienced that the school is still open. I really don't want anyone to make the mistakes I made, and I realize I come across as complaining and bitter. I'm mad at myself for not listening.

 

If you read the stuff in papers or watch the news you will see that the people who bring awareness of wrongdoing in an organization even if they're hired to do exactly that are the ones who get fired. It sounds so stupid and it doesn't make sense to me because overall you're helping everyoone, including the organization. This happens in schools too. Just want the person who made the original post to be careful. I would hate for him or her to lose the opportunity to realize their dream. More than likely the school knows the professors are being intimidating and they are probably aware of the students cheating. Why this is allowed is anyone's guess. But the person who exposes it will be the one who suffers, ok not always, but better to be on the cautious side. We were videotaped during our exams so it would've been hard for anyone to cheat. I was in a class with a bunch of great people who helped each other. And, overall our professors were great people. It really was the people at the top who were mandating that the curriculum, etc be a certain way. W all felt bad for the dean and the professors because they were placed between a rock and a hard place.

[ugh]

Your advice is awful. You are telling someone who might later have people's lives in their hands to a) be unethical, and b) be a coward.

 

Which means that you are probably an unethical coward. Congrats. I think I like you least of all the people I have met on this board.

 

I worked with a man at a hospital who witnessed purposeful criminal behavior that harmed patients. He called the anonymous tip line that the hospital has to report this kind of behavior. The first thing they said to him was that the hospital could find out who he was and there could be ramifications for him, including termination and asked him if he wanted to continue reporting the doctor. He decided to report the incidents anyway. Guess what happened to the doctor? Nothing. There was a resident at a hospital who reported the abuse of residents (violation of the 80 hr work-week, not just by a few hours either) to a committee. Guess what happened? The resident was thrown out of his residency. There are endless stories like this. I'm not telling this person to be unethical or be a coward, but to be careful about what you decide to expose and how and when. Most PA programs are small so the school is probably aware of the issues he's talking about but they are not being addressed for some reason. Better for him to just stay out of this. You're a law student, right? You of all people should know that this is what happens MOST of the time, and this idealic "be good and nothing will happen to you" is just not the case. It's unethical that the hospital allowed this man to practice medicine, and it's unethical that this resident was thrown out of his residency because the hospital was not obeying a mandated 80 hr work week. No one should ever let a patient's life/care be jeopardized. It's the people who see this happen that are frustrated because they sometimes feel helpless about situations and WANT to help.

 

Looks like you're early on in your law school degreee. I think you will see what I am talking about when you get closer to graduating and are practicing. Maybe you'll be one of those lawyers who tells the hospital to fire such and such an employee for telling the truth. How are you going to feel when that person gets fired because they were trying to help a patient?

[Magicnubs]

That doesnt keep people from talking aboutit. One place I intreviewed riiiiiiiiight at the tail end of the interview one student said "hey make sure you guys keep your grades to yourself. if a person is asking what received you get on a test its either the make themselves feel better because they did just as bad or they want to feel better because they did better than you" that left a bad taste in my mouth that she would find her classmates so competitive. I also didnt think it was something worth talking about in an interview...anywho, this school is also pass/fail. While the class has no official ranking you do receive actual grades on tests.

Yeah, I guess you're right. Hopefully it helps keep it to a minimum though. :) All the students interviewed seemed pleased. Our adviser actually preemptively left the room (and believe me, you can't hear through the door or walls in the newly built medical school) so they could be honest, and there were quite a few questions like: "what don't you like?" or "what would you change?".

[Contrarian]

"This one time at Band-camp"...:heheh:

 

A lot of this sounds remarkably similar to the stuff my eldest daughter used to write about or try to convince us of when she was a 8th grader.

 

I'm just glad that I attended back when it was still considered "adult education" so didn't have to pay 80k in tuition to sit through 24 months of "kiddie-drama"...

 

Carry on....

 

Contrarian

[ohiovolffemtp]

The devil is in the details. Getting to the actual details is very difficult. Without having the facts investigated thoroughly it's not possible to know whether allegations represent actual misconduct, disagreements between individuals, misunderstandings, attempts at "getting back" at someone, etc. I've seen all of the above, usually in combination, as a corporate manager, fire officer, and college professor. That's why HR processes are usually slow and should have safeguards built in for all parties. However, if there are no processes to trigger outside investigations, it's guaranteed that problems will get very serious before they're addressed.

