advisor highly discouraging towards PA, now has me upset. any similar stories?

[user1234556]

i just met with my advisor (biological sciences). he was looking at my transcript (i have a 4.0) and asked me how my GRE went (1220) and paused and said.. "so why aren't you applying to medical school, again?"

 

i proceeded to explain myself and these are, verbatim, some of the phrases that he used throughout the conversation (not all at once obviously but throughout a 20min talk)

 

"your grades, GRE score, ACT score.. it's all a very good indication that you'd do well on the MCAT"

[after a question regarding getting hospital experience] "i'd get an MCAT study book and begin looking through it"

"PAs originally served the purpose of seeing 1000 kids with colds during cold season when the MD needed to be out doing what the MD does. i'd see a PA over a cold or a sprain, but as for anything serious or specialized, i want an MD. i don't want a PA working on me."

"you'll never be your own boss"

"but you're so smart"

"all that has to happen is the licenses get yanked like they have in other states and everyone has to move" (what is he referring to?) etc etc

 

i'm really discouraged right now. i felt confident going into his office and left very discouraged. should i suck it up and take the MCAT?

[rahna]

It's easy to take comments out of context, especially when they are all grouped together like that. It sounds like this advisor doesn't have all of his facts straight for one (PAs were originally utilized for seeing kids with colds? News to me!), but in an attempt to give him the benefit of the doubt, I would say that perhaps he is just trying to get you to consider exactly what it is you want out of your career. It's true that as a PA you will never be your own boss in the sense that an SP will always be necessary, and it's also true that there are people out there who share your advisor's opinion about only wanting to see a PA for minor maladies. However, there are many who have no problem seeing a PA insead of an MD (I know some who prefer it!).

 

My advice would be not to be discouraged, but instead to do the research, shadowing, or whatever else it takes to convince yourself that you are headed down the right path. PAs and MDs do many of the same things, but their job descriptions are not identical. It's all about what is the best fit for you. Keep in mind that just because you have the ability to do well on the MCAT, go to med school, and become an MD doesn't mean that it's necessarily right for you.

 

Good luck!

[Zeus]

APH,

 

Well first off, don't let one advisor get you down. This will not be the last person that puts down your ideas.

 

Second, you have a great GPA and GRE but you would not be doing yourself a disservice by applying PA school. PA school is competitive and there are alot of prospective PA's and current PA students that have great GPA's and GRE and chose the PA path because it was their best fit.

 

Third, I am going to have disagree with your advisor on a couple of issues. PA's (at least in rural cali) can be their own boss, own their own clinic and practice how they and their supervising doc agree to practice. They also see alot more than common colds and sprains. Depending on the area of medicine, PA's play a large role in medicine.

 

Lastly and the most important, take the MCAT. It can't hurt to keep your options open. Maybe you will find that med school will be a better fit. Taking the MCAT does nothing but leave you with more options. Your decision should be based on what is the best profession for you, not what your stats dictate.

 

Well that’s my rant!! Good luck on what ever you decide

 

Zeus

[EMEDPA]

find a pre-health advisor at a place that has a pa program.

don't ever speak with that yahoo again as it would be a waste of time.

take the mcat only if you want to go to medschool. if you take it study for it. taking it cold "just to see how you would do" almost always results in a poor score. a good later score does not erase this as all scores are reported and some places avg them so a really bad score and a really good score averages to an avg score which gets you in nowhere.

the mcat is a test that you have tyo study specifically for as in you need to study the format of the test, etc to do well, not just the material.

[JenGintheED]

"all that has to happen is the licenses get yanked like they have in other states and everyone has to move" (what is he referring to?)

 

Not sure what he is referring to... I've never heard of state-wide license-yanking requiring everyone to move. Does HE know what he is talking about? ;)

[bradtPA]

You have to do whats best for you. I would say take the MCAT if you really want to go to med school, but skip it otherwise. The study time plus the cost of the test isn't worth a practice session. You can try a free practice test at http://www.aamc.org/students/mcat/practicetests.htm.

 

For me, PA is my best option since I have now joined the ranks of the AARP:D. When you are about to graduate from PA school, and your age is greater than a maxxed out MCAT, PA is a better option:). 250K is not an unrealistic amount of debt for MD/DO schools, I would be paying that back with my social security check:p.

[user1234556]

i appreciate all of the advice, guys. NO i do not want to take the MCAT and put in the work that will be required to study for it. prepping for the GRE was time consuming enough and the test itself was brutal for me personally. i have no desire to take the MCAT. i also have no problem with what others think about me or my profession, only my personal satisfaction with my decision. i have many good reasons for choosing PA over MD, though i'm confident in my ability to do well in either arena. i simply believe PA is more in line with what i want out of a career. i just have never before come in contact with an individual that was as blatantly trying to deter me from my goal as he was. he was very nice, don't get me wrong, i've just never had anyone say to my face those things. it was an awkward few minutes with him.

 

thanks again

[Guest lisnek]

i had a professor at UC Davis who said i'd never be happy as a PA. i was in the process of getting a graduate degree in Nutrition Science at OHSU in Portland. i was planning on doing clinical nutrition to get some experience before considering fully PA school.

