JFarnsworth Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 In one of my clinics, there is an NP (she has her master's) who is now our "medical director". I never heard of such a thing. Has any one else seen this? Is it even kosher? The telephone prompt even calls her "Dr. _____", which is totally inaccurate. Isn't this in violation of some law or another? She is trying to pursue her doctorate (which I"m guessing will give validity for her calling herself "doctor"), but she does not have it yet. Any advice on how to shut this BS down is appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
primadonna22274 Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Run...run far, run fast...well, that's Plan B. How's your relationship with your SP? I would start there. Feel him or her out to see how they feel about this issue. I'm sure it's not popular either. This would burn me up for sure!! Don't envy you this situation at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MedicinePower Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 Is the voice mail greeting in her voice? If she is introducing herself as "Doctor" but is not then there may be something not legal about this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ICRob0351 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Is the voice mail greeting in her voice? If she is introducing herself as "Doctor" but is not then there may be something not legal about this. Her voice on the message or not, she is responsible for accuratley identifying her title and position. Misrepresenting your clinical title is illegal. Period. And whether or not she is pursuing her Doctor of Nursing degree, that degree will STILL not make her a medical doctor. In this setting it is inappropriate and negligent for her to claim this title, and identify herself as such. I would report it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalPA Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Is it foreseeable that NPs and/or PAs will be Medical Directors or Assistant Medical Directors or Deputy Medical Directors in the future? Just thinking in terms of leadership positions for PAs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted January 12, 2014 Moderator Share Posted January 12, 2014 I once had a job as "associate chief, dept. of emergency medicine" in a small community hospital for 2 years. there was one overall chief and 3 associate chiefs( 2 docs and me). we met regularly to decide on matters about the dept. including hiring/firing/discipline issues, etc. I was in charge of 12 PAs/NPs(basically as the lead advanced practice clinician), I wrote the schedule, etc. It taught me a very important lesson. I hate being an administrator. 7 am mtgs after getting off work at 2 am? no thanks. I passed the slot onto another PA who I had hired after 2 years. he lasted 3 months and passed it on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MedicinePower Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 Her voice on the message or not, she is responsible for accuratley identifying her title and position. Misrepresenting your clinical title is illegal. Period. And whether or not she is pursuing her Doctor of Nursing degree, that degree will STILL not make her a medical doctor. In this setting it is inappropriate and negligent for her to claim this title, and identify herself as such. I would report it. You and I agree. I do know that PAs (not sure about NPs) are legally allowed to give medical direction to EMS crews. I do not know, however, if they are legally allowed to be full medical directors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAR 1 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 You and I agree. I do know that PAs (not sure about NPs) are legally allowed to give medical direction to EMS crews. I do not know, however, if they are legally allowed to be full medical directors. medical direction to EMS crews probably varies by state and/or local protocols. If I remember correctly in NYC it only says Physician in those protocols. (Also remember something about it saying the physician has to be Medical Control certified, but I could be wrong) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UGoLong Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 It probably does vary by state (doesn't everything these days?) PA's can give medical direction at emergency scenes in Ohio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 What type of clinic are you at? Do NPs have independent practice in the state you work in? Does she own the clinic? Are clinics required to have a medical director (i.e. physician) in your state? I have known or heard of a few instances where PAs were medical directors at remote Indian health service areas....or were they called clinic directors? Hmmm.....those would be different roles I suppose. Who gave her the title medical director? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted January 12, 2014 Moderator Share Posted January 12, 2014 OR and WA allows PAs to give direction to ems crews. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody85 Posted January 12, 2014 Share Posted January 12, 2014 I'm not sure if this is a similar position, but a PA is the director of invasive cardiology at Metrowest Medical Center in Massachusetts... Is this more common than being a general medical director? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFarnsworth Posted January 13, 2014 Author Share Posted January 13, 2014 So my SP is clueless about laws and trivial things like that. I think the NP insisted that she get the title Medical Director, and yet I'm not sure how she thinks she can direct physicians? It is an urgent care clinic and there are many OSHA violations, as well as illegal practices (conflict of interest, fraud, the usual). The phone prompt is not in her voice. However, I notice that she always introduces herself as, "Jane Doe, Medical Director"... which leads people to assume that she is an MD. She does not clarify that she is an NP, ever. She squirms when people do ask her about her medical training. She worked in ortho surg for years and doesn't know much else (like how to read a chest X ray). Plan B is not Plan B, it is Plan A~ I am running as fast and as far as I can from this place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
