sas5814 Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 In a different thread I started (which is still running strong) I describe a problem with my organization choosing a senior APP (they actually choose 3 for some reason). After a LOT of wrangling and emailing with senior admin they are starting to see my way about who was chosen, how they were chosen, and what their responsibilities are. Without a lot of boring detail they seem to be just another added layer of administration charged with pestering us about things other people already pester us about. On Tuesday, at their invitation, I will be having a meeting with senior admin to make my case for what a senior APP should be and what he/she should be doing. I want to go into the meeting with a basic job description prepared. I was hoping someone here might have a pre-existing one I could use as a template. I am working 12's all weekend which only gives me Monday to pull one together. Any help is appreciated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thinkertdm Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 Licensing minutiae- the person to ask regarding licensing requirements, sp requirements, current and pending regulations PA advocate in meetings- policy, patients per hour, scope of practice, pay grades, and when there is counseling required for individual pa's, senior would be present. Interviewing. Reviewing prior jobs from applicants. Disciplinary meetings. Firing. getting coffee at meetings. Buying donuts. Ensuring pas in organization are happy, and if not, what is their beef. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeBuyAndSellJunk Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 16 minutes ago, thinkertdm said: getting coffee at meetings. Buying donuts. Ensuring pas in organization are happy, and if not, what is their beef. On a serious note, a retainment officer is a great idea. So many places have no foresight in to actually having an individual employee’s goal to be keeping providers happy. It is one of the few parts of any “burnout” lecture that I agree with and rarely see employed. You do a good job with that role alone and you will save an organization mass amounts of $$$. One aspect I have seen for this role is performing some managerial duties. Some stuff obviously makes sense, but don’t make me make people’s schedules and approve PTO, etc... you can pay me $50+ an hour or you can pay someone else who is probably already proficient at that duty $20/hr and it fits their duties better. It is that type of stuff that drives me crazy in our organization. We pay our physician leaders 250k to do stuff that doesn’t require any of their expertise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas5814 Posted February 10, 2018 Author Share Posted February 10, 2018 Yea I see my primary role as being an advocate for the APPs when admin and physicians are being morons. Hard to phrase that right... Mostly want to focus on eliminating artificial barriers to care (which I have already outlined for them), recruiting and retaining quality providers, and being a buffer in all things involving APPs like patient complaints, credentials, etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thinkertdm Posted February 10, 2018 Share Posted February 10, 2018 Here are organization wide policy things a senior pa might have input on: "Hey, let's make all the midlevels do their own vitals, room their own patients, and when their work is down, start on their supervising physician's worklist" "Since midlevels do basic clinical work, let's cut their cme money!" "Cut vacation time" "Physician lounges are for physician's ONLY. Please use the break room" When things like this are brought up at various meetings, the only people there are MDs, nurses, and bean counters. They will all excitedly nod their heads and move on to the next item on the agenda. You probably won't have to approve individual schedules, but hopefully work to shape system wide policies. They realize that PAs are becoming a valuable addition to their staff, that's why they want an NP in charge of policy. An excellent mentor, an MD, when she found out I was calling patients back regarding normal lab results, or trying to arrange a follow-up, told me to have the nurse do it, because my time was too valuable. Any clinic makes money with clinicians; any time spent not seeing patients is money lost. So every possible second needs to be spent maximized. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator ventana Posted February 10, 2018 Moderator Share Posted February 10, 2018 Huge issue here They (admin) likely do not want APP to have a voice I do NOT believe (nor would I want) and NP representing me - they can credential us similar, but we are not the same..... As for a job description - I do not have one, but i would think there should be some qualifications that are meet >15 years experience as a PA >1 specialty worked >2 jobs worked >40 years of age NOT sub specialty medicine - should be a PCP field rep Ideally possessing a Masters (yup flame me, but there is enough bridge programs around for long enough that if you are education minded you would have a masters by now - I went to Nebraska to get mine) Unfortunately this is required as really who is going to take a AAS credentialed PA seriously when they have physicians and Doctors (DNP) also with arguments.... I would think taking wording from a senior union representative job description would be a good starting point. Elected from Peers (PA only) - re election every 2-3 years, removable by 3/4 vote of current employed PAs Additional $20k in pay per year to hold position with 1-2 non-clinical days per week for every 50 PA's employed in organization. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas5814 Posted February 11, 2018 Author Share Posted February 11, 2018 For now dividing the NPs from the PAs isn't going to happen here. I am taking the "Camel getting his nose under the tent" approach of getting started with what they will give me and then evolving the position into what it should be. If I can get the NPs under the supervision of a PA it will be a big win because, like most large institutions these days, management is full of nurses and , here at least, the NPs outnumber the PAs by 2 to 1 and run the "APP counsel" where I have never seen a PA. I appreciate the help everyone! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk732 Posted February 11, 2018 Share Posted February 11, 2018 A check box should also include actual leadership/management training AND experience...some people think RN=automatic leadership/management ability (some have it innately or have to exercise it as team leaders on the floor, but you see that pretty much anywhere in the real world), but those letters don't equate it. I agree with vent having had some career ADD to give breadth of experience as well. SK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BirdDogPA Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 Perhaps you could also in the role of senior or lead PA focus on improving documentation. Better documentation = higher billing which will increase revenue. At the end of the day money talks and this could make you and the other PAs look really good to admin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BirdDogPA Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 And just one other point I hear people talk a lot about is how nurses and NPs take leadership and admin classes. We do too, I know in my program I had professional development and community medicine classes which focused on "the bussiness of medicine" and public health topics. I'm sure all PAs get similar training. So the idea that a PA may not be as qualified for a leadership position just doesn't make sense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas5814 Posted February 15, 2018 Author Share Posted February 15, 2018 With a lot of help from some smart folks I pulled together a presentation and made it yesterday. What was supposed to take 15-20 minutes ended up going on for 90. Sometime next month I'll be meeting with the VP of clinical operations to do it again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camoman1234 Posted February 15, 2018 Share Posted February 15, 2018 51 minutes ago, sas5814 said: With a lot of help from some smart folks I pulled together a presentation and made it yesterday. What was supposed to take 15-20 minutes ended up going on for 90. Sometime next month I'll be meeting with the VP of clinical operations to do it again. Good news and great job! I met with the VP of clinical operations when I worked for the corp. monster and she was NOT willing to do anything nor listen. That did not last long as they ended up firing her and the big dog VP took over care of operations. Last I heard it was a little better for a corp. institution. Keep us updated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BirdDogPA Posted February 16, 2018 Share Posted February 16, 2018 8 hours ago, sas5814 said: With a lot of help from some smart folks I pulled together a presentation and made it yesterday. What was supposed to take 15-20 minutes ended up going on for 90. Sometime next month I'll be meeting with the VP of clinical operations to do it again. Sounds like progress! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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