 

she said i didn't have the personality for being a PA. she was right. in fact, a trauma surgeon i was close to said the very same thing. they were both right.

 

bottom line. make the right choice and never look back. live life w little to no regrets. i am still desperately working on this.

[user1234556]

she said i didn't have the personality for being a PA. she was right. in fact, a trauma surgeon i was close to said the very same thing. they were both right.

 

so what exactly are you saying? that you wish you had listened to them?

[acozadd]

i had a professor at UC Davis who said i'd never be happy as a PA. i was in the process of getting a graduate degree in Nutrition Science at OHSU in Portland. i was planning on doing clinical nutrition to get some experience before considering fully PA school.

 

she said i didn't have the personality for being a PA. she was right. in fact, a trauma surgeon i was close to said the very same thing. they were both right.

 

bottom line. make the right choice and never look back. live life w little to no regrets. i am still desperately working on this.

 

Can you expand on this? What about your personality isn't a good match for being a PA? I dont think any particular personality is needed, besides the ability to adapt to the patient you are dealing with.

 

To the OP- I too am considered a "strong" student with a 4.0 and my advisor never once questioned my decision (and im fairly close with her as I also had her as a professor for 2 semesters). It's a personal choice, and for me PA school just fits in with my future plans much better. You have to weigh the positives and negatives of each, and pick which is best for you. Dont let someone else's opinion (likely uninformed) lead you away from your goals.

[just_me]

Its one thing to tell someone they dont have the personality to do something....its a total different thing to tell someone notto do it for XYZ reasons and all those reasons are wrong. That advisor wasnt discussing you they were discussing the profession. Now had their information truly been correct I would say "run" BUT since they werent correct I say "run from them"...........

 

The fact that they think you would do well on the MCAT is a thing an advisor should point out but to say ".....but youre so smart" insinuates that you have to be smart to be an MD but not a PA.....and it shows that even though they are an advisor employed by an institute of higher learning........they arent either

 

Advisors are suppose to advise you on how to reach your goals NOT how to reach goals they wish they had tried or goals that they think you should have.

 

Any who, I would tell them "...thanks but no thanks. I would like a new advisor because I feel that you are attempting to advise me about a career choice that you do not have even a basic understanding of and with the situation being that way....how can you accurately advise me." and then I would leave.....

 

Keep in mind...thats if it was me

[Guest lisnek]

There are many posts/threads about PA personalities, Physician personalities. Please do a search. I don't want to discourage. I agree - don't let anyone else's opinion drive yours.

 

I wished I had researched it more before I made the choice. I wish I had been premed at UCD. Perhaps I lacked confidence. In fact, I know I did. They knew i'd be happier and more content, complete if you will being the one in charge. I wished i listened.

 

Now i feel like that old man in the book "The Giving Tree" by Shel Silverstein. lol. life is a long, strange trip and sometimes takes you to places you never thought you'd be.

 

For those of you who don't like my "frontal" tactless posts, don't PM me. It pisses me off and wastes my time! Even more so, it wastes your time. This forum is an open forum. Both opinions, optimistic or pessimistic, are permitted!

[primadonna22274]

Aww Lis, tell 'em what you really think, don't sugar-coat it!

;) I like your snarkiness personally. I think I liked it in the classroom too (but I can't remember, were you the one I told to put the knitting away?! If so I am still a little embarrassed at how much that irked me.)

There is too much hand-holding that goes on in this forum sometimes. I'm guilty of it myself. I think often we need to just tell it like it is...and let the dust fall where it will.

OP, this is your choice. I'm sorry your advisor discouraged you, but consider there may be some insight there that you're blind to presently.

MCAT isn't that bad. (I can say that now because I've suffered through it twice.) I wouldn't want to take it again if I don't have to but it's not a very convincing reason for not applying to med school.

If PA is what you really want, then go for it, unapologetically. Your advisor may disagree with you but so what? It's your life. My advisor now (12 years later) is encouraging me to go on to med school. He never told me to go one way or the other...just provided information and support. Kind of like my marriage counselor come to think of it. Perhaps with more direction I would have made a different choice in either situation but then I might misplace blame for a wrong decision.

And really, to be or not to be a PA or a physician or a comedian or a baker or whatever we decide is not a right or wrong decision in the literal sense of the word--but we do hope to make the best decision possible.

Ever see the movie "Dead Again" with Kenneth Branagh, Emma Thompson and Robin Williams? Mid-to-late 90s if I recall. Robin Williams is a psychiatrist who's lost his license because of sexual indiscretion and now runs a convenience store. Branagh is a detective trying to solve a decades-old murder. The detective goes to see the psychiatrist, I forget what about, but Williams says something to him that always stuck with me: "Figure out what you are and be that." If we could all do so well as to figure out what we are and be that, I think we'd all be happier.

Good luck

L.

 

 

For those of you who don't like my "frontal" tactless posts, don't PM me. It pisses me off and wastes my time! Even more so, it wastes your time. This forum is an open forum. Both opinions, optimistic or pessimistic, are permitted!