 

There's not enough data to evaluate these particular situations. So, our comments show more about our biases than good advice to these posters on how to respond.

[PA4me2010!]

How new is the program? Are you part of the first class?

New programs are like anything that's starting out. It has flaws. If they are not accredited, they will be going through accreditation and if stuff is going on, it will definitely come out during the interviews.

I am a person of integrity. That is my character and that's what I believe. If people are cheating, I have a personal obligation to tell. That's just me. I am definitely a person that believes if I do the right thing, my life will reflect whatever I do. What I mean is that if I end up getting fired from a job because I am doing something right, I will have something even better in store for me.

Unfortunately, the profession is going away from it's original purpose. A lot of programs no longer require experience and with that you will have a younger generation coming applying and getting accepted. Young people, not all but a lot, do not have the life experience to handle some situations and that leads to bickering and drama. I'm dealing with some of that now. I remember that they are young, and that I bust my butt to get here and nothing is going to stop me.

It's a personal choice if you stay or if you go. How do you know that the level of education is poor? I think that will be determined by your clinical experience. If you can't figure simple diagnoses then, yeah, the education is poor.

[Contrarian]

It's a personal choice if you stay or if you go. How do you know that the level of education is poor? I think that will be determined by your clinical experience. If you can't figure simple diagnoses then, yeah, the education is poor.

 

Sort of...

 

Thing is...you also have to account for the FACT that its suppose to be "adult-education" which requires a enhanced level of taking personal responsibility for one's learning.

 

Every program, new or old, is gonna present the minimum info required to pass the PANCE and practice safely as a PA-C with physician supervision ... according to the blueprint necessary to attain and maintain accreditation. At this same time... every program is also likely trying teach/instill the importance of "self-directed"..."lifelong learning" from the onset/day-one of class.

 

It has been my experience that MOST (not all) of the kids complaining about how sucky a program is are usually the ones who don't under/OVERstand the concept of "adult-education" and therefore expect "spoon-feeding"... or those who are still in the high-school mindset where they haven't really realized that they came to the program alone... will ultimately leave alone and are solely responsible for their success.

 

The funny part about this is that when reportedly sucky programs are researched, it is usually found that the majority of the students in the class had very little trouble passing the PANCE. Which usually means that the program did their part and disseminated the correct info...and that the complaining parties were likely focussed on personality, form or style clashes versus content.

 

Program faculty are simply "guides"... there to point out the minimum information the students should master to become a respected colleague... :wink:

 

Contrarian

[ugh]

Sort of...

 

Thing is...you also have to account for the FACT that its suppose to be "adult-education" which requires a enhanced level of taking personal responsibility for one's learning.

 

Every program, new or old, is gonna present the minimum info required to pass the PANCE and practice safely as a PA-C with physician supervision ... according to the blueprint necessary to attain and maintain accreditation. At this same time... every program is also likely trying teach/instill the importance of "self-directed"..."lifelong learning" from the onset/day-one of class.

 

It has been my experience that MOST (not all) of the kids complaining about how sucky a program is are usually the ones who don't under/OVERstand the concept of "adult-education" and therefore expect "spoon-feeding"... or those who are still in the high-school mindset where they haven't really realized that they came to the program alone... will ultimately leave alone and are solely responsible for their success.

 

The funny part about this is that when reportedly sucky programs are researched, it is usually found that the majority of the students in the class had very little trouble passing the PANCE. Which usually means that the program did their part and disseminated the correct info...and that the complaining parties were likely focussed on personality, form or style clashes versus content.

 

Program faculty are simply "guides"... there to point out the minimum information the students should master to become a respected colleague... :wink:

 

Contrarian

 

I would normally believe that too and I didn't want to post anything anymore on this site, but it seems you just don't get that a school can be in the wrong. Automatically you assume people who complain are just not "adult" enough.

