dndandrea Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 So i've been very fortunate enough to be accepted to a few schools in my area. One of them is very local, very cheap ($25,000 vs $70,000+), and is the most established program (one of the oldest in the US) in the state. So you're probably questioning yourself: why wouldn't he want to go here? Well, i've been spoiled from all of these other interviews i've attended. All of the other schools left me very impressed with their facilities, simulation labs, and high end technology. The school I'm concerned about really left me unimpressed after the interview and tour. They didn't tell me anything about their program, their facility appeared to be outdated and small, their simulation lab was almost nonexistent, no cadaver lab, and just the overall presentation of their program left me unimpressed. On top of that, their past 5 year PANCE rate is in the mid 80s... Now the positive side, they are the most established program in the area and they are located around many highly reputable hospitals that focus on teaching. With this being said, they probably have much better clinical rotations than the newer surrounding schools have. I've heard and read on many occasions that you learn the most during your clinical rotations. So should I focus on that, price, and how close it is to my family? Or should I be worried about their facilities and PANCE rates? Basically i'm asking how much focus should I put on a program's facilities? How important were the facilities and didactic year for you as a PA student? I don't just want to slide by school and pass the PANCE. I want to be well educated and prepared for the field when I get out of school. Bonus question: A good chunk of the classes in this program have PA students and non PA students. In those cases, the teachers are not PAs. I was always under the impression that the majority of your classes are taught be PAs/MDs that only teach PA students as well as occasionally practice as a PA/MD. Is this a concern or is this normal? Sorry for such a naive question! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted February 7, 2015 Moderator Share Posted February 7, 2015 1st yr is basically self-taught wherever you go to school. Pance rates are also more about individual students than programs. good students do well at poor programs and poor students do badly at great programs. rotation selection is critical. some programs have a very poor selection of rotation sites with not enough core sites like ob and peds and some have places where PA students function as medical assistants, etc I think I know which programs you are considering based on your discussion and I would choose the older, more established program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dndandrea Posted February 7, 2015 Author Share Posted February 7, 2015 1st yr is basically self-taught wherever you go to school. Pance rates are also more about individual students than programs. good students do well at poor programs and poor students do badly at great programs. Thanks for your input. I work with a few PAs that graduated from this school and surprisingly they all said something along these lines. I consider myself a good student and put enormous amount of time into learning, but I was just curious if the facilities are an important supplement to one's education in becoming a PA. I am a hands-on learner. I question how beneficial it will or will not be to me. I guess that's a question i'll have to answer on my own since everyone is different. I've always been learning towards this program as it was my #1 choice. Thanks again, I appreciate your advice! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHU-CH Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 As EMED notes, you can teach the didactic portion of the curriculum on top of milk crates in the baseball dugout. Success in PA school is about 95% dependent upon individual effort. The PANCE pass rate is a little off. Do you have a satisfactory explanation for this? One explanation might be if they were trying to get under-represented students though the program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cinntsp Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 I would be way more concerned about a 5 year pass rate in the 80s than anything else. That tells you the program has major issues. Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PA2016! Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 For what its worth, I think that simulation labs are more of a selling point than anything else. Simulation labs/dummies do not and will not teach you medicine, I don't even think it comes close. REAL patients and exposure is how you truly take what you lean in the classroom and apply it in the real world, not sim labs.......But what do I know, I am still a 1st year.... this is just my 2 cents now that I worked with both... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joelseff Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 My graduating class has a FTP PANCE and of 80 something %. There were a couple of people who rushed taking the PANCE and a few failed but almost all passed on the 2nd try. One person sadly was so distraught about failing that they never took it again. They're back to being a paramedic now. They admitted to me that they realized PA wasn't for them. So there are reasons why FTP scores would be low. But for those of us who passed first try (I did and I was one of the ones to rush into it. Took it 2 weeks after graduation) It didn't matter. So yeah it's a lot on the individual. Hate to say but the ones who failed didn't surprise me since they were also the one who struggled most doing school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joelseff Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 I say pick the school with the best rotations at teaching hospitals. Some programs give you a preceptor to follow around during inpatient rotation. Ours had us on a team with med students, residents and fellows and attendings and we all got a panel of pts to care for and be responsible for. That really was my favorite thing about my program. We had simulation labs but used actors more and that was OK. But the actual quasi OJT type training during rotations was gold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dndandrea Posted February 7, 2015 Author Share Posted February 7, 2015 Thanks for all the comments. My graduating class has a FTP PANCE and of 80 something %. There were a couple of people who rushed taking the PANCE and a few failed but almost all passed on the 2nd try. One person sadly was so distraught about failing that they never took it again. They're back to being a paramedic now. They admitted to me that they realized PA wasn't for them. So there are reasons why FTP scores would be low. But for those of us who passed first try (I did and I was one of the ones to rush into it. Took it 2 weeks after graduation) It didn't matter. So yeah it's a lot on the individual. Hate to say but the ones who failed didn't surprise me since they were also the one who struggled most doing school. Yea, one of the PAs that I work with (who graduated from this school) mentioned that the school accepted some people that shouldn't have been there and they never dropped or failed out. The average class size is around 30. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joelseff Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 I guess some people said all the right things on paper and interviewed well but when it came time to grind the truth comes out. That's how it is with everything but schools really need to be more selective even if that means cutting down the class size to try to ensure everyone comes up on top. But perhaps the draw of getting 20 more students paying 60k plus each per year is too enticing to turn away. Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbrothers98 Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 So a choice between inexpensive &seasoned, but poor facilities, close to home, also 6/30 dont pass PANCE on first take, probably quality clinical rotations, anecdotal evidence from prior attendees that success can be had. vs Expensive, bells and whistles, nice facilities, far from home, high PANCE pass rate, unclear rotation availability. As for non PA/MD instructors, not unheard of. Depends on the program but not unusual for A&P, pharmacology, biochem, micro, genetics, ethics to be taught by other. Good luck on your choice. G Brothers PA-C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted February 7, 2015 Moderator Share Posted February 7, 2015 As for non PA/MD instructors, not unheard of. Depends on the program but not unusual for A&P, pharmacology, biochem, micro, genetics, ethics to be taught by other. Good luck on your choice. G Brothers PA-C agree. very common for pharm to be taught by pharmd (mine was MD, PharmD), and A+P to be taught by PhD anatomist ( mine was MD, PhD(anatomy)) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PACdan Posted February 7, 2015 Share Posted February 7, 2015 I don't know how it was back in the day, but a lot of programs seem to be using the last month of school as a review/PANCE prep time. Our school brings everyone back from rotations and has them constantly reviewing while working on a capstone project. I'm sure that helps with FTP rates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted February 7, 2015 Moderator Share Posted February 7, 2015 I don't know how it was back in the day, but a lot of programs seem to be using the last month of school as a review/PANCE prep time. Our school brings everyone back from rotations and has them constantly reviewing while working on a capstone project. I'm sure that helps with FTP rates. before capstone projects existed programs did a week of exit exams with required oral/written/practical exams, all must pass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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