Acromion Posted May 12, 2010 Author Share Posted May 12, 2010 Wow - at this point I don't think I can take you guys seriously. I was expecting a more equipoised discussion from medical professionals, but I instead I am hearing the type of invective I'd expect from insecure high schoolers. But thanks for your advice. I found it humorous, and in some cases, disturbing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3GeronimoPA Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 natetaylor calls me a homophobe. I'm not afraid of homosexuals. (for the record I didn't call anyone any names either) I just prefer not to associate with them. Sure, I know that I probably know some homosexuals who I have no idea are gay. The same is probably true when it comes to abortion or other moral or religious views. I'm just not going to knowingly be buddies with either group. That's my choice and most of you don't respect that choice, but then militantly demand that I respect/embrace your points of view or else you will denigrate, disparage and despise everything about me. That's ok with me. I'm not going to change what I believe just to make you or anyone else like me. In fact, I couldn't care less what you think of me. Pump your breaks a little! Good grief! I happen to be conservative and I have a strong God centered viewpoint that also places me in line with your views on homosexuality, abortion, etc.... IF I were singling you out, I would have used your name in my post. I don't sugar coat anything and I sure has hell don't do rabbit punches at all let alone on a discussion forum. I was characterizing the military. I don't think you are a homophobe. I don't agree with the homosexual lifestyle nor do I think it is a lifestyle that openly is compatible with military service. This doesn't make me a homophobe but a pragmatist in this regard. However, I do have my head out of the sand to know that most Soldiers don't hold to my moral values and most Soldiers that make the day to day gay jokes and are anti-homosexual aren't looking at it from a functional perspective, they just don't want another man eyeballing them in showers. Tea Party? Are you flipping KIDDING ME!?!?! Who said anything about the Tea Party? I'd vote for someone from the Tea Party in a heartbeat. I'm a card carrying conservative! This is madness. I just stated the facts as to the character of the average Joe and if you run down the list of characteristics of the my previous SF and Infantry bn's that is exactly what is there. ALSO Hothead, if you're out of the military and don't care what happens to it now go fly a freaking kite! Granted I'm still in but there will NEVER be a day when I don't care about what happens to my Army. The United States Military is one of the greatest organizations in the world and if you had the privilege to serve in it you ought to have some form of respect for it and concern for it's future. Heme, I agree that homosexuals ought to be loved and treated with respect though I disagree with the lifestyle. As far as the Levitical laws regarding clean/unclean food and that being law, homosexuality, and blended fabrics, context is the key. We can PM if you are interested in bouncing ideas off one another. If not, that's fine as well. As far as how the sin of homosexuality is biblically represented, I do believe that we can safely conclude that a homosexual lifestyle is not a lifestyle that a Christian ought to celebrate. However, as you said, it ought to be one that we should tolerate and that homosexuals should be loved by Christians just as someone who has ever told a lie, stolen something, or looked at another woman lustfully as all are wrong in the eyes of God. As far as the video, you spoke correctly, "In the name of Christianity" not "Christianity" itself. Many atrocities are done in the "name" while being diametrically opposed to the life and teachings of Christ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain1028 Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 But what about gay Christian singer Jennifer Knapp? Please discuss PRN.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3GeronimoPA Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 That's where you lost me, Greg. If you are proceeding from the view point that homosexuality is a choice, then there really is nothing to debate here. If only those gays would just straighten out and choose to be less gay then they would be okay in your book? Are we back in the 50's? No in the 2010's and we still haven't proven that people are born gay. Not that I think that it matters. I think people are born with all sorts of predispositions for sin. I am attracted to women yet I am married. My attraction for women didn't go away, it's my choice to willingly sin that makes me wrong. It's not being attracted to men that is the lifestyle that I oppose because I don't know if people are born that way or not. It's that God said, "don't". It shouldn't matter to you how I feel about that lifestyle because I treat PEOPLE like PEOPLE regardless of their sexual orientation. IF I don't like what they do, that's my prerogative. Janet Napolitano should be fired immediately for gross incompetence! Jennifer Knapp the Christian Musician just announced she was gay after a 8 year hiatus from music. I feel that she can no longer be labeled a "Christian musician", I do like her and ordered her new CD, but she cannot be a Christian singer if she is gay!! Discuss.... Why can't she be labeled "Christian"? Did she state that she was gay and that she didn't believe in God anymore? Or did she state that she is gay and wants to ignore what the Bible says about it? Or did she state that she has an attraction to women but doesn't intend on acting on it? If she did the last, of the three, she is still a "Christian musician". If she did the second of the three, she is burying her head in the sand and may be Christian but is in err. If she did the first of the three, she is not a Christian. To be a Christian doesn't mean you have it all together, to be a Christian means you know Who to go to in order to get it all together. There's this idea that non-Christians have that Christians think of themselves as above everyone else because we are exempt from what we call sin. That's trash. We fight habits, we fail at it from time to time, and we go to Church and try to contribute even through our struggles. Church isn't a place for perfect people, it's a place for screwed up people who know Who can make it right. If we were perfect, we wouldn't need Church. I know plenty of Christians attracted to people of the same sex, I know plenty of Christian alcoholics that still want a drink, plenty of Christian drug addicts who want another hit, and plenty of other people who have a desire for something they CHOOSE to do the opposite of in order to do the right thing. Just because someone may or may not be born with a certain desire doesn't make that desire right. We spend most of our lives resisting what we really want to do (such as punching a boss in the mouth, kicking in a guys car door who almost made you crash with your family in the car, etc) in order to do what is right and what will benefit us in the end. I don't view an inborn or acquired desire for something wrong any differently and that includes homosexuality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3GeronimoPA Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 BTW Iain, I'm very interested for you to explain why she can't be a Christian and your views on the matter. Its very easy to request someone to take a position, have them defend it, and open the opportunity for you to engage in a little one-up-manship. Not that this is your intent, but all signs are pointing to it is since you are eager for someone to post on the matter yet you have not defended your statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain1028 Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 OK here it is Natetaylor and I am not a religious person (except in a fox hole that is), but Jennifer Knapp is a Lesbian, OK cool. Now, she performs her music under the guise of Christian music, right? OK. So, according to the teachings of Christ, being Gay ain't so cool right? So then, how can Jennifer Knapp be then a Christian musician? It ain't brain surgery here. She announced she was gay a few weeks out upon the release of her new CD "Letting Go" and was recently on Larry (I'm still breathing) King on the subject where she was confronted by a Christian preacher man. She still claims that she is still spiritual and Christian. She can't still be a Christian artist can she? For she is a Sinner!!! Personally, I am sure Christ is cool with whatever you are as long as you are nice to people? Right? Or maybe not? We'll all find out sooner or later.... Some say that you can pray the gay away, is this possible with intensive anti-gay therapy? Discuss.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3GeronimoPA Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 Well then my response to you stands. I have "discuss"ed as you requested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain1028 Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 But can you "pray the gay away" as some Christian Zealots suggest? Are there any studies? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3GeronimoPA Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 I don't think so from what I have seen. You can get control of a desire but it is still there. No studies or Bible lessons would suggest otherwise. Even Jesus was tempted... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustin Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 Back in 2000 and my first active duty assignment I met my first PA. They were in the process of being kicked out for their sexual orientation. I think there was a domestic disturbance at home or in a bar. I would wait until there is some legislation passed making it legal. I witnessed a few spouse complaints to the CO that had to be dealt with. All it takes is a partner that is a little vindictive to get you kicked out. Best of luck and I wish you to have the ability to serve like I did. Rustin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain1028 Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 By homosexuality? Even Jesus. I drive an Audi A4 and it was voted the #1 car for the Gay professional.... But I am not gay! Yikes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAdamsPAC Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 By homosexuality? Even Jesus. I drive an Audi A4 and it was voted the #1 car for the Gay professional.... But I am not gay! Yikes! An import!!!!!Get yourself some V-8 Hemi powered American Iron! I hope that you are packing a Colt, S&W or Ruger piece! I don't know.......:-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain1028 Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 One step ahead of you Cadams, I may drive a gay professional car but tell that to my 9mm Springfield Armory. When the borders are broken, you need to protect yourself because your government sure won't!! Doing the job Obama and Nappy refuse to do!