sas5814 Posted May 24, 2018 Share Posted May 24, 2018 In another forum someone made mention of Puerto Rico wanting to permit foreign med grads who failed the USMLE to become PAs if they pass the NCCPA exam. That isn't what this is about (though it is a discussion). I have thought from time to time there would be some advantages to being certified as an NP depending on where you are located. Wouldn't it be an interesting experiment if both professions respective certifying agencies allowed either of us to take the others certifying exam? I just wonder how those results would shake out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon, PA-C Posted May 24, 2018 Share Posted May 24, 2018 1 hour ago, sas5814 said: In another forum someone made mention of Puerto Rico wanting to permit foreign med grads who failed the USMLE to become PAs if they pass the NCCPA exam. That isn't what this is about (though it is a discussion). I have thought from time to time there would be some advantages to being certified as an NP depending on where you are located. Wouldn't it be an interesting experiment if both professions respective certifying agencies allowed either of us to take the others certifying exam? I just wonder how those results would shake out. This has been tried before to some degree. The Columbia DNP program had their graduates take a watered down version of the USMLE Step 3 exam. From what I recall, they had a 50% failure rate. For comparison, MD PGY-1s pass the step 3 at a rate of 98% Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted May 24, 2018 Moderator Share Posted May 24, 2018 I think this would be valid if pance still had a practical portion. the issue with pance now is that almost anyone can pass it by taking a review course and reading a few books. I bet I could get a good paramedic or rn to pass it without going to pa school with a few weeks of tutoring on high yield material. remember passing is set very low. it is the training, not the test. too many nps would pass pance. the vast majority of PAs would pass an fnp exam. it would be a total clulster. "are you a real pa or just someone who passed the test". it would make us look very bad when "PAs" (who never went to pa school) did really stupid stuff. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk732 Posted May 24, 2018 Share Posted May 24, 2018 A lot of us without nursing backgrounds might do poorly if there were a lot of "nursing fluff" on the exam vs just plain old everyday medicine, IMO...for what it's worth. SK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HmTwoPA Posted May 24, 2018 Share Posted May 24, 2018 15 minutes ago, sk732 said: A lot of us without nursing backgrounds might do poorly if there were a lot of "nursing fluff" on the exam vs just plain old everyday medicine, IMO...for what it's worth. SK Just curious what you consider “nursing fluff”? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas5814 Posted May 24, 2018 Author Share Posted May 24, 2018 I would think he is referring to questions more about nursing knowledge and tasks and less related to practicing medicine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAAdmission Posted May 24, 2018 Share Posted May 24, 2018 27 minutes ago, HmTwoPA said: Just curious what you consider “nursing fluff”? Nurses become valuable members of the healthcare team in direct proportion to their ability to forget a lot of the silly-assed stuff they learn in nursing school. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brooks Posted May 25, 2018 Share Posted May 25, 2018 20 hours ago, EMEDPA said: I think this would be valid if pance still had a practical portion. the issue with pance now is that almost anyone can pass it by taking a review course and reading a few books. I bet I could get a good paramedic or rn to pass it without going to pa school with a few weeks of tutoring on high yield material. remember passing is set very low. it is the training, not the test. too many nps would pass pance. the vast majority of PAs would pass an fnp exam. it would be a total clulster. "are you a real pa or just someone who passed the test". it would make us look very bad when "PAs" (who never went to pa school) did really stupid stuff. Really think it's that easy? I agree it would look bad if non-PAs took a review course and passed it. But I hope it wouldn't be so easy that you could take a group of people that didn't attend PA school teach them for a few weeks and they could pass it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sas5814 Posted May 25, 2018 Author Share Posted May 25, 2018 7 minutes ago, Brooks said: Really think it's that easy? I agree it would look bad if non-PAs took a review course and passed it. But I hope it wouldn't be so easy that you could take a group of people that didn't attend PA school teach them for a few weeks and they could pass it. I pay a dollar to see the NCCPA's response if that happened... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted May 26, 2018 Moderator Share Posted May 26, 2018 7 hours ago, Brooks said: Really think it's that easy? I agree it would look bad if non-PAs took a review course and passed it. But I hope it wouldn't be so easy that you could take a group of people that didn't attend PA school teach them for a few weeks and they could pass it. yup, I believe passing is 54%. slightly > half correct. you would need someone with a basic fund of medical knowledge like a medic, RN, RT to start with , but I think I could get any of these folks to pass pance in a month with a review course, a few books, and some tutoring focusing on high yield stuff. they should already know the a+p, ekgs, emergency medicine, and a lot of the pharm, so really what you would need to teach is clinical medicine. you could do it by system. remember, we are shooting for 54%, not 100%. once again though, it's the training, not the test. ever see Catch me if you can with Leonardo dicaprio? based on a true story. part of the story involves him pretending to be a lawyer, studying for the bar for a month, and passing. same deal here I think. just foundational stuff. Prior to 1997 pance was a real test. 3 practicals, 3 written portions. it was boards WEEK, not boards afternoon. don't think anyone could BS through that. I want to PA school, did well, and thought it was hard when given in that format. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ERCat Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 I will be honest, I don’t know if most FNPs would have an easy time passing the PANCE. I did an NP practice board exam and let’s just say, the fluff rumor is true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lkth487 Posted May 26, 2018 Share Posted May 26, 2018 The question is does it matter? I'm sure I would have trouble passing Step 1 right now (in fact I'm pretty sure I'd fail). But is it the training or the test? I'm sure if I studied for it, or if you studied for Step 1 for that matter, given enough time we could both pass it. Every test has its own focus - just because a test is "harder" doesn't mean it's superior or relevant to being a good provider. I am not sure how relevant PANCE is to the PA who works in neonatology or neurosurgery. I know 90% of Step 3 will be completely irrelevant to my future in a few years. Step 1 makes sense because it's the foundation of your entire knowledge base - it's something you build on regardless of where you end up - but me memorizing JCN 8 guidelines for Step 3 when I'm not ever going to be even seeing an adult patient? Completely useless and I've already forgotten. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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