Physician Compensation Report 2017 - Where's Our Pay Increase?

[SoCal_PA]

Medscape released the 2017 physician compensation report

 

The main point I took away from this was a 43% increase in salary over 6 years. Why isn't our profession seeing a similar increase?

 

http://www.medscape.com/slideshow/compensation-2017-overview-6008547#1

[Guest HanSolo]

Wasn't able to read the article, but.....maybe it's an increasingly saturated market compounded by less experienced entry level PAs driving down the price/benefits?

[mmiller3]

Wasn't able to read the article, but.....maybe it's an increasingly saturated market compounded by less experienced entry level PAs driving down the price/benefits?

 

New grad salaries may factor in, but saturation can't be it, at least not in my area. I can throw a rock and hit 50 open positions. Medical student enrollment was at an all-time high 2 years ago; I don't know the stats for 2016. If they are not saturating the market, then there shouldn't be any reason we are.

 

Disclaimer: I have not read the article yet.

[Lyndhurst]

I think the increasing amount of new graduates both PA and NP probably have some effect on holding down the average salary. In my program the average age was 27 but if you take out the half dozen oldest it would drop that down to 25 or less. They have graduated college, worked for a year or two as CNA, EMT or MA and so any salary over $60K is a lot of money. Couple that lack of experience with a lack of confidence in their true value and they could easily accept offers that are fairly low. 

 

Of course my wiser, older self has accepted an offer for $65K...it is a residency program I just hope it is worth it.

 

Maybe some of the more senior members would be willing to comment on if they have seen 43% salary increase over the last 6 years.

[SoCal_PA]

I think the increasing amount of new graduates both PA and NP probably have some effect on holding down the average salary. In my program the average age was 27 but if you take out the half dozen oldest it would drop that down to 25 or less. They have graduated college, worked for a year or two as CNA, EMT or MA and so any salary over $60K is a lot of money. Couple that lack of experience with a lack of confidence in their true value and they could easily accept offers that are fairly low. 

 

Of course my wiser, older self has accepted an offer for $65K...it is a residency program I just hope it is worth it.

 

Maybe some of the more senior members would be willing to comment on if they have seen 43% salary increase over the last 6 years.

Really? Our class was the same age and I know of at least 20% of the contracts they accepted with the average being about 100k. This is in souther CA....but still

[Lyndhurst]

Really? Our class was the same age and I know of at least 20% of the contracts they accepted with the average being about 100k. This is in souther CA....but still

That is great news! Average salaries are a little lower where we are and we are still a few months away from graduation so not many have secured jobs yet. My worry came from casual conversations with classmates about expected salaries. We had a lecture on contracts and negotiations a while ago and it seemed that some in my class were a little surprised to hear $80k should be a minimum not a target.

 

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[overthehorizen]

Medscape released the 2017 physician compensation report

 

The main point I took away from this was a 43% increase in salary over 6 years. Why isn't our profession seeing a similar increase?

 

http://www.medscape.com/slideshow/compensation-2017-overview-6008547#1

We will continue to decline into non existence over the next ten years unless and until we stop PANRE testing and win 50 state independence. We are just slaves on the Physicians plantation. The NPs have been set fre and are prospering. We continue to pick cotton in the hot sun for room and board in the field shack. No undergraduate should be considering entry into the PA profession today. We are going the way of the Mainframe computer.

[overthehorizen]

That is great news! Average salaries are a little lower where we are and we are still a few months away from graduation so not many have secured jobs yet. My worry came from casual conversations with classmates about expected salaries. We had a lecture on contracts and negotiations a while ago and it seemed that some in my class were a little surprised to hear $80k should be a minimum not a target.

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[Guest UVAPAC]

I am not sure how accurate that article is.  Most physicians I talk to are constantly complaining how their salaries have been slashed drastically, and how reimbursement continues to decrease.  I know several older physicians who retired between EMR being mandated, and reimbursement being cut. 

[mmiller3]

We will continue to decline into non existence over the next ten years unless and until we stop PANRE testing and win 50 state independence. We are just slaves on the Physicians plantation. The NPs have been set fre and are prospering. We continue to pick cotton in the hot sun for room and board in the field shack. No undergraduate should be considering entry into the PA profession today. We are going the way of the Mainframe computer.

 

Seriously, just stop.

 

Instead of crying wolf (ad nauseum, I might add), get on the AAPA board or start doing something useful if you are really this certain we are doomed as a profession.

 

You are starting to look like someone with an axe to grind against the PA profession.

[beattie228]

We will continue to decline into non existence over the next ten years unless and until we stop PANRE testing and win 50 state independence. We are just slaves on the Physicians plantation. The NPs have been set fre and are prospering. We continue to pick cotton in the hot sun for room and board in the field shack. No undergraduate should be considering entry into the PA profession today. We are going the way of the Mainframe computer.

Your comparison of the PA profession to slavery is outright egregious and distasteful. 

[mgriffiths]

We will continue to decline into non existence over the next ten years unless and until we stop PANRE testing and win 50 state independence. We are just slaves on the Physicians plantation. The NPs have been set fre and are prospering. We continue to pick cotton in the hot sun for room and board in the field shack. No undergraduate should be considering entry into the PA profession today. We are going the way of the Mainframe computer.

To compare our work to slavery, when no matter how you cut it we make A LOT of money, is ridiculous, wrong, distasteful, etc.  The average household income in the United States is slightly more than $50,000.  Even awful PA salaries are significantly more than that, so the bottom line is that we are actually doing very well for ourselves.

 

Does that mean we shouldn't fight for better/fairer compensation?   NO!!!

