tme12 Posted January 20, 2013 Share Posted January 20, 2013 Do some PA programs pay preceptors to teach at clinical rotations? I recently tried to set up an external rotation on my own, but the practice told me that they could not take me on since my program doesn't pay. If it is true that some programs pay, I would be a little surprised, as it seems to put the programs on different playing fields. I briefly looked on the ARC-PA website but didn't find anything regarding paying preceptors. Anyone know about this? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andersenpa Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 I take students on a volunteer basis. Not aware of getting paid as a clinical preceptor. Programs will pay for lecture services though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_me Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 I would think a program would only pay a really good preceptor....one they KNOW will teach and provide opportunities for a student to get great hands on experience... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contrarian Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 According to someone that I talked to at Medex... YES quite a few programs DO pay preceptors... Why, because its a clinical reality started by the Physician programs that they are affiiiated with. She told me that its causing a rift amongst programs because those that don't pay... don't want to start paying, but are losing quality clinical sites to the programs that do pay. There was a looooooooooong discussion about the notion that programs that do NOT pay for clinical preceptors are doing their students a serious disservice. As part of that discussion, there was a question about the overall cost of paying preceptors, whether it would be cost prohibitive and about where the student's tuition money curently goes... since most programs have oniy 4-5 faculty, but 30-100 students all paying $35k-$45k/yr. The programs are taking advantage of the newbies by charging them ridiculously inflated tuition rates (for them to teach themselves medicine then go to vounteer cinical sites)... and relying on the altruistic notions of experienced PA-Cs to do it. So yeah... some programs DO pay preceptors. Medex pays some but not others... Mostly Physician (not PAs) preceptors in the required specialty clerkship areas. There was a time at UW-Medex, that as an alternative, instead of money, they used to make the preceptors official clinical faculty of the UW SOM. This title carried some mild perks with it so was acceptable to some. They recently stopped doing this, and stopped renewing the clinical faculty designations of those who had already been through the process... AND raised tuition on the students... I officially stopped precepting Medex students as of 1 Jan 2013. Felt like I was being "Pimped" by the program as they make boatloads of cash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andersenpa Posted January 21, 2013 Share Posted January 21, 2013 There was a time at UW-Medex, that as an alternative, instead of money, they used to make the preceptors official clinical faculty of the UW SOM. This title carried some mild perks with it so was acceptable to some. They recently stopped doing this, and stopped renewing the clinical faculty designations of those who had already been through the process... AND raised tuition on the students... I officially stopped precepting Medex students as of 1 Jan 2013. Felt like I was being "Pimped" by the program as they make boatloads of cash. They are still making us faculty. some perks but not "pocketfulls"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contrarian Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 I'll just repeat: They recently stopped doing this, and stopped renewing the clinical faculty designations of those who had already been through the process... But still wanted them to precept students... Them deciding to NOT compensate Preceptors and stop processing the volunteer ones for clinical faculty has been enough of a issue (along with a few others) that has caused some fulltime faculty to resign... The way it was explained to me was that some of the PA-C Medex Faculty felt it a disservice to PAs... for them to ONLY pay Physician preceptors, but was ok with it... as long as they had the alternative kudo's. Then when they decided to stop doing the extensive follow thru required for the PA preceptors clinical faculty designations, but want the folks that worked there to approach these PA-Cs and request that they take students, it was a bit much. To paraphrase from a former Medex clinical director- 'So ummm... they pay Clinical Preceptors, but do NOT pay PA-C Clinical preceptors for the students that they precept, only Physicians. They used to jump through ALL the hoops required by UW-SOM to get these people the Adjunct Clinical Faculty designation, but now won't even do that. Instead they have them fill out the paper work and let it dissappear with no follow thru, but still expect those PA-Cs precept students'... The program was taking 100 students a year (now increased with the Tacoma site). At the current tuition rate, the School is making about $80k per student equaling around $8 milliion every 12 months. The outlay for program overhead is likely around $450-$500k including office space, insurance, salaries, etc. No one was/is expecting the program to pay the preceptors a "living Wage." Just something to demonstrate appreciation for their time and dedication. According to my source, someone even pitched the idea of $200/month for preceptors of the REQUIRED clinical clerkships simply to cover coffee and lunches while precepting. The program didn't want to pay for what they could get for free... My last comment on this is... Just because someone has a piece of paper that says they are UW School of Medicine Adjunct Clinical Faculty... doesn't REALLY mean that they currently are...as it has to be renewed regularly. To do so requires some work and consistent follow thru from the Medex Staff, that apparently isn't/hasn't been happening nor is it a priority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator rev ronin Posted January 22, 2013 Administrator Share Posted January 22, 2013 Well, if this is indeed the case, I'm going to be precepting Pacific students, not UW Tacoma students, when I start doing so... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contrarian Posted January 22, 2013 Share Posted January 22, 2013 I'm sort of torn, because the Tacoma students are theoretically Veterans... and I'd like to contribute to MANY more veterans becoming PAs... but can't see being a tool for the school to overcharge students to enrich themselves. For what the programs are charging today's students... it just doesn't seem right that All clinical sites shouldn't be standardized and the experiences of the students shouldn't ALL be top quality and programmed. WHERE IS THE students tuition $$MONEY$$ going..???? Program Director--->> $125K Medical Director---->> $100K Office staff x 3 --->>> $150k Clinical Director-->>> $70k Insurance-->>???$$$ Where is the other 6.5 million + going...???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bodiggler Posted January 29, 2013 Share Posted January 29, 2013 My girlfriend's vetrinary med school pays her preceptors $1800 a month to have her as a student for four weeks! Even half of that would be fair to the preceptor. I have had students follow me around in my field for just a day. I have noticed the headaches and being unable to stay caught up with my duties and that is just one day, not 12 weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KLMCC Posted March 20, 2013 Share Posted March 20, 2013 I spoke with two of my preceptors at different sites, one (PA)/ one (MD), I have had out here in New England and both have stated that they receive the following for taking students: PA: $400 per 5 wks/ per student, MD: $800 per 5 wks/ per student. They both work for hospital ran groups so I am not sure if and how much the hospital takes for their cut. I do know that here in NE this practice is now common place due to the amount of Med/ PA/ NP programs in close proximity and the competitiveness which ensues for rotation spots. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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