primadonna22274 Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Sorry you're in this position. I wish you the best!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFarnsworth Posted January 14, 2014 Author Share Posted January 14, 2014 I sent an e mail to the Ca Nursing Board asking about the legality of what's going on. Radio silence....... Am I surprised? Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted January 14, 2014 Share Posted January 14, 2014 Send an email to the CA medical board and see what they say. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFarnsworth Posted January 15, 2014 Author Share Posted January 15, 2014 So I got a reply from the CA nursing board. They want to investigate. But I also sent an email to the CA medical board. Before I give out any info, I want to make sure that this person doesn't just get a little slap on the wrist. I figure the Medical board will be a little more upset about an NP trying to pass herself off as a physician than the CA nursing board. I mean, isn't that the nursing goal, to be called "doctor" without going to med school, with lies and misdirection re: PhD vs MD/DO? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator True Anomaly Posted January 20, 2014 Moderator Share Posted January 20, 2014 You and I agree. I do know that PAs (not sure about NPs) are legally allowed to give medical direction to EMS crews. I do not know, however, if they are legally allowed to be full medical directors. What we're all referring here with the term "medical director" is the person in charge of the medical care at a certain facility or portion of a hospital as provided by physicians/APP's. As far as PA's in EMS, when I did my research for my abstract in regards to PA's in EMS 3 years ago, I found 15 states that listed some provision in their statutes that allowed PA's to function in some way in the EMS field- whether that be full-blown medical directors (Montana is the only state that allows PA's to be stand-alone medical directors for EMS systems and doesn't list any restrictions in that regard) or function in the field without any additional certification, or even be allowed to write EMS protocols. It's interesting that others have listed states that PA's have some role in EMS- in looking back at my research, I didn't find anything specifically listed for those states- Oregon, Washington and Ohio being the ones mentioned here. Now, that also means that I didn't find anything prohibiting PA's functioning in EMS in some way, and my research is at least 3 years old...and it only looked at state statutes available online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joelseff Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 ... I mean, isn't that the nursing goal, to be called "doctor" without going to med school, with lies and misdirection re: PhD vs MD/DO? But this one didn't even go to "doctor" school. That royally sucks. Hopefully the BON and BOM both come down on this one. Keep us posted Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pglaser01 Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 I don't get it....what's this increase with everyone wanting to be called "doctor" ??? Are egos really getting this bad that people aren't satisfied until they have some grand title? If a title is that important...aren't we really missing the point? I guess I just don't get why the turf war with BON? Does the nursing lobby really have that big a chip on their shoulder and think they should be equal with MDs? Or is this just a political power play that the BON gets billing as "top dog" in this country? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GetMeOuttaThisMess Posted January 23, 2014 Share Posted January 23, 2014 Because the degree title shows that they have greater knowledge, regardless of clinical experience (being facetious since I'm just a lowly B.S.) and more employers (primarily institutions/hospital systems) are starting to prefer the title over clinical acumen. Joelseff, I love the avatar (as she was suffering from bronchitis when she made her statement). All these types of topics are making me realize that "Ain't nobody got time for this"(career). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kbarro1 Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 There is an NP in the hospital I work at that has a doctorate of nursing and she introduces herself as "Dr. xyz". Makes me cringe. If I am not mistaken she is a Dr. in the academic setting---not in the hospital. Has to be illegal in terms of misrepresentation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFarnsworth Posted January 24, 2014 Author Share Posted January 24, 2014 There is an NP in the hospital I work at that has a doctorate of nursing and she introduces herself as "Dr. xyz". Makes me cringe. If I am not mistaken she is a Dr. in the academic setting---not in the hospital. Has to be illegal in terms of misrepresentation This is misrepresentation. Contact the higher ups, the medical board, and the nursing board. I also don't get the desire to be called "doctor" without going to medical school. If I had a doctorate but was not an MD/DO, I'd feel like a fraud if I introduced myself as "Dr. JFarnsworth". Icky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFarnsworth Posted January 24, 2014 Author Share Posted January 24, 2014 But this one didn't even go to "doctor" school. That royally sucks. Hopefully the BON and BOM both come down on this one. Keep us posted Will do. The BON is on it, the BOM hasn't replied at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JFarnsworth Posted January 25, 2014 Author Share Posted January 25, 2014 BOM just replied, I filed a report. Let's see what these agencies do about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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