whoRyou Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 I was an actively practicing PA for >12 yr during my M3/4 rotations. Those who respected my knowledge (and PAs overall I think) gave me quite a bit of rope. Those who were uncertain of their teaching ability and/or failed to respect maturity and prior experience were very restrictive and thus I learned almost nothing from them. Had nothing to do with my enthusiasm and motivation. Sadly Lisa: Your story reminds me of what happened to me not too long ago when I was applying to a program to gain HCE for PA programs. I got rejected. I'll refrain from the location and name etc. But, I will tell you the program director told me that she was NOT going to accept me because (1) I intimidated her and (2) I asked too many questions during the interview. and (3) I was too overqualified. On the drive home I was thinking to myself, "What was that all about? Wouldn't she want me to ask questions so I can know what I am getting myself into? Doesn't she want to know more about me as I get to know her and her program?" How can I be overqualified when I NEVER EVER had any HCE. So, sadly this makes me scramble to find some other kind of HCE when I thought I had this. Everyone else who knows what my intentions are thought this would be the easy part of the process in terms of the application process for PA schools. So, it goes to show you like you said, (it) "(h)ad nothing to do with my enthusiasm and motivation." The squeaky wheel DOESN'T ALWAYS get the grease. Maybe I was too eager to learn. I don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoRyou Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 BTW, if we are NOW officially called AP shouldn't we change our website's name? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
primadonna22274 Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 ^^^sad. All I can tell you is that program is NOT a fit for YOU. Keep the faith. Most PDs aren't that stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted July 18, 2014 Moderator Share Posted July 18, 2014 Um...there's a bottom 10% of PA school too. yup, also unemployable... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoRyou Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 ^That would be an awful small sample body on the PANCE failures, E Sample of 1 if that ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JMPA Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Um...there's a bottom 10% of PA school too. So you feel that it's ok to dump the MD failures on another profession so greedy MDs can earn an extra buck? Lets face it, this law is a dumping ground for failures and a degradation of a magnificient profession. How would the np profession feel if graduate PAs who could not pass PANCE could function as nps? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted July 18, 2014 Moderator Share Posted July 18, 2014 Sample of 1 if that ... people fail pance every year. maybe 5-8% of pa school grads fail it at least once, depending on the program. not every place has a 100% 1st time pass rate. we see threads on here all the time in which folks say they have failed 2,3,4, etc times and they are asking for help to pass it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delco714 Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 So you feel that it's ok to dump the MD failures on another profession so greedy MDs can earn an extra buck? Lets face it, this law is a dumping ground for failures and a degradation of a magnificient profession. How would the np profession feel if graduate PAs who could not pass PANCE could function as nps? In the grand scheme of things,I think the supervision of the AP needs to be way more, but I'm hoping Missouri only went to these lengths because they are in serious dire need of primary care and exercised other viable and more desirable options. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JMPA Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 In the grand scheme of things,I think the supervision of the AP needs to be way more, but I'm hoping Missouri only went to these lengths because they are in serious dire need of primary care and exercised other viable and more desirable options. Thats bad reasoning. If in such dire need, than they should attract providers. Increase MD reimbursement, expand independence for PAs whom have significant experience. Why allow untrained, failed to place MDs to practice? Why not allow experienced primary care PAs to become independent and provide funding so they can open their own practice? That would certainely attract multitudes. I do like the pic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