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemegroup Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 Just because someone may or may not be born with a certain desire doesn't make that desire right. We spend most of our lives resisting what we really want to do (such as punching a boss in the mouth, kicking in a guys car door who almost made you crash with your family in the car, etc) in order to do what is right and what will benefit us in the end. I don't view an inborn or acquired desire for something wrong any differently and that includes homosexuality. Tell it to God, since He gave men their PROSTATES. Of course, that's a reference to male homo-sexual behavior, not same-gender love, cohabitation, etc. But I'd say that it's pretty much not WRONG, if God PUT it there (according to creation, although that statement still applies to an evolutionary-creation viewpoint also). As for the rest of it, who people fall in love with is their own business and it's to be respected and honored, for everyone knows that God is Love (1 John 4:8). Is that scripture WRONG? Have you forgotten what true love FEELS like? I rented a room for a while from a male-male couple who had been together 40 years, almost as long as my parents had at the time. They had met and that had been that. Tell them they were WRONG? Whatever. Everyone has their place in the universe, who are we to question. I walked past their room once (they were older, one in his 70s and one in his 80s, and slept in twin beds that were separated by about a foot), and they were napping, both holding each others hand across the gap. I really don't think the opinions of others mattered to them. We should all be so lucky to find someone to cherish for as long as they had each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain1028 Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 Hemegroup, are you telling the whole story? Something tells me there are parts to the male-male couple thing that you are forgetting to tell us, ie you.... That whole story is borderline creepy. You are the prototype of all things Liberal and "Progressive" You live in a Utopian universe of unicorns, free health care, and open borders..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustin Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 I hate unicorns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAdamsPAC Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 One step ahead of you Cadams, I may drive a gay professional car but tell that to my 9mm Springfield Armory. When the borders are broken, you need to protect yourself because your government sure won't!! Doing the job Obama and Nappy refuse to do!! OK! Me and my S&W model 66 and M-1 Garrand will keep an eye on the northern border if you will watch the southern one too! Just don't stand near a polling place in a black beret unless you spend more time in the sun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain1028 Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 I will patrol the Nogales border area with Hemegroup! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CAdamsPAC Posted May 12, 2010 Share Posted May 12, 2010 i will patrol the nogales border area with hemegroup! roflmao!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemegroup Posted May 13, 2010 Share Posted May 13, 2010 Hemegroup, are you telling the whole story? Something tells me there are parts to the male-male couple thing that you are forgetting to tell us, ie you.... That whole story is borderline creepy. I'm not sure what you mean, I rented a room in their house. They had a huge house and they've rented rooms to people of all ages, genders and orientations for years. And I don't understand what you find creepy about their story ... a married couple makes you uncomfortable, why, because they're different than you are? Does everyone have to be like you? How funny, I googled them and found old pictures from the 60s ... their house was pretty much the place to be back then. Jim Henson, Tim Leary, man, they threw some pretty awesome parties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iain1028 Posted May 13, 2010 Share Posted May 13, 2010 Heme two's company, three is a.....crowd? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3GeronimoPA Posted May 13, 2010 Share Posted May 13, 2010 Tell it to God, since He gave men their PROSTATES. Of course, that's a reference to male homo-sexual behavior, not same-gender love, cohabitation, etc. But I'd say that it's pretty much not WRONG, if God PUT it there (according to creation, although that statement still applies to an evolutionary-creation viewpoint also). As for the rest of it, who people fall in love with is their own business and it's to be respected and honored, for everyone knows that God is Love (1 John 4:8). Is that scripture WRONG? Have you forgotten what true love FEELS like? The logic of "It's there and it feels good so it must be right" is piss poor. Meth and LSD can make you feel good but I wouldn't say they are "not wrong" because of the sensation they grant. People love all sorts of things that are wrong in God's eyes such as money. God is truth as well. So that doesn't make it right for you to go to a handicapped basketball game and look everyone in the face and say "You are crippled and will never walk again"? It is the truth, but it's the right thing used the wrong way. You can take any of the characteristics of God and apply them to some form of human indecency and try to justify them but that doesn't make it right. I rented a room for a while from a male-male couple who had been together 40 years, almost as long as my parents had at the time. They had met and that had been that. Tell them they were WRONG? Whatever. Everyone has their place in the universe, who are we to question. I walked past their room once (they were older, one in his 70s and one in his 80s, and slept in twin beds that were separated by about a foot), and they were napping, both holding each others hand across the gap. I don't have to tell them anything. The bible is in its present form almost 2000 years old. So in addition to "sensation", "time" is also another criteria that does not qualify something as right or wrong. I really don't think the opinions of others mattered to them. We should all be so lucky to find someone to cherish for as long as they had each other. Not "sensation", not "time", nor "confidence" in one's actions are a criterion for right and wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3GeronimoPA Posted May 13, 2010 Share Posted May 13, 2010 I will patrol the Nogales border area with Hemegroup! You are one cold dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greg Cain PA-C Posted May 13, 2010 Share Posted May 13, 2010 Pump your breaks a little! Good grief! I happen to be conservative and I have a strong God centered viewpoint that also places me in line with your views on homosexuality, abortion, etc.... IF I were singling you out, I would have used your name in my post. I don't sugar coat anything and I sure has hell don't do rabbit punches at all let alone on a discussion forum. I was characterizing the military. I don't think you are a homophobe. I don't agree with the homosexual lifestyle nor do I think it is a lifestyle that openly is compatible with military service. This doesn't make me a homophobe but a pragmatist in this regard. However, I do have my head out of the sand to know that most Soldiers don't hold to my moral values and most Soldiers that make the day to day gay jokes and are anti-homosexual aren't looking at it from a functional perspective, they just don't want another man eyeballing them in showers. Tea Party? Are you flipping KIDDING ME!?!?! Who said anything about the Tea Party? I'd vote for someone from the Tea Party in a heartbeat. I'm a card carrying conservative! This is madness. I just stated the facts as to the character of the average Joe and if you run down the list of characteristics of the my previous SF and Infantry bn's that is exactly what is there. ALSO Hothead, if you're out of the military and don't care what happens to it now go fly a freaking kite! Granted I'm still in but there will NEVER be a day when I don't care about what happens to my Army. The United States Military is one of the greatest organizations in the world and if you had the privilege to serve in it you ought to have some form of respect for it and concern for it's future. Heme, I agree that homosexuals ought to be loved and treated with respect though I disagree with the lifestyle. As far as the Levitical laws regarding clean/unclean food and that being law, homosexuality, and blended fabrics, context is the key. We can PM if you are interested in bouncing ideas off one another. If not, that's fine as well. As far as how the sin of homosexuality is biblically represented, I do believe that we can safely conclude that a homosexual lifestyle is not a lifestyle that a Christian ought to celebrate. However, as you said, it ought to be one that we should tolerate and that homosexuals should be loved by Christians just as someone who has ever told a lie, stolen something, or looked at another woman lustfully as all are wrong in the eyes of God. As far as the video, you spoke correctly, "In the name of Christianity" not "Christianity" itself. Many atrocities are done in the "name" while being diametrically opposed to the life and teachings of Christ. nate...only the first sentence spoke directly to you. The rest was intended more gerarally for Hemegroup and the like-minded. I should hace made that a little more clear. My grammar and spelling sometime take a backseat to speed here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemegroup Posted May 13, 2010 Share Posted May 13, 2010 Nate, I'm curious ... did your PA program not teach you about human sexuality? As for 'the bible', no PMs, if you ever care to debate 'the bible', I do that flat out in the open. And I'm warning you ... I'll win. And please, don't ever compare methamphetamine to LSD. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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