Kelseybear35 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Alright, so i just registered on this site and so far things look great, lots of information and knowledge for sure. I was just looking at the "Are you sure you want to be a PA?" thread and i started to get really confused. Basically, from what i got out of it people were trying to say that you can't be a PA without like working as something else in the health care field first?? Soo what...i have to be like a nurse or something to gain "experience" and THEN go to graduate school? I'm sorry if i sound like an idiot here, but this really just doesn't make sense to me. I just want to figure out the best way for me to get my degree and start my life and i really want to be a PA. And here's some background on me before you guys reply. I am going to college getting my undergrad, majoring in Radiation Therapy. I assume this field still qualifies to gain this experience you guys are referring to. Am i right? Essentially, the only thing i know about become a PA is that you make the best grades you can in the prereq classes, shadow a PA to get at least some type of experience, and anything "extra" you have is a plus. Such as knowing a foreign language, doing volunteer hours, etc. Please set me straight with my confusion guys....i don't want to screw myself over when i try to apply to the PA grad school. Thanks a bunch!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenmood Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 First, welcome. :-) Most (but not all) PA schools require you to have paid health care experience (HCE). How do you know you want to work in healthcare if you've never done it before? Why a PA and not a nurse or doctor or respiratory therapist, all of whom help patients? It's very easy to answer that question if you've worked in the field, know the profession, and understand what it's like to take care of a patient. Radiation therapy could count as this kind of experience if you have direct contact with patients, but going to school and simply majoring in the field does not count because you aren't responsible for patients. Likewise, while shadowing a PA is valuable and can help you understand the profession, it isn't HCE because you're just watching. You aren't gaining experience as part of a healthcare team, you're just observing one in action. In order to understand the deeper reasons PA schools want experienced candidates, you need to learn a little about the history of the profession. Do a google search. Learn why the PA field was created. Visit the CASPA website to learn about the basic application requirements. Check out a couple school web pages to find out their typical applicant profile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelseybear35 Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 I actually looked at all of the PA schools in my state already, and this is exactly why i am confused. NONE of them specified that i had to have HCE to pursue this career. Yet, tons of people on here are saying you do. So i think you can see why i'm a little lost! Does this vary state to state or something? And one of my questions still didn't get answered, which is i assume radiation therapy would be acceptable for the HCE? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted September 23, 2011 Moderator Share Posted September 23, 2011 the entire concept of pa education is to train a clinician based on a solid foundation of prior experience so it doesn't take years getting up to speed. a nurse/medic/rt/etc understands the language and culture of medicine in a way that can't be taught in a classroom. some programs like usc are de-emphasizing hce and are incorporating more clinical time into their programs to make up for this lack of hce. pa programs used to be 24 months or so and have gradually lengthened to 27-30 months at many places. the future is probably a 3 yr program. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenmood Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Actually, I did mention the radiation therapy... but honestly, only you can answer that question. The CASPA website outlines what is considered direct patient care experience. Read the description and decide if what you are doing qualifies. None of the schools mention hours of previous experience in their application requirements? That's a little shocking to me... but *shrug* it happens. Like I said, not every school emphasizes it, but you can bet an applicant with tons of amazing experience will get in over someone with nothing, everything else being equal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelseybear35 Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 the entire concept of pa education is to train a clinician based on a solid foundation of prior experience so it doesn't take years getting up to speed. a nurse/medic/rt/etc understands the language and culture of medicine in a way that can't be taught in a classroom.some programs like usc are de-emphasizing hce and are incorporating more clinical time into their programs to make up for this lack of hce. pa programs used to be 24 months or so and have gradually lengthened to 27-30 months at many places. the future is probably a 3 yr program. I understand that, but i mean it's not my fault if none of the schools in my state require it. And doing all of this school work is challenging enough...it just kind of feels like a waste of my time to go work for a couple years instead of getting my degree since my degree doesn't require it. Does that make sense? However, i would like to know if this will totally screw me over once i get out of college and try to find a job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelseybear35 Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 Actually, I did mention the radiation therapy... but honestly, only you can answer that question. The CASPA website outlines what is considered direct patient care experience. Read the description and decide if what you are doing qualifies. None of the schools mention hours of previous experience in their application requirements? That's a little shocking to me... but *shrug* it happens. Like I said, not every school emphasizes it, but you can bet an applicant with tons of amazing experience will get in over someone with nothing, everything else being equal. Do you think you could give me a link to that website you're talking about? I was having a hard time finding it. And yes, i would imagine the person would the experience would get in before me, however, i have to wonder how many of the applicants in TX will have that awesome experience if the schools aren't even requiring