Resident Salary

[ventana]

http://www.medscape.com/features/slideshow/public/residents-salary-and-debt-report?src=txt_stm_compen_2_a

 

not horrible pay, and hours are not that bad.....

 

hummmmm

 

[jsfelder0417]

Interesting report. I was surprised to see that less than 50% of residents spend more than 60 hours/week in the hospital by PGY-3.

[DiggySRNA]

Shocked that 5% and 13% of residents fall under the "not looking forward to practicing as a physician" or "undecided" category.

• after all those years, money, and sacrifice :(

Interesting report that's for sure.

[dmdpac]

Shocked that 5% and 13% of residents fall under the "not looking forward to practicing as a physician" or "undecided" category.

• after all those years, money, and sacrifice :(

Interesting report that's for sure.

 

This is simply anecdotal but back when I was trying to decide between PA and medical school only one of the dozens of physicians with whom I spoke suggested I go to medical school.  All of the rest of them said if they could do it all over again they'd go to PA school.

 

The only doc who said go to medical school had just graduated and had not started residency yet.

 

(To be fair, of all the PAs with whom I spoke they were more split between encouraging medical school versus PA school.  That, however, is a different discussion.)

[JohnnyM2]

In another thread several PAs opined that if you are going to graduate from PA school with more than $100,000 in debt, you should go to med school instead. This report suggests that going to med school could result in more than double the debt accrued by a PA-S. Moreover, it appears that need students are unable to make much of a dent in that debt during their years of residency, up to five years, during which time, according to the report, residents make much less than PAs.

A PA graduates with much less debt and can, typically, start paying it down right away. Five years out, they can have a significant part of their debt paid off. Although, LIFETIME earnings may still make the MD route seem preferable, we live day-to-day and debt can be stressful.

 

Some PAs on this forum have expressed dissatisfaction with the profession (for valid enough reasons) so it's interesting to see that only 83% of residents are looking forward to practicing medicine.

 

Here's my take on it. We live in an economy and a healthcare system where income growth is weak, job creation is inadequate and government is way too obtrusive causing excessive uncertainty, stress and a sense of being helpless and trapped. Get government out of the way, let the markets work, and everyone will be better off and more positive and all boats will be lifted.

 

Sent from my Kindle Fire HDX using Tapatalk 2

 

 

[Guest Paula]

Slide 14 was interesting.  Most reported good relationships with PAs and nurses.  No mention of NPs. 

[Gordon, PA-C]

Ummmm..... 55k for the work that residents do is pretty terrible.  Would any reasonable PA work for only 55k per year?  If so, they must be absolutely desperate.

[DiggySRNA]

Slide 14 was interesting.  Most reported good relationships with PAs and nurses.  No mention of NPs. 

Then again, NPs could've been grouped with nurses. Like how some articles group PAs under MAs.

*cough - Dr. Jennifer Ashton from abcnews*

[primadonna22274]

I make 54,300 as an intern. Work 70-80/wk. Did have a couple lighter weeks at 45-50 ???? assuming I get to take my 3 wk vacation this year, I'm making about $15/hr, give or take a few. I get one 24-hr period a week off and one "golden weekend" a month. I can make in one 12-hr ED shift what I make in almost a week as a resident--although the only way to do that is to work on my precious day off. I've done it once and will do it again this weekend post-call. Not my wisest move. I don't think I'll be able to do it much more--I need the rest more than I need the money. I don't have time to spend it anyway ☺️

[mrjemes41587]

I think it's very interesting news for Critical department. I see here critical care specalist is also get higher salary. Very positive feed about that department. Wish all the best.

 

[primadonna22274]

You have to know how CC works. It's a sub specialty of IM/pulm most of the time so these folks are really fellows, likely PGY4-7. Salary goes up with each year but it's such a nominal increase it really doesn't tell the full story.

[Contrarian]

Ummmm..... 55k for the work that residents do is pretty terrible.  Would any reasonable PA work for only 55k per year?  If so, they must be absolutely desperate.

 

Not "desperate" but more of "the long view"...

 

Meaning:

Lots of folks will work for $55k/yr x3-4 yrs... knowing that they WILL easily make 3x that in 3-4yrs for the rest of their lives.

Personally, I'd work for that for 3 yrs for that guarantee and independence.

