marilynpac Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 I'm going to use ExamMaster and get used to doing questions so when it's time for the real McCoy....hopefully it will be old hat.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d2305 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 I used the aapa book, and it was a good review, and cheap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pakev45 Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 friend of mine is a hospitalist PA. he failed miserably as well. after months of studying and lost sleep, he recieved a letter from NCCPA that there was an error in a number of test that were graded, and that he had infact passed the test. don't stop looking until you have an ansewer. the NCCPA is not our friend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joanna.nola Posted April 12, 2012 Share Posted April 12, 2012 I'm just finding this thread (I read the entire 11 pages) and I'm totally flabbergasted. I'm a PA student preparing for the PANCE, and seeing this makes me horrified for our profession. How can a professional testing organization make this mistake and send out the form letter retracting these failures months later and act like everything is alright????? Someone pointed out that if this was the USMLE, there would be hell to pay. How were people compensated after this????? Will AAPA get involved?????? WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING, Y'ALL. I know the AAPA is not the best org, but I will join because I believe in organization and it is *our* organization (for better or for worse) & I believe that an organization is only as strong as the fire put under its a&* by the rank and file. What should we do???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KCMA79 Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 The AAPA response was zip, zero, nada not a peep. I don't think they have even acknowledged it happened. Do? What can we do the NCCPA says jump and PAs jump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joanna.nola Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I'd like to know how we as members of the AAPA can pressure the leadership to take action on these issues. I don't yet understand how the AAPA works and right now I'm focused on finishing school and becoming a good clinician, so I'm not sure I'll be too active for several years. But I hope down the line to be more active in my state and national group. I come from a community organizing and labor organizing background, where pressure on city government and company management did actually make a difference. We won real victories that would not have happened without serious organizing and pressure campaigns with real demands. In the words of the great freedom fighter Frederick Douglass: "Power concedes nothing without a demand." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mainiac Posted April 15, 2012 Share Posted April 15, 2012 Just wondering how PA's are performing now in the PANRE? I have to recert for the 1st time next year (5th yr), as I'm afraid of this happening.... 2nd: Anyone recommend anything that helps with this new exam structure to succeed? I'm in a specialty; thus I hate having to relearn all the primary care stuff; if I wanted a job in primary care I would work in it..... :wink: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cideous Posted April 16, 2012 Share Posted April 16, 2012 Yea, any thoughts on a good home video comprehensive study program for the PANRE? :( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marilynpac Posted April 18, 2012 Share Posted April 18, 2012 Yea, any thoughts on a good home video comprehensive study program for the PANRE? :([/QUO UDMNJ has an online course you can buy...go to their school website.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
palake Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 I found out I passed the PANRE one week after taking it. I did a lot better than I felt walking out of the exam. I studied from the AAPA review book and the Lange Q+A. It is a stressful thing to go through and I think the best thing to do is start to prepare well ahead of time; I actually outlined several chapters from the AAPA review book so it's organized the way I need it to be. If there was anything I didn't understand I checked Wikipedia. Next time I'm also going to take the first exam I can so I don't feel I'm under so much pressure. I have tremendous empathy for all the PA's who were told they failed it by NCCPA- that's just terrible and I don't know how I would have handled that. Can you imagine if we had made that kind of mistake with a patient? Good luck everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pcool Posted April 25, 2012 Share Posted April 25, 2012 Good Luck and well done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