 

Does that mean we shouldn't fight for "independence?   NO!!!

 

Does that mean we shouldn't fight to remove the PANRE?  NO!!!

 

But, we are not slaves and to make that comparison is wrong.  You need to actually research the atrocities that were committed against slaves, not only in the USA but in many other countries around the world, not only in the past but that are still being committed today.

[BruceBanner]

Medscape released the 2017 physician compensation report

 

The main point I took away from this was a 43% increase in salary over 6 years. Why isn't our profession seeing a similar increase?

 

http://www.medscape.com/slideshow/compensation-2017-overview-6008547#1

 

Because employers would make less money. Saturation is regional and may be part of the problem, but the other piece is we are seen as labor more so than docs. I dont think average salaries have changed much at all since I graduated 5 years ago. Maybe <10%.

 

There is less incentive to offer a PA $120k+ for say a PC position when 50 other PAs will take less.

[overthehorizen]

\

[overthehorizen]

Seriously, just stop.

 

Instead of crying wolf (ad nauseum, I might add), get on the AAPA board or start doing something useful if you are really this certain we are doomed as a profession.

 

You are starting to look like someone with an axe to grind against the PA profession.

I say again, I love practicing medicine. I despise dependent practice and reboarding. I would immediately join the AAPA AND INVEST MYSELF FULLY iff the AAPA would state that their goal is to eliminate the PANRE AND WIN FIFTY STATE INDEPENDENCE. Just make that public pledge and I will pay dues and enlist.

 

"Most humbly my lord, on my knee, I beg thee the leading of the vayward" - York, Battle of Agincourt

[JDayBFL]

This was a brief survey of >1,000 NPs/PAs and I found it very interesting as PAs are more satisfied with salary and shows them to be making more as well: http://www.beckersasc.com/asc-turnarounds-ideas-to-improve-performance/8-statistics-on-np-pa-salary-and-satisfaction.html

 

I don't experience the doom and gloom in my hospital and see PAs thriving in leadership roles and very competitive salaries. The surgical department alone consists of ~100 PAs across three campuses with the expected hiring of many more as the hospital continues to expand over the next year or so.

[eggama]

On 4/7/2017 at 11:24 AM, beattie228 said:

Your comparison of the PA profession to slavery is outright egregious and distasteful. 

Well I have to agree I feel like a slave sometimes, especially in the ED where the PAs have to see almost all the patients and do abnormal lab callbacks and make 1/3 of the Docs doing the same thing!

 

[Gordon, PA-C]

I've got a newsflash for you guys...

 

PAs will never get a boost to what MDs make.  MDs will get a paycut down to PA levels perhaps, but that will happen long before PAs see a doubling of their salary.

 

 

[lkth487]

On 4/6/2017 at 5:19 PM, mmiller3 said:

 

New grad salaries may factor in, but saturation can't be it, at least not in my area. I can throw a rock and hit 50 open positions. Medical student enrollment was at an all-time high 2 years ago; I don't know the stats for 2016. If they are not saturating the market, then there shouldn't be any reason we are.

 

Disclaimer: I have not read the article yet.

Medical students are NOT saturating the market.  Residency spots are increasing slowly - which is the real bottleneck.  You can have all the medical students you want, it's all useless without residencies.   And there are still way more residency slots ban US medical graduates.  The IMG and FMGs will feel the squeeze first.  

Residency and fellowship spots are strictly policed - and you have to demonstrate to the accrediting authorities all sorts of things regarding the quality of training before they allow any increases.  So the supply of physicians in most specialties (except a couple notable exceptions like pathology) will continue to be less than the demand. 

[lkth487]

On 4/7/2017 at 8:28 AM, overthehorizen said:

We will continue to decline into non existence over the next ten years unless and until we stop PANRE testing and win 50 state independence. We are just slaves on the Physicians plantation. The NPs have been set fre and are prospering. We continue to pick cotton in the hot sun for room and board in the field shack. No undergraduate should be considering entry into the PA profession today. We are going the way of the Mainframe computer.

I'm not going to touch the "slave" remark but NPs on average do not make more than PAs.  I think most surveys I've seen has them at similar salaries.

In my specialty, the average salary for a NP/PA is around $110-115k, for about ~36 hours of work per week.  

I do think PAs should be better compensated (and also should be able to get MD degrees by taking the STEPS and applying for residencies).  

[lkth487]

Also, just to throw it out there: these numbers are a little too low, on average, from talking to physicians in private practice. The gold standard for employment in private practice is the MGMA and for academics, its AAMC's survey (general rule of thumb, take private practice salary and about 50-65% of that is your academic salary). 

[Miaow]

What I am finding most depressing about compensation recently is that I have been at my job for almost 15 years and new grad employees are being hired on at almost the same rate that I am at now.

[lkth487]

There is some of that in all of medicine, I think.  I know people who get paid depending on their collections, so the only difference between new people and people who have been doing it a while is that sometimes the experienced people are slightly more efficient and see more patients.  A lot of people are in practices where they all make within ~20% of each other, regardless of seniority.  

 

Other practices, depending on structure, have partnership tracks and academic advancement, so those vary.  But the way healthcare system is structuted, there is a lot of "eat what you kill".

[KMD16]

What I am finding most depressing about compensation recently is that I have been at my job for almost 15 years and new grad employees are being hired on at almost the same rate that I am at now.

Very true. Sad but true. Am going back

[ventana]

gotta go looking, let the feet do the talking

 

I make 90-95% in both my jobs....

 

work 20 hours per week at one and per diem at the other, and will be around 140k this year......

 

Stop enabling employers to underpay us......