[primadonna22274]

^^^Bingo my friend!

[hlj25950]

I'd be interested to know where the respondents were located. I know a lot of surgical residents (general, ortho, neurosurg) who work 100+ hour weeks and they LIE through their teeth regarding their work hours because it's technically against the rules. Reporting work hour violations hurts the reporting resident. It's a messed up system.

 

I personally know many MDs and DOs with well over 300K of debt. Well over. My hubby included.

 

Sometimes, money isn't enough. It's just not worth the sacrifices in a lot of cases. It's really disheartening to hear so much of the envious perspective from PAs.

 

The stress is higher. The debt is higher. The liability is higher. The sacrifice is higher. Money isn't everything ya'll. It's not. And our clinic is making less every year, reimbursements are down. Work is up. Overhead is up.

 

 

 

 

[DiggySRNA]

Sometimes, money isn't enough. It's just not worth the sacrifices in a lot of cases. It's really disheartening to hear so much of the envious perspective from PAs.

 

The stress is higher. The debt is higher. The liability is higher. The sacrifice is higher. Money isn't everything ya'll. It's not. And our clinic is making less every year, reimbursements are down. Work is up. Overhead is up.

 

I think it also have something to do with self-satisfaction. It's like drugs. We achieve a certain level of satisfaction by becoming PAs, but 15, 20, or even 30 years into practicing, there's a need for more: independence, respect, the lifestyle etc. It's human nature to long for something one does not have until we get it (be careful with what you wish for I guess). Then turn around at the end of the day and still feel unfulfilled. We see it happen, all the time:

• MDs who achieved such title wishing they went the PA route because reality hit them. They weren't prepared for the lifestyle. Heck, my nutrition professor is an MD who left practice EARLY. My anatomy professor who lets his JD collect dust.  
• PAs who are part of a growing profession (not well established like our counterparts) wishing they went  MD because they weren't ready to deal with the constant battles to prove themselves in the medical community. I agree, it sounds exhausting.
• NPs wishing they went the PA route because they want to practice medicine and have the "flexibility" to experience surgery, peds, derm, ortho and all the fancy sub-specialties. I'm not saying PAs only belong in subspecialities...

I completely agree with you @hlj2590. As a pre-pa student myself, it's disheartening seeing experienced PAs envious of other professions to the point where they tell us to go to medical school, why not say NP school if independence is be all end all. Some individuals here should let others experience their own reality, even if they don't agree with it. Let them pursue whatever they desire whether it's MD, PA, NP, or even Elementary school teacher. At the end of the day, from the lack of understanding the profession and even experiencing it first hand, being unsatisfied is inevitable. 

 

/end rant

[Guest Paula]

I just recommended the PA profession to a police officer with a BS in exercise physiology who is taking EMS courses now and does not want to be in the criminal justice system forever. 

[whoRyou]

I just recommended the PA profession to a police officer with a BS in exercise physiology who is taking EMS courses now and does not want to be in the criminal justice system forever. 

That is one reason why I absolutely LOVE about THIS profession! You can major in anything (like underwater basket weaving as I explain to some of my friends), take some prerequisites, and for some take the GRE and then APPLY! Of course I am totally minimizing the whole thing, but if you think about it, it truly is an amazing thing or so I hope when I am ready to apply. Like Paula's friend, I am a PI and I have gotten all thumbs up from all of the schools I am looking at, but of course I am planning to switch professions (or if it's possible and do both) and accumulate several thousands of hours for HCE.

 

As far as money goes isn't everything, but it sure beats whatever is it second place. I'm not saying money isn't anything, just that it isn't everything.

[Ryanviola]

Benefits are awesome and the slide 14 & 15 are interesting.

[Gordon, PA-C]

I'd be interested to know where the respondents were located. I know a lot of surgical residents (general, ortho, neurosurg) who work 100+ hour weeks and they LIE through their teeth regarding their work hours because it's technically against the rules. Reporting work hour violations hurts the reporting resident. It's a messed up system.

 

 

 

This is exactly right.  I've worked in 5 different academic hospitals with surgical MD residents, and I know for a fact that in every single one of those programs the MD residents were LYING about their work hours.  They would purposefully stay late or arrive early without "clocking in" so they could scrub or observe extra cases.