db_pavnp Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 It is a good question, whether they ever considered better utilizing PAs and NPs rather than creating a whole new profession. Missouri has relatively restrictive code for PAs and NPs. However, it is probably a stretch to think PAs would flock to Missouri if they could open independent practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delco714 Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Totally agree jmpa,, absolutely. I think Missouri is just in a poor state of affairs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator LT_Oneal_PAC Posted July 18, 2014 Moderator Share Posted July 18, 2014 It is a good question, whether they ever considered better utilizing PAs and NPs rather than creating a whole new profession. Missouri has relatively restrictive code for PAs and NPs. However, it is probably a stretch to think PAs would flock to Missouri if they could open independent practice. I would haul @$$ to Missouri if they gave independent practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 BTW, if we are NOW officially called AP shouldn't we change our website's name? WE are not officially APs. Unmatched residents in Missouri, if they choose to apply for licensure after MO takes the year to figure out how to do it, are APs. PAs are not APs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 Lisa: Your story reminds me of what happened to me not too long ago when I was applying to a program to gain HCE for PA programs. I got rejected. I'll refrain from the location and name etc. But, I will tell you the program director told me that she was NOT going to accept me because (1) I intimidated her and (2) I asked too many questions during the interview. and (3) I was too overqualified. On the drive home I was thinking to myself, "What was that all about? Wouldn't she want me to ask questions so I can know what I am getting myself into? Doesn't she want to know more about me as I get to know her and her program?" How can I be overqualified when I NEVER EVER had any HCE. So, sadly this makes me scramble to find some other kind of HCE when I thought I had this. Everyone else who knows what my intentions are thought this would be the easy part of the process in terms of the application process for PA schools. So, it goes to show you like you said, (it) "(h)ad nothing to do with my enthusiasm and motivation." The squeaky wheel DOESN'T ALWAYS get the grease. Maybe I was too eager to learn. I don't know. Is it the emoticons? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted July 18, 2014 Moderator Share Posted July 18, 2014 Is it the emoticons? probably.....:) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoRyou Posted July 18, 2014 Share Posted July 18, 2014 maybe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DissentingVoice Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 yup, also unemployable... Then why do you expect the terrible FMGs to be more employable? As a physician, I would rather have a mediocre PA than an FMG struggling to pass STEP III with a moderate command of the English language. Besides, I'd probably favor the PA anyway. Would you rather have someone with a big ego who used to be a physician in another area and would probably question everything you do? Just being honest. So you feel that it's ok to dump the MD failures on another profession so greedy MDs can earn an extra buck? Lets face it, this law is a dumping ground for failures and a degradation of a magnificient profession. How would the np profession feel if graduate PAs who could not pass PANCE could function as nps? Why do you keep calling them FAILURES? They SUCCESSFULLY completed medical school. They are hardly failures. I think you are just making a lot of assumptions about who these MDs are. You know what they say about assuming.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted July 19, 2014 Moderator Share Posted July 19, 2014 Then why do you expect the terrible FMGs to be more employable? As a physician, I would rather have a mediocre PA than an FMG struggling to pass STEP III with a moderate command of the English language. Besides, I'd probably favor the PA anyway. Would you rather have someone with a big ego who used to be a physician in another area and would probably question everything you do? Just being honest. Why do you keep calling them FAILURES? They SUCCESSFULLY completed medical school. They are hardly failures. I think you are just making a lot of assumptions about who these MDs are. You know what they say about assuming.... they FAILED to match, either because of grades, board scores, or personality flaws. I suppose some idiots only applied to one place and didn't get in,but most folks should know how the game is played. rank a bunch of places, some reaches, some good fits, some below your status. just like applying to grad school. if you rank 12 places and get none what does that say about you? you couldn't even match to a transitional year, rotating internship, or preventative med residency...it also means you couldn't match via the scramble, so you are a two time loser. I'm sure there are some very nice folks with reasonable grades who fail to match every year, but that doesn't mean I want them taking care of me without further training. I agree these folks are in a tough place but letting them be PAs isn't the answer. maybe they should all automatially become 5th pathway students and get another clinical year and a chance to try again the next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 I believe I read in the legislation the unmatched physicians had a time period imposed on them for becoming an AP. No more than 3 years out of med school and had to get a residency within 5? years or so after working as an AP. Was I dreaming? If that is the case, the APs will become the revolving doctors in rural and underserved areas (no different now as I see this frequently in the rural area I live in). Sorry to say this but it IS the FMGs who come here, get their J-1s, work in a rural area for 3 years and then are off to a fellowship in