[EMEDPA]

"Williams says something to him that always stuck with me: "Figure out what you are and be that." "

 

one of my favorite movies.

the line was about smoking. either you decide to be a smoker or you decide not to be one.

kind of like yoda. there is do or do not. there is no try.

[primadonna22274]

Aw E, I knew you'd straighten me out (you've mentioned you liked this movie before.)

Just did some research. Can't believe it was 1991. Well, time flies.

Couldn't find a clip of the scene but did find a dialog, and yes, you're right. Figure out which one you are and be that.

Brilliant piece of advice IMO.

 

"Williams says something to him that always stuck with me: "Figure out what you are and be that." "

 

one of my favorite movies.

the line was about smoking. either you decide to be a smoker or you decide not to be one.

kind of like yoda. there is do or do not. there is no try.

[LESH]

i'm really discouraged right now. i felt confident going into his office and left very discouraged. should i suck it up and take the MCAT?

 

It's an academic advisors job to help point out a student's strengths, weaknesses and options (granted yours has an interesting way of doing it) It's ultimately your call on what you do with your life. This won't be the last time someone is going to say that about Med school vs PA school. They say that even after you become a PA. Being a PA doesn't meet everyone's needs when it comes to wanting to practice medicine.

 

What do you want to do? You seem to have options. Like others have said, if there is even a remote chance in your mind that you want to be a physician you at least owe it to yourself to check out the options. Putting in the time and sacrifice to become a PA only to find out that you want more than what PA has to offer can be a real drag...

 

Don't be discouraged, take the advice FWIW to you. If you want to become a PA then do it.

 

LesH

[Evan]

On the subject of academic advisers: I had almost the exact opposite experience. The guy I talked to about being a PA was very helpful. He helped me find more information, filled me in on options for my BS degree and medical experience.

 

On the subject of PA vs MD: this is a rehash of an old topic but I agree with LesH. You owe it to yourself to fully explore your options before taking yourself down a path that will define your life. Once you have done that exploration to your satisfaction you'll know what is best for you.

 

Best of Luck!

 

Evan

[Joelseff]

If I had your stats, I would SERIOUSLY consider MEd School too. Just my $.02

[EMEDPA]

If I had your stats, I would SERIOUSLY consider MEd School too. Just my $.02

 

also depends on whether or not they have health care experience.

good grades and no HCE is a tough sell for pa school and a shoe in for medschool.

[Shawn_Not_Sean]

also depends on whether or not they have health care experience.

good grades and no HCE is a tough sell for pa school and a shoe in for medschool.

 

P.S. I hate that fact.

 

********** Generalization Ahead, TURN BACK NOW IF YOU DON'T WANT TO HEAR IT*********

 

I feel that that is why many doctors have no people-skills OR really have no understanding of bed-side manner.

 

******* Generalization Complete *********

[just_me]

P.S. I hate that fact.

 

********** Generalization Ahead, TURN BACK NOW IF YOU DON'T WANT TO HEAR IT*********

 

I feel that that is why many doctors have no people-skills OR really have no understanding of bed-side manner.

 

******* Generalization Complete *********

 

They are expected to develop those skills and many do develop those skills during those years as a resident....supposedly.....

 

For some though the residency is a moment of clarity:rolleyes: I have a friend that is going through a surgical residency (almost done) and now has NO desire to be an MD anymore:eek:

[acozadd]

P.S. I hate that fact.

 

********** Generalization Ahead, TURN BACK NOW IF YOU DON'T WANT TO HEAR IT*********

 

I feel that that is why many doctors have no people-skills OR really have no understanding of bed-side manner.

 

******* Generalization Complete *********

 

I think this is highly variable-- surely more exposure to patients doesnt = better bedside manner. Your demeanor towards others is fairly constant from my experience. If you are an ******* to people in classes, you'll be an ******* to patients. If you are genuinely caring and understanding, this will also show through.

 

I know some older nurses with 30+ years of patient contact experience... Id rather be deathly ill at my house then have to deal with them... eek!

[WatchTheSky]

He obviously hasn't met the PA that changes life just yet. :)

 

Our pre-med advisor at my undergrad just about blew me off as well. He didn't take my endeavors seriously until I told him the schools I was interviewing at -- he didn't even seem to realize that some of the "bigger schools" had PA programs, or that it was even a legit field.

 

Here I am, two years later, two weeks into PA school at Duke and I am loving it. I am drowning in schoolwork, but I am loving it :) I have not for one minute thought I made the wrong decision since I got accepted to PA school.

 

Find someone who is just as passionate about the PA profession as we all are, and talk to them in person. Perhaps invite them in for an open forum with your advisor so the three of you can discuss your plans.. I don't know how awkward that would be, though. Just don't let anyone else's views influence your own. Do what you love and the rest will come naturally.

[bradtPA]

Here I am, two years later, two weeks into PA school at Duke and I am loving it.

 

Well, welcome to NC and PA school. Just be careful not to get too wrapped up in those Duke vs UNC basketball games;). Camping out at K-ville for tickets for a weekend isn't the best for your GPA:D.

[jcampbell]

if you have ever thought about being an MD or DO, i'd say go for that over PA