late_bloomer Posted May 1, 2012 Share Posted May 1, 2012 Any news of accountability of wrongful failures? I still remember taking the PANCE and it was very stressful. We need to hold NCCPA accountable. I am not a person who looks to sue and blame others, but that is unacceptable. There should be some reimbursement if you retook the exam. Someone should have lawyer friends for advice.. Good luck to all! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surgblumm Posted May 9, 2012 Share Posted May 9, 2012 Two suggestions. 1. Retake the exam. I agree, there may have been an error in marking and I believe that this past year we have had a 17% fail rate. Some say that the exam has changed and looked more like the PMP's that we took 20 years ago without the highlighter. for this I go to option 2 which still requires option 1. 2. Take the Fitzgerald Health Education Association certification/re-certification exam for NPs as all of the education is taught based on patient management problems. Her students have a 99% pass rate. This is an idea I wish to speak to certain professors about as the education is beyond excellent as is the pharmacology. Bob Blumm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cideous Posted May 11, 2012 Share Posted May 11, 2012 17% Failure rate!!?? That is insane for a recertification test. Good grief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burnpac Posted May 24, 2012 Share Posted May 24, 2012 I have to tell you, what a relief. I passed PANRE #6. This should be the last time as I will be retired by the next one.... :-) Onward to Toronto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burnpac Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 17% Failure rate!!?? That is insane for a recertification test. Good grief. According to the interpretation notes accompanying my results, passing was 379, and that represents the 3rd percentile on their scale. This means that 97 % of my cohort passed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burnpac Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 BTW, I studied the AAPA / PAEA study guide by reading it cover to cover. I then took the test at the beginning of the text (306) questions, and restudied all the questions I missed. I scored 600 (84th percentile). Not bad for a highly specialized surgical PA without a lot of general medicine experience over 31 years outside of urgent care and ER. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surgblumm Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I congratulate Mr. Hanson on his high score meanwhile how does this relate to those who failed? Steve has less than six years as a surgical PA and those years were sent in one sub-speciality. He has 25 years in Occupational Meducine and Urgent Care which relates to the primary role of all PAs , which is to care for the patients within a primary care practice first and a specialty next. I respect those who have the family practice background that keeps them familiar with physiology, pharmacology, pharmaconetics, pediatrics and elder care. This is the meat if what we do. The number of 17 percent is not far off and in speaking to NP educators, their recertification numbers look very much like ours. You cannot be in an OR every day as a first assistant, do no floor work and expect to just memorize answers. I would want more of my PA. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
burnpac Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I congratulate Mr. Hanson on his high score meanwhile how does this relate to those who failed? Steve has less than six years as a surgical PA and those years were sent in one sub-speciality. He has 25 years in Occupational Meducine and Urgent Care which relates to the primary role of all PAs , which is to care for the patients within a primary care practice first and a specialty next. I respect those who have the family practice background that keeps them familiar with physiology, pharmacology, pharmaconetics, pediatrics and elder care. This is the meat if what we do. The number of 17 percent is not far off and in speaking to NP educators, their recertification numbers look very much like ours. You cannot be in an OR every day as a first assistant, do no floor work and expect to just memorize answers. I would want more of my PA. Bob Let me clarify my experience and why I feel it is relevant. The relevance is that I have successfully taken every form of PANRE over six cycles including Pathway II, and have scored consistently well using the test preparation strategy that incorporates a comprehensive review of current general medicine over the 4-5 months prior to taking the exam. Over thirty one years of practice, I have 8 years public health, 6 years OB/GYN, 15 years occ med, 3 years UC and ER, and just over 3 years in surgery. I would hardly categorize occ med as "primary care." First assist is a significant minority of my current position, but the majority of my time is spent in burn and plastic and reconstructive OP clinic, and daily inpatient rounding the burn SICU and med-surg patients, which has given me a decent background in CV, IM, critical care, endocrinology, GI, hematology, pulmonology and nephrology. In my opinion, my suggestions for using PA-centric and PANCE / PANRE specific study materials is better advice than using nursing practice materials. For the first time, I did the surgery focus (which was supposed to be 30% of the content). After the test, I felt that only 10% of the questions were on issues that were surgery related outside of what I would expect a good primary care PA to know. A significant and growing percentage of PAs find themselves like me, in specialty practice. My experience is pretty typical as documented by the AAPA census data. The value that a specialty PA brings to a specialty practice is that they by design, remain grounded to a certain extent in general medicine, which translates into better care for the patients of their service. You can't memorize answers when you don't know the questions in advance. To do well on a test like the PANRE, you have to have a solid background in general medicine. I do want more of a PA, and nearly all the PAs that I know and practice along side of every day deliver consistently high quality care to their patients -- because of their foundation in general medicine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