 

We had a professor who was a blatant fraud (i.e. it was not possible that he had the degrees he had). Most of what he taught was incorrect and we never knew what to believe when we went to class. It happens in a lot of places and I even had some preceptors telling me about their own experiences in medical school. The class before us complained non-stop and the dean decreased the number of classes this professor taught. During our didactic year we got a lot of excuses until the dean finally got the 300th complaint. A student pointed out the inaccuracies in this professors lecture and the dean actually said to the student that he was concerned about this. The professor was immediately removed from this module and later terminated. I am happy that the dean, who is incredibly hard-working and passionate about education and this profession (without him this program would not have survived) finally took action. I am sure it was difficult for him to do this but he DID take action because he finally realized that this was no longer acceptable, regardless of what was happening behind closed doors (he did tell us that we didn't know what was going on behind closed doors---he was stuck). We were "adult" enough to bring these issues up to the dean on several occasions because we were concerned about causing harm to patients. Is that a childish concern according to your "adult" mind-set?

 

The PANCE rate IS very high at my former school AND we still had an absolutely terrible professor who taught us wrong information. So, why do you have such a hard time believing that schools can be in the wrong? Do you really think the school is not responsible to teach us the correct information? Do you really think that only students are in the wrong. Students are blamed because they're powerless. Professors are human and no one is perfect. We all screw up. But when it's OBVIOUS someone is not qualified to teach then something needs to be done. It's almost like you're in some sort of denial that someone besides the student can be in the wrong? This is how a lot of medical mistakes are made in hospitals. People are scared to say that someone above them is making a mistake. It happened to me on 2 of my rotations. I picked up on something that the doctor missed (one was immediately life-threatening and the other was still life-threatening but not immediately). I got nothing but a stern glare from the physician on one rotation, and with the 2nd rotation after we determined what was wrong (because I didn't blow off the pt like the doctor is "known" to do by the staff, and bothered to dig deeper) the preceptor immediately asked me for my evaluation and gave me a bad grade. For what? For finding out what was wrong with this patient? Both of the physicians had egos and the one should not be practicing medicine (according to me and all my classmates who had this preceptor). I didnt' get a pat on the back or even a thank you (don't need it)...I got a punishment. I can't say I think this is typical, but that it happens because people have egos and are insecure. So who's the "adult" in this situation and who is acting like the "child?" Who is cheating in this situation?

 

It seems like the "adults" are the ones who realize that lots of people can be in the right and wrong. It's just not a one-way street all the time. Maybe us "kids" who complained are going to be the best PA's and will actually be the ones who help patients because we bothered to say something and took a risk.

[just_me]

It seems like the "adults" are the ones who realize that lots of people can be in the right and wrong. It's just not a one-way street all the time. Maybe us "kids" who complained are going to be the best PA's and will actually be the ones who help patients because we bothered to say something and took a risk.

 

Whadda ya mean "us"?!?!?

 

A few posts up you were demanding the OP keep their mouth shut and not complain to anyone. Either you have a backbone or not. You say keep your mouth shut or get kicked out of school....what do you say to the PA-C who wants to confront thier employer? Will you advise them to keep thier mouth shut or lose their job?

 

How can you claim to be that person who will "take a risk" yet advise people not to do the same?

[Boatswain2PA]

But, here's some advice: don't go to the Dean. the Dean doesn't give a damn. The Dean is there to make sure the school makes money. And, if professors are always trying to be intimidating they will get their turn. Fortunately, my class was not the backstabbing type, and although I liked the dean in our program it was the people above him who were forcing him to do things that disregarded our education. Sometimes the dean is just stuck and going to that person is NOT going to do anything for you but get you on a list to get kicked out. Also, if anyone is cheating you are NOT obligated to report them. It's the ScHOOL"S responsiblity to ensure students aren't cheating, and if they can't manage to do that that's THEIR problem. Reporting your classmates is only going to get you in trouble with that individual, and you don't know what people are capable of.

 

Ugh - if you do quit the medical field (and I hope you do), PLEASE do not go into counseling as you have just given some of the worse advice EVER offered in the history of the internet.

 

Anyone notice that both of these (allegedly) poor programs are in the Northeast? I visited MCPHS Worcester a few years ago and was impressed. Well, except for the location (Mass...and even worse...Worcester) and the price tag (WOW!!)

