jdumoch Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Hey all.. im renegotiating in a few days and have a question. I work for an urgent care clinic and I've heard a good way to judge salary is to take a percentage of revenue generated for the clinic. I've heard 35% is decent. The "problem" is, I ran the numbers and seem to have billed over 900k in services in the past year, of which about 500k was actually collected. at 35% that puts me at 175k, which seems awfully high, and is more than twice what i'm making now.. seems like kinda a big raise to ask for lol. do these numbers actually give me negotiating power, or am I missing something here? thanks.. oh and that was at 30 hours a week, i'm upping to 40 hours per week this year.. so that number would actually be much higher. doesn't seem quite right, what am I missing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest JMPA Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 its right, never shortchange yourself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Steve Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 It is a total snark answer and I know you will roll your eyes.... "what are you missing"... first thought I had was "the guts to ask for the raise that you deserve" i totally understand how nerve wracking it is...couple of questions...are you sure of their collections? Have you seen the books or just penciling it in your head? If you havent seen the books, could you? How long have you worked there, what salary can you receive with your experience elsewhere in the place you live? Are you ready to walk and find employment elsewhere? Who is on the firmer ground for bargaining? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdumoch Posted April 14, 2013 Author Share Posted April 14, 2013 i'm positive on the numbers.. I ran them through the EMR's finance program and it outlines every patient i've seen in the past 12 months with all the financials. they are definitely on firmer ground for bargaining as my options are a bit limited, but thats a long story. I was per diem there for 3 years, and have been full time for a year. about 75% of my 30hours/week was clinical, the other 25% admin (chart reviews, training FP doc's how emergency procedures etc). they are a rapidly expanding company and I am willing to sacrifice a bit of pay now hoping that it pays off when they have 25+ clinics. But after running those numbers, I'm a little put off that I'm only making 80k right (about 47/hr) right now. doesn't seem quite right.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdumoch Posted April 14, 2013 Author Share Posted April 14, 2013 the other thing i could really use is some hard data on average urgent care pay.. the AAPA salary report has UC w/ FP, which i think is totally difference, and can't seem to find numbers anywhere Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alldaylong Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Everything's negotiable. Start there and see how they respond. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmj11 Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 i'm positive on the numbers.. I ran them through the EMR's finance program and it outlines every patient i've seen in the past 12 months with all the financials. they are definitely on firmer ground for bargaining as my options are a bit limited, but thats a long story. I was per diem there for 3 years, and have been full time for a year. about 75% of my 30hours/week was clinical, the other 25% admin (chart reviews, training FP doc's how emergency procedures etc). they are a rapidly expanding company and I am willing to sacrifice a bit of pay now hoping that it pays off when they have 25+ clinics. But after running those numbers, I'm a little put off that I'm only making 80k right (about 47/hr) right now. doesn't seem quite right.. jdumoch, do me a favor? Can you give me the codes of your typical day, how much billed for each code. I'm just curious. I've worked urgent care before and know the flow. In my present practice, my billings are maxed out at about $2500 per day. That is working like a dog, no lunch breaks and no potty breaks. On a Botox day, I can bill out as much as $10,000 HOWEVER, I will owe about $6500 for the Botox. For you to bill out at $900,000/ year, that would mean that you are consistency billing out about $3600 per day. I'm not doubting you at all, however, I'm just interested how urgent care bills out vs what I do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMD16 Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 Payer mix? # of pt seen per shift? Procedures? # shift per wk X 52 wks? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcdavis Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 900k billable?.. That's a lot of billable procedures, or 45 level 4s a day x a year.. Seems awfully, awfully high for urgent care, where most visits are level 3s... And there really are few procedures. I too would be interested in CPT coding break down... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdumoch Posted April 14, 2013 Author Share Posted April 14, 2013 35-40 pt's/shift, about 4 shifts per week. sometimes more. lots of procedures, lots of xrays, labs.. etc etc. anyone out there with data on UC salary? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmj11 Posted April 14, 2013 Share Posted April 14, 2013 35-40 pt's/shift, about 4 shifts per week. sometimes more. lots of procedures, lots of xrays, labs.. etc etc. anyone out there with data on UC salary? Are you counting test revenues? That is not usually considered in bonus payments and in a matter of fact I think Medicare forbids it. I worked in a practice where the physicians were paid a bonus on labs/ x ray revenue and they got busted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted April 14, 2013 Moderator Share Posted April 14, 2013 bonuses are based on your personal billings, not labs, xrays, splints, etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdumoch Posted April 14, 2013 Author Share Posted April 14, 2013 I did know that about bonuses, but since I am not trying to negotiate a bonus but a salary I wasn't sure if it was the same. I'm not sure how I can get my total revenue collected excluding labs/procedures.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted April 14, 2013 Moderator Share Posted April 14, 2013 all the places I work keep stats on my pts and rvu's per hr and use this to calculate production bonuses. you could probably do the same for a raise(as a raise is basically an avg production bonus across an entire yr). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator ventana Posted April 15, 2013 Moderator Share Posted April 15, 2013 Now I see Where the issue has arisen You really need to find out what your billings and receipts are. Here EMR may well be able to tell this, he may be able to search based on code. But I highly doubt you are anywhere close to $900,000 a year. Maybe for all your incidentals and ancillary testing. But that is something different. The 1st step of successful negotiation is knowing the facts, right now I think more research is needed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcdavis Posted April 16, 2013 Share Posted April 16, 2013 And, of course, where the rubber meets the road, is the huge disparity between BILLED and COLLECTED. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmj11 Posted April 16, 2013 Share Posted April 16, 2013 And, of course, where the rubber meets the road, is the huge disparity between BILLED and COLLECTED. This last two years have been a real education for me. I'm in disbelief when I see my bills going to the insurance company for $289.55 (one claim this past week end) and they write a check for $.30 in return . . . yes that is 30 cents. I had one bill once for $525 sent out and got a check for $.07. I posted that check on our bulletin board in the waiting room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator ventana Posted April 16, 2013 Moderator Share Posted April 16, 2013 I deal only with Medicare The perfect reimbursement is 50% commonly get somewhere between 25-35% due to various reasons.. so if I bill 300k i will likely get in the low $100k pretty crappy when you take into consideration how hard you have to work to generate this and how much overhead it takes... this is not a get rich field.... no being a Rad or Ortho with starting pay at 300k with 8 weeks off is the ticket... as a whole the US system (there really is not a "system") is broke pays $$$$$ for a quick procedure, and pays $ for actually caring for the patient... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jdumoch Posted April 17, 2013 Author Share Posted April 17, 2013 yeh I have the total billed vs the total collected, but it includes procedures etc.. not sure how to find just the visit codes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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