physasst Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 17% Failure rate!!?? That is insane for a recertification test. Good grief. 17% is not accurate, not historically at least..... Our failure rate is far lower than that. Historically, PANRE rates have been between 94-97% passing. There was not a 17% failure rate. There was a scoring error which was corrected, but as those people did not "really" fail, the rate hasn't really changed. My understanding is that it may have increased by 1-2% over historic rates, but nowhere close to 17%. Bob, do you have a source for that? I'm curious, cause I have never seen that number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surgblumm Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Thank you Steve as you have mentioned what I have been seeking as a presponse. Your career has had many turns and multiple experiences just as mine in surgery gave me time in the examination, first assisting, ICU management and floor responsibilities in every surgical subspeaciality wxcept Robotis because I am jus getting too old. The foundation, which is what I was seeking for out colleageues who asked the question, has and will always, by dint of our training and education, be focused upon general medicine , which is a portion of the care that Steve gives in burn care and all speciality PA need to be knowledgeable about in order to prevent charges of "failure to diagnose." We cannot dispose of our roots and primary education for the sake of being a master first assistant. Steve is well suited for his job because burns and I have worked the Burn Center at Brooke Army hospital in San Antonio requires everything that he mentioned as all are potential factors in increased M&M. The second comment was made concerning percentage failed last year in PANRE. I will write the NCCPA and get the official comment which I will explain will be posted. Anecdotally this higher number has come up and the responses by so many good PAs werte devastating which is why I feel along with some of the senior educators and researchers that we may need a new approach.It always was 3-4 % but last year the number changed and using the same polymetrics would not be causitive. This is probably the longest thread (15 pages plus that I have ever seen on any issue, including title change. Thank you for your indulgence and ability to clarify my observations. Bob Blumm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIPPER Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I don't believe for a moment 17% fail rate is accurate. Thats is just conjecture. The failure of some were nothing more than a scoring error. Inconvienencing, but not earth-shaking, landscape altering as being made out to be. Judging by how toned down this whole discussion has become (I see no follow-up of discussion of lawsuits, social campaigns) was there even mention of this in Toronto? Tests evolve. Procedures evolve (CAQ)..change can be good if it leads to a more well rounded clinician... Any thought that a more difficult test may actually make the PA study harder/longer and may actually be more beneficial? Name one PA out there who feels failing was justified....just one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
surgblumm Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Brian, I agree. That is why I am going to write a letter to janet and get the official scoop.I don't want to see a more difficult or longer exam but only ask that a format might help the testers in their preparation and the manner that they choose to study. I have done official reviews on three of the books but they are becoming better each year. those that explain the response are more helpful as they give a rationale but whoever this group is and for whatever reason they are gun shy, it remains our responsibility to place them in a positive comfort zone and to do so quickly.Like your. I am sure, my passion is PAs and their positive image to the patient, all the stakeholders and mostly themselves. Bob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LIPPER Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 Bob, a thoughtful reply. You, Burnpac, and anyone else are like soldiers in a way (w/o offending them) involved in the trenches doing work the majority of us don't, so for that you're all appreciated. The bluster from both sides is cumbersome bc quite simply nobody REALLY seems to knows the truth... It's all Obama-Bush's fault... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
physasst Posted May 31, 2012 Share Posted May 31, 2012 I don't believe for a moment 17% fail rate is accurate. Thats is just conjecture. The failure of some were nothing more than a scoring error. Inconvienencing, but not earth-shaking, landscape altering as being made out to be. Judging by how toned down this whole discussion has become (I see no follow-up of discussion of lawsuits, social campaigns) was there even mention of this in Toronto? Tests evolve. Procedures evolve (CAQ)..change can be good if it leads to a more well rounded clinician... Any thought that a more difficult test may actually make the PA study harder/longer and may actually be more beneficial? Name one PA out there who feels failing was justified....just one. Yep, and as of 2003, Hooker did a history of the NCCPA with a breakdown of historic scoring, and the PANRE, at least historically has always had rates in the mid 90's...Now, the PANCE is different, and has had higher failure rates historically than the PANRE.... Also, as with any testing agency, the NCCPA has to use methods to ensure rigor and accuracy. One of these is an Angoff method which resets scores and helps to determine accurate passing rates. You cannot have a 100% pass rate. It would essentially invalidate the exam. http://pahx.org/pdf/NCCPA_History_Article.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.