[Contrarian]

Ugh...

Every box has a minimum of 8 sides if you count the inside and the outside...

 

Every story can be shaded one way or another based upon the perspective of the story-teller and the consideration of secondary gain.

 

That said...

Your posts STILL come off as if they were written by a silly, bitter, spoiled child, who thinks that they know MORE than the folks trying to "educate" them. Silly and childish because anyone who has been to ANY institution of higher learning knows that 1-2 sub-par instructors or adminstrators does NOT justify trashing a entire school or program... and "maturity" would usually dictate treading lightly in this regard.

 

Its sad really because folks with what seems to be the perspective above will likely NOT remain employed for any length of time by any employer they are not related to... because its obvious that they will ALWAYS know more about the practice of medicine than all those folks thats been doing it long before they even knew what a stethoscope was ...:heheh:

 

This is the point where we usually strongly suggest that these folks just go to MD/DO school so that they can ride "solo," because if they find themselves always knowing more than any of their instructors and supervising physicians, employers... its only gonna cause problems, friction and unemployment.

 

YMMV

 

Contrarian

[ugh]

Ugh...

Every box has a minimum of 8 sides if you count the inside and the outside...

 

Every story can be shaded one way or another based upon the perspective of the story-teller and the consideration of secondary gain.

 

That said...

Your posts STILL come off as if they were written by a silly, bitter, spoiled child, who thinks that they know MORE than the folks trying to "educate" them. Silly and childish because anyone who has been to ANY institution of higher learning knows that 1-2 sub-par instructors or adminstrators does NOT justify trashing a entire school or program... and "maturity" would usually dictate treading lightly in this regard.

 

Its sad really because folks with what seems to be the perspective above will likely NOT remain employed for any length of time by any employer they are not related to... because its obvious that they will ALWAYS know more about the practice of medicine than all those folks thats been doing it long before they even knew what a stethoscope was ...:heheh:

 

This is the point where we usually strongly suggest that these folks just go to MD/DO school so that they can ride "solo," because if they find themselves always knowing more than any of their instructors and supervising physicians, employers... its only gonna cause problems, friction and unemployment.

 

YMMV

 

Contrarian

 

I knew you would read into my post as if I knew more than the preceptor, rather than acknowledging anyone else could be in the wrong. So, because I caught something and brought it to someone's attention because I was concerned about the patient I supposedly think I know better than everyone else. So, coming forth in this case is simply considered an "ego" thing. When is it considered the "right thing?" All the other posters are saying to "come forth" if you see a problem.

 

What about all the talk of what schools are "good" "fair" or "poor." Where does that come from. Reputations come from somewhere and it's not just US News and World Report. What about the reputation of the medical schools in the Caribbean. I don't know anything about them but I know what kind of reputation they have. Where does that come from?

 

I really don't care what anyone thinks. I really just wanted to see how people would react to my comments. It was interesting to see the feedback I was getting, and how skewed the responses were and how just one post provided the most logical and reasonable response. I really don't care if someone does or does not complain about what they experience at school. If someone comes forth with a problem in their school and is awarded the Nobel Peace Prize that's great. If they get in trouble then that's fine too. If you go to my former school and have a wonderful experience and think I was nothing but a complaining bitter liar then that's fine. If you go and have an awful experience then that's fine too. The one poster I respect was the one who said he was a former corporate manager, professor, and fire officer. He gave some insight into how things work and why some of the advice (mine included) was probably not the best.

[ugh]

Ugh - if you do quit the medical field (and I hope you do), PLEASE do not go into counseling as you have just given some of the worse advice EVER offered in the history of the internet.

 

Anyone notice that both of these (allegedly) poor programs are in the Northeast? I visited MCPHS Worcester a few years ago and was impressed. Well, except for the location (Mass...and even worse...Worcester) and the price tag (WOW!!)

 

I have a Ph.D in Counseling Psychology.

[ugh]

Whadda ya mean "us"?!?!?

 

A few posts up you were demanding the OP keep their mouth shut and not complain to anyone. Either you have a backbone or not. You say keep your mouth shut or get kicked out of school....what do you say to the PA-C who wants to confront thier employer? Will you advise them to keep thier mouth shut or lose their job?

