jukixel Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Hi, I am aiming to apply to PA school in fall of 2014. Right now, I am an undergraduate completing my majors and I am about to start volunteering at a hospice that will train me to become a Direct Care Level 1 volunteer. I have also volunteered at a hospital in the past, working with patients in recreational therapy. Is volunteering enough and is it considered direct patient care? Or do I need to become certified as an EMT/CNA or any other profession in order to have a chance at PA school? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timon Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 There are some schools that either don't require paid healthcare experience or recommend but don't require it. Most programs in California don't require HCE however you'll need a GPA at 3.4+ to have a shot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jukixel Posted December 20, 2012 Author Share Posted December 20, 2012 Do you know about programs in NYC? I'm planning to apply to some with HCE required but I'm not sure if the volunteer I'm doing is enough. I'm also going to try and shadow someone, but I would like to get into a program without having to spend a bunch of time getting certified for something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted December 20, 2012 Moderator Share Posted December 20, 2012 Possible? yes recommended, no. the whole concept of pa school is that the education builds on a foundation of prior experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sartort Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Ask the programs you are interested in if their website isn't specific. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will352ns Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Is it possible....yes. Is it likely...no. It makes your goal a bit more of an uphill battle. Even programs that do not require HCE will select applicants with HCE over ones without; if all things are fairly equal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_me Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Again, its possible to get in with no experience With that said, no you do not NEED certification in anything if you already have somewhere that is allowing you to gain direct patient care. I worked as a medical assistant in internal medicine but I am not a certified MA.....never even went to a program. The physician was simply willing to train me and everything worked out. Is the hospice work enough? For some programs it is. Does it count as direct patient care? Well typically if you are physically involved in the care of a patient then yes. Will programs accept this as direct patient care? Dunno. You should contact the programs you are interested in with a formal job description of what your duties will be and let the programs tell you. Its easy to say RN, CNA, EMT, MA blah blah blah are definite forms, but things like scribes, unit clerks, certain volunteer positions are iffy. I mean they can count as healthcare experience but not direct patient care--some programs differentiate while others do not... Hope that somewhat answers your questions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cinntsp Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 Is it possible....yes. Is it likely...no. It makes your goal a bit more of an uphill battle. Even programs that do not require HCE will select applicants with HCE over ones without; if all things are fairly equal. That's not really true. If you have a high GPA, extra curriculars, volunteering, shadowing, and so forth you will likely get in somewhere unless you bomb every interview. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beattie228 Posted December 20, 2012 Share Posted December 20, 2012 It is possible, but not advised. PA school isn't long enough to teach you how to efficiently interact with patients like medical school can. The self confidence to take control of the dialogue between a patient and a member of the healthcare team comes with experiences. Regardless of how you go about interacting with patients, you will certainly be glad you did in the long run. Likewise, keep in mind that most of the applicants you're going up against will have healthcare experience (with the exception of a few schools who do not place an emphasis on patient contact hours). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WanderlustPA Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 I did it, so yes it certainly is. I am confident my lack of experience will not hurt me one bit. Not in PA school, and not in the field following graduation. One PA program director I talked to had run several years of stats of the students at his school and found no correlation between success in PA school and HCE. In fact, he said he preferred students WITHOUT experience, b/c some of those with experience would come in thinking they knew it all, or refuse to change from the way they learned things. Don't listen to the nay-sayers. As for the specific programs, call or email them. I did that, and was able to eliminate ones that didn't require HCE, but made it apparent that without it I wouldn't stand much of a chance of getting an interview. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_me Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 Glad you feel confident, and Im not trying to mess with that...honestly but I have talked to a few people who certainly wish they had more prior experience and/or higher levels of experience before going in...myself included (definitely wish I had more medication experience beyond pharm tech) and while that PD preferred students without, its obvious that not all programs feel that way which is why many of them require it. Plus just because you did it, doesnt mean others can. I feel a person is doing disservice to fellow applicants by discouraging people from getting hce. Lack of prior hce can limit where you can apply, which sucks if youre already limited by other factors such as location or cost. Plus, as someone who has taken a physical exam course, the more skill you have = the less time you need to practice/study that skill which means more time you have to practice/study something you dont know. Guess what Im getting at, is if someone has the opportunity to get hce.....its better to encourage than to discourage seeing as how the experience can only help, while lack of experience can hinder some. I did it, so yes it certainly is. I am confident my lack of experience will not hurt me one bit. Not in PA school, and not in the field following graduation. One PA program director I talked to had run several years of stats of the students at his school and found no correlation between success in PA school and HCE. In fact, he said he preferred students WITHOUT experience, b/c some of those with experience would come in thinking they knew it all, or refuse to change from the way they learned things. Don't listen to the nay-sayers. As for the specific programs, call or email them. I did that, and was able to eliminate ones that didn't require HCE, but made it apparent that without it I wouldn't stand much of a chance of getting an interview. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will352ns Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 That's not really true. If you have a high GPA, extra curriculars, volunteering, shadowing, and so forth you will likely get in somewhere unless you bomb every interview. Note I said...all things being fairly equal. I'm not saying it cannot happen, but it does give an applicant an edge. No HCE makes it an uphill battle. Research the demographics of accepted classes for schools that have little to no HCE requirements. You will see that even in those schools, the majority of the accepted class had large amounts of paid HCE. During my research for schools, I actually called many of the programs I was interested in and asked the question. Of those schools, they all painted the same picture. To the OP, I'm not trying to be discouraging. If you can get a cert or pick up up a MA position, it WILL help your application; regardless of where you apply. You may even learn something...which is the real reson for HCE in the first place. It will also open the opportunity to apply to more schools. I will rephrase-Is it possible...yes. Does it narrow your options...yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Will352ns Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 I did it, so yes it certainly is. I am confident my lack of experience will not hurt me one bit. Not in PA school, and not in the field following graduation. One PA program director I talked to had run several years of stats of the students at his school and found no correlation between success in PA school and HCE. In fact, he said he preferred students WITHOUT experience, b/c some of those with experience would come in thinking they knew it all, or refuse to change from the way they learned things. Horrible advice...sorry. That ADCOM was only looking at PANCE rates...a standardized test that doesn't measure how a PA will FUNCTION, only gross knowledge. Purely opinion but schools like that should be avoided. Most of the "know it alls" are easily weeded out during the interview process if the ADCOM's ask the right questions. For most folks, HCE opens their eyes as to how much they need to learn. No HCE means you don't even know what you don't know yet. Again, purely opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted December 21, 2012 Moderator Share Posted December 21, 2012 horrible advice...sorry. That adcom was only looking at pance rates...a standardized test that doesn't measure how a pa will function, only gross knowledge. Purely opinion but schools like that should be avoided. Most of the "know it alls" are easily weeded out during the interview process if the adcom's ask the right questions. For most folks, hce opens their eyes as to how much they need to learn. No hce means you don't even know what you don't know yet. Again, purely opinion. well stated ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marktheshark89 Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 You can definitely be accepted to PA school without substantial or credentialed HCE. That being said, the more HCE the better (for reasons mentioned above). I wasn't credentialed in anything, but still managed to amass around 1800 hours of direct patient contact experience (as an ED volunteer in a community hospital, mental health intern, and geriatric rehab intern) and around 200 hours of PA shadowing (just in summers and breaks during my undergrad career). I definitely feel more comfortable interacting with patients than many of my peers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WanderlustPA Posted December 21, 2012 Share Posted December 21, 2012 I'm just trying to encourage the OP, you guys. After reading posts on this forum, I was very discouraged in thinking that I was not going to get accepted anywhere without HCE. This is a career change for me, and I did not want to spend a year working for peanuts if I didn't have to, so I gave it a shot to apply after the bulk of my pre-reqs were done without any HCE, and I got in. While it's true that just because I did it, doesn't mean someone else can, because there are many other factors at play, it is my opinion, and obviously the opinion of some PA program directors out there that a lack of HCE is not a deal-breaker. Years of experience does not always mean a better practitioner, and that can be said for any profession. Many other things, such as effort & passion, are much more important than hours on the job. There will be great, as well as not-so-great PA's coming from any and every school in the country, with and without prior experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 26, 2012 Share Posted December 26, 2012 I think working in hospice is a good experience. Not the best but still good. It will allow you to see the ugly side of medicine and really make you realize whether you want to be a PA or not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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