a large academic center. It leaves a bad taste in the mouths of the patients and to those of us who are committed to rural health care and live permanently in the back woods. I call it patient abandonment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DissentingVoice Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 they FAILED to match, either because of grades, board scores, or personality flaws. I suppose some idiots only applied to one place and didn't get in,but most folks should know how the game is played. rank a bunch of places, some reaches, some good fits, some below your status. just like applying to grad school. if you rank 12 places and get none what does that say about you? you couldn't even match to a transitional year, rotating internship, or preventative med residency...it also means you couldn't match via the scramble, so you are a two time loser. I'm sure there are some very nice folks with reasonable grades who fail to match every year, but that doesn't mean I want them taking care of me without further training. I agree these folks are in a tough place but letting them be PAs isn't the answer. maybe they should all automatially become 5th pathway students and get another clinical year and a chance to try again the next year. They didn't necessarily fail to match either. Maybe they didn't enter the match. I know someone who was shot. She was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. Hard to finish your rotations from rehab. I've heard of pregnancy delaying graduation, but I suppose you can dodge that 'bullet' I know of someone who just had personal issues and graduated a month late and thus could not enter the match. I ended up septic during one of my rotations. Fortunately I recovered very quickly and did not have to repeat the month. The match process is VERY stressful for us. I know a divorced resident who only applied to a few programs near his son because he valued staying near his son over residency. (His ex obviously refused to move with him) I know other residents who married someone with a high level job that pays several times what residency does. They can't just up and move. I know a married couple who are now doing residency 8 hours apart......for another 3 years. How would that feel? Again, I feel like you're assuming a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIPPER Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 They're doctors. Like it or not. That's what they'll be called and referred to by. Argue their qualifications all you want. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 We all have life circumstances that prevent us from living the ideal. PAs have the same situations described by DV that delays their entry to practice. It's life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DissentingVoice Posted July 19, 2014 Share Posted July 19, 2014 They're doctors. Like it or not. That's what they'll be called and referred to by. Argue their qualifications all you want. PAs call themselves doctor in many states. (Tried to find a list of the states, but I cannot remember where it is) We all have life circumstances that prevent us from living the ideal. PAs have the same situations described by DV that delays their entry to practice. It's life. Yeah, I know. I'm just saying; stop calling them failures. They are not failures. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted July 19, 2014 Moderator Share Posted July 19, 2014 They didn't necessarily fail to match either. Maybe they didn't enter the match. I know someone who was shot. She was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. Hard to finish your rotations from rehab. I've heard of pregnancy delaying graduation, but I suppose you can dodge that 'bullet' I know of someone who just had personal issues and graduated a month late and thus could not enter the match. I ended up septic during one of my rotations. Fortunately I recovered very quickly and did not have to repeat the month. The match process is VERY stressful for us. I know a divorced resident who only applied to a few programs near his son because he valued staying near his son over residency. (His ex obviously refused to move with him) I know other residents who married someone with a high level job that pays several times what residency does. They can't just up and move. I know a married couple who are now doing residency 8 hours apart......for another 3 years. How would that feel? Again, I feel like you're assuming a bit. fair enough, doesn't mean they should practice in a way that was not intended by their educational pathway/trajectory. could a pa who graduates, passes her boards and can't find a job practice as a paramedic or RN? I could argue that many PAs could do the work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted July 19, 2014 Moderator Share Posted July 19, 2014 PAs call themselves doctor in many states. (Tried to find a list of the states, but I cannot remember where it is) PAs don't call themselves doctors in any states.some states just don't have laws restricting who can call themselves a dr. there is a difference. A pa is only a "DR" if they have completed a phd/dhsc,etc. Even then in a clinical setting they shouldn't confuse pts with the title unless it is spelled out very well. John Smith PA, PhD Cardiology Physician Assistant Doctor of Nutrition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.