 

How can you claim to be that person who will "take a risk" yet advise people not to do the same?

 

Depends on the day.

[ugh]

Lord... Please give me the wisdom to enlighten the ignorant...The knowledge to fight the stupid...and the understanding to tell them apart...

Life Sucks... Bring a helmet & mouthpiece...!!

 

Contrarian

 

Seems like you have quite the ego yourself. Interesting that your sign off, your "mark" is so condescending. So YOU are going to enlighten the world and YOU are going to fight the stupid because you came out of the womb with this amazing ability. Maybe that's why you're so defensive. You have to prove how you're so much more "mature" and above everyone else you are. I bet in your YEARS and YEARS and YEARS of experience you've seen and probably have experienced for yourself exactly what I have spoken of, but don't want to acknowledge it because that means you actually had to learn from an experience.

 

Interesting you tell me I'm a complainer. Look at your comment: Life Sucks... Bring a helmet & mouthpiece...!!

[bike mike]

I really don't care what anyone thinks. I really just wanted to see how people would react to my comments.

 

Troll......

[Hemegroup]

People are scared to say that someone above them is making a mistake. It happened to me on 2 of my rotations. I picked up on something that the doctor missed (one was immediately life-threatening and the other was still life-threatening but not immediately). I got nothing but a stern glare from the physician on one rotation, and with the 2nd rotation after we determined what was wrong (because I didn't blow off the pt like the doctor is "known" to do by the staff, and bothered to dig deeper) the preceptor immediately asked me for my evaluation and gave me a bad grade. For what? For finding out what was wrong with this patient? Both of the physicians had egos and the one should not be practicing medicine (according to me and all my classmates who had this preceptor). I didnt' get a pat on the back or even a thank you (don't need it)...I got a punishment. I can't say I think this is typical, but that it happens because people have egos and are insecure. So who's the "adult" in this situation and who is acting like the "child?" Who is cheating in this situation?

 

Nicely said ... I've been there myself... it's times like those when you want to flip out a scroll of the Hippocratic Oath and hold it up close for the 'near-sighted' ...

[Hemegroup]

I have to say, Ugh, you've made some blindingly RIGHT-ON statements in this thread. It's sad, but true, that oftentimes the 'whistle-blower' gets the shaft. I remember working as an EMT at a large retirement community, where charting was sub-par. Additionally, the residents of the independent living situation weren't required to keep records of their medications with the main medical office (wtf), which resulted in issues when they were taken by ambulance to the ER. I attempted to communicate with the head Nurse, countless times with no response. I finally went to the CEO. Guess what? Policy was changed to require that the independent living residents had to keep lists of their meds with the main office ... and I was terminated.

 

Politics like that simply SUCK in a bad way. I remember another time when a Cell Bio professor of mine (wow, was I so looking forward to that class in a bad way, too), regurgitated past tests and simply smiled and looked the other way when certain 'cool' students somehow obtained a copy. Not just tests, but even lab papers ... some people would even copy word for word. I went to the Dean ... what happened? The professor found out it was me who 'told' and gave me a C ... and no one cared. I was on my way out of that school anyways, so I just sucked it up and let it go. I did receive some satisfaction the next year when I found out that professor had been removed from Dept Chair. But it was too little, too late, for my grade.

 

Anyhow, taking Contrarian's advice with a grain of salt can result in some wisdom for you to put on your plate ... try and read a bit between the lines. And somehow, I hope that you are able to take your integrity out into the systems you become a part of, and make this world a better place. That's what it's all about, right? It's just a matter of learning how to operate with stealth ;)

 

I'm glad you got to vent ... it's important to be able to do that.

[Contrarian]

Sigh...

 

This:

I have a Ph.D in Counseling Psychology.

 

And this:

I feel sorry for your situation. I too went to a terrible school that no one thinks should even be accredited. I had no idea PA education was so bad. I regret being a PA and should've gone to medical school instead. I will NEVER hire anyone from my school, and every time I see a PA who thinks s/he is a hot shot I want to vomit. This profession is a joke.