it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duchesskre Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Here's a link to the PA schools in TX as you mentioned TX...I would suggest looking through the schools and looking at not only the PRE-REQS but also the profiles of the previously accepted classes..... http://www.tapa.org/displaycommon.cfm?an=1&subarticlenbr=24 and, not to be rude or anything but the people here are trying to help you and you seem a bit argumentative back to the people who are trying to help. Every school is different and every school requires different criteria. The people on this site can only offer their opinions. If you still have questions, you can call the particular schools you are interested in. Most schools require HCE and the ones who dont require it want either want to see students who have it or simply expect that the applicants have it...good luck. If it helps, I am from Florida...I applied to a bunch of schools....2 in Texas and I personally have about 10,000 hours of HCE 7,000 of it paid HCE. So, I personally believe that LOTS of "applicants in TX will have that awesome experience if the schools aren't even requiring it" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelseybear35 Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 Here's a link to the PA schools in TX as you mentioned TX...I would suggest looking through the schools and looking at not only the PRE-REQS but also the profiles of the previously accepted classes.....http://www.tapa.org/displaycommon.cfm?an=1&subarticlenbr=24 and, not to be rude or anything but the people here are trying to help you and you seem a bit argumentative back to the people who are trying to help. Every school is different and every school requires different criteria. The people on this site can only offer their opinions. If you still have questions, you can call the particular schools you are interested in. Most schools require HCE and the ones who dont require it want either want to see students who have it or simply expect that the applicants have it...good luck. If it helps, I am from Florida...I applied to a bunch of schools....2 in Texas and I personally have about 10,000 hours of HCE 7,000 of it paid HCE. So, I personally believe that LOTS of "applicants in TX will have that awesome experience if the schools aren't even requiring it" Well first off, pleeeeease don't take it that i'm being argumentative! I guess it's just the way i talk? But no, i am far from feeling argumentative. In fact i am the opposite, i'm very grateful i have you guys helping me. It's just an extremely confusing process for me, as i am seeing multiple answers for things. I hope you understand where i'm coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texaspa2014 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Kelsey, I am applying to PA schools in Texas. None of them require paid HCE. Most would prefer some, but it is not required. All of the schools recommend shadowing, and majority of schools recommend at least some PA shadowing. UTMB will tell you in their info sessions that you HAVE to shadow a PA. Some schools outside of Texas will recommend (or even require) paid HCE, and some of them will allow you to substitute hospice volunteer work for paid HCE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelseybear35 Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 The only thing i'm still really lost about is HOW you are supposed to get this HCE while you are going to school. From what i understand, you get your undergrad degree first, in some type of life science most likely, or in my case, radiation therapy, and then you stop going to school and pursue some other type of education in something like a lab tech or an EMT to be qualified to get a job at a hospital to get patient experience. Then you work a few years as that job, and THEN finally apply to a PA graduate program? I dont know..that just seems so strange to me to go about getting a degree like that. Please anyone correct me if i'm wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texaspa2014 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 You can get paid HCE without getting certified in anything else. I worked as a medical assistant for a primary care physician throughout college-- Texas law says doctors can train their own MAs and they don't need certification. Or you could do a short program (like a CNA program) at a community college, usually they are only one semester. Or a lot of people from my university came from high schools that offered classes for pharmacy tech or phlebotomy, so they worked in those kinds of jobs through college. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted September 23, 2011 Moderator Share Posted September 23, 2011 lots of different pathways: experience first: paramedic works and takes pa prereqs on the side one at a time experience and college at the same time(my path- I took 20 units many semesters while working 2 12 hr shifts/week as an er tech during the school yr and full time summers then did medic school right after college and worlked 5 yrs as a medic before becoming a pa). experience after college (get training during college/summers) work full time for a few yrs after graduation many entry level hce positions like emt, cna, medical asst. etc have fairly quick training that can be done part time in 6 mo or less. my emt in high school was 3 evenings/week for a semester plus a few weekend er shifts and ambulance ride alongs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
texaspa2014 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 But keep in mind that, like I stated before, you don't *have* to do any of that for Texas programs. It just looks better if you do have paid HCE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taotaox1 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Kelsey, pick up a CNA or EMT cert and work part time/prn while your in school. Its pretty easy to do, though it requires superb time management. PA is sort of like NP in that it is an advanced clinical degree meant for people with a few years experience in the medical profession, but it is open to all types of medical professionals, not just nurses. I am from texas and I can tell you right now that your chances of getting in without some HCE is close to nil unless your pulling a 4.0 1300+ GRE. It is very competitive and it will only get MORE competitive in the coming years. Some schools saw almost DOUBLE the number of applicants this year. Start working immediately. Think of it like an internship, as it serves the same function in many respects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelseybear35 Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 Thanks guys! That was exactly what i was looking for. I'm also considering becoming a nurse practioner. Do you guys have any advice/comments regarding it? Did any of you consider being a nurse practioner instead of a PA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mstarks42 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Kelsey: Just curious, why do you want to become a PA (or NP) and not a Physician? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhoiFish82 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Hey Kelsey.... Welcome to the board. I am actually a radiation therapist myself. Graduated from OU back in 2006 and have about 5yrs of health care experience. You are right in assuming that none of the schools require HCE...........BUT I can promise you that HCE weighs HEAVILY in their considerations of you. With that said, my interview is this Saturday at UT Southwestern. So please keep me in your prayers everyone :-D Khoi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelseybear35 Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 Aww congrats Khoi!! That's great :D And btw, how did you like the radiation therapy job? And i do not want to be a Physician mostly because i don't really want all of the responsibilites that they deal with, especially if they have their own practice. From what i've researched it seems like NP and PA's just don't quite have the same amount of stress to deal with. Not to mention, med school is WICKED hard. I took a peek at what their courseload looks like and i was terrified! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted September 23, 2011 Moderator Share Posted September 23, 2011 And i do not want to be a Physician mostly because i don't really want all of the responsibilites that they deal with.... From what i've researched it seems like NP and PA's just don't quite have the same amount of stress to deal with. Not to mention, med school is WICKED hard. I took a peek at what their courseload looks like and i was terrified! 1.if you practice medicine your responsibilities are the same as a doc 2. we have as much or more stress. don't buy the line pa's have more time with pts, etc. it's not true. we work as much or more than docs at times and in places they don't want to work. that is why they hire us. 3. pa school is wicked hard too. 2/3 of the medschool material in 1/2 the time. medstudents go home at 3. pa students stay until 5...and don't have any summers off.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KhoiFish82 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Aww congrats Khoi!! That's great :D And btw, how did you like the radiation therapy job? I really liked it, but I am ready to move up professionally. So which radiation therapy program are you attending currently? Khoi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
med218 Posted September 23, 2011 Share Posted September 23, 2011 Some talking points I have accumulated over the last couple of years, I think EMEDPA and others would agree: 1. Previous HCE is not just a check box on the application, the requirement is there to help you develop the experience and skill set necessary to help you succeed in a PA program. My previous HCE saved me a number of times and allowed me to shift my focus to areas of study I really needed to study more for. 2. We compared our schedule for our Pulmonary module one night with some of our friends that are M1's in the Med School and they couldn't believe how rapidly we moved through a curriculum that was quite similar to theirs. We did pulmonary in 10 days, they took 4 weeks. PA school is very rigorous and will test you in many different ways. I know that I am only about half way through the program at my school and have a ways to go, but after going through the year I just completed I can't help but get upset and offended when someone says they want to go to PA school because Medical School curriculum is really difficult. 3. Completing a PA program in 24-30 months requires initiative, maturity, and professionalism...all things that you can gain through undergrad studies and health care experience, but I can say that if I had not had a career prior to going to school I might not have been prepared for the responsibility that lies ahead of me about 15 months from now. Just my 2 cents... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelseybear35 Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 WOW...are you serious!? I had no idea PA school was that difficult. Geez, if anything it sounds harder than medical school. No summers and doing the same material in half the time? Good Lord. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator rev ronin Posted September 23, 2011 Administrator Share Posted September 23, 2011 The only thing i'm still really lost about is HOW you are supposed to get this HCE while you are going to school. Ideally, you do not. You get a job as an entry level health care professional (RN/EMT-P/RT/etc) and work in health care, or work in military medicine active duty, and then decide you want to be a PA, take the prerequisites in night classes while you still keep working, and then go to PA school in your late 20's or later. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelseybear35 Posted September 23, 2011 Author Share Posted September 23, 2011 Thanks for your honesty PAMAC. I'm pretty much set on becoming a NP instead of a PA from what i've researched. I just spend several hours digging into both of them, and i don't think i would mind being a nurse for a few years to gain my experience. I have 2 nurses in my family and they both really enjoy what they do. My ultimate goal would definitely be NP, but i think i feel the same way as you do. I don't just want my RN to be a stepping stone to jump to NP. I want to see the world of nursing and enjoy it for what it is first. I've actually considered being a nurse for a while, but i thought being a PA was going to be better, so i started leaning towards that. Then i found out all these crazy things about it from this site, like how it's practically harder than medical school! I would honestly enjoy being a nurse more than being a radiation therapist as well. That's the other reason i've been considering it...i flip flopped from radiation therapy to nursing in my mind quite a bit. You guys have been really helpful for me trying to make up my mind officially and i'm so thankful i received some real advice before making my decision. I would hate to jump into something that is actually MUCH more than i thought it would be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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