 

...[then just more poorly formulated "advice" follows]...

 

It also seems that anyone with this much education (Ph.D) knows that 1-2 sub-par instructors or administrators does NOT justify trashing a entire school or program or profession... and that education and/or "maturity" would dictate treading lightly and tactfully in this regard.

 

Also this:

This situation just took me out of my naive brain that schools are generally good and want to help to the reality of it really being about money.

 

Just doesn't compute in my pea sized brain and leads to a few questions.

 

How does one spend enough time in academia to complete a Ph.D... but still not realize that education is a business...??

 

I guess I am bitter not just about that situation but that I was so naive, and I always want to believe that most people and things are good. So, maybe I'm mad at myself about being so "gullible."

 

How does one spend the considerable amount of time it takes to get a Ph.D in Counseling Psychology and remain "gullible" and naive about the world and its people upon completion of this arduous and emotionally draining path...??

 

Seems like the curriculum, studies, intern-ships and extern-ships required of a Counseling Psychology Ph.D candidate would have blunted if not eradicated the naiveté and gullibility.

 

The two (2) Clinicians that I work with daily who hold these credentials in Counseling Psychology seem to be on the ball, seem to get it and not surprised by much of the human depravity we deal with daily. Maybe they/we are simply jaded...

 

Something about all this doesn't pass the smell test....!!!!

 

AnyWho....

 

Please continue to ignore everything I've posted in this thread EXCEPT.... "folks with what seems to be the perspective above will likely NOT remain employed for any length of time by any employer they are not related to"...

 

Good luck in whatever you do and hope you find a career field filled with folks that meet your standards.

 

Contrarian

 

P.s... It also seems that someone with a Ph.D in Counseling Psychology would recognize that what is written in my "sig-line" is a observational STATEMENT and advice on useful equipment for mitigation... not a complaint...:wink:

[just_me]

It shouldnt and youre simply a hypocrite

 

 

Depends on the day.

[just_me]

There are ways to be a whistle blower without identifying yourself if you feel their may be retaliation from mgmt

 

Now Hemegroup I HAVE to ask....would you ever advise someone NOT to say anything if they were in the same situation as the OP or even your situation or any other siituation for that matter that dealt with academic dishonesty or coud put a patient in harms way?

 

I have to say, Ugh, you've made some blindingly RIGHT-ON statements in this thread. It's sad, but true, that oftentimes the 'whistle-blower' gets the shaft. I remember working as an EMT at a large retirement community, where charting was sub-par. Additionally, the residents of the independent living situation weren't required to keep records of their medications with the main medical office (wtf), which resulted in issues when they were taken by ambulance to the ER. I attempted to communicate with the head Nurse, countless times with no response. I finally went to the CEO. Guess what? Policy was changed to require that the independent living adults had to keep lists of their meds with the main office ... and I was terminated.

 

Politics like that simply SUCK in a bad way. I remember another time when a Cell Bio professor of mine (wow, was I so looking forward to that class in a bad way, too), regurgitated past tests and simply smiled and looked the other way when certain 'cool' students somehow obtained a copy. Not just tests, but even lab papers ... some people would even copy word for word. I went to the Dean ... what happened? The professor found out it was me who 'told' and gave me a C ... and no one cared. I was on my way out of that school anyways, so I just sucked it up and let it go. I did receive some satisfaction the next year when I found out that professor had been removed from Dept Chair. But it was too little, too late, for my grade.

 

Anyhow, taking Contrarian's advice with a grain of salt can result in some wisdom for you to put on your plate ... try and read a bit between the lines. And somehow, I hope that you are able to take your integrity out into the systems you become a part of, and make this world a better place. That's what it's all about, right? It's just a matter of learning how to operate with stealth ;)

 

I'm glad you got to vent ... it's important to be able to do that.

[Hemegroup]

If it put a patient in harms way, never. No one could make me do that. But, unfortunately, PA schools can be so tightly wound that they can't stray from their prime directive, i.e. graduation of their students. When a voice raises in dissent, as much attention can end up focused on the voice as the situation. Unfortunate, but often true. Choose your battles wisely in life, is my advice. Or at least, maneuver them wisely.