fjcarmo Posted December 23, 2012 Share Posted December 23, 2012 A while back I was arrested twice for stealing some merchandise from a stores. I called a lawyer when I got home both times and got the charge reduced to a non-criminal violation of disorderly conduct both times. The lawyer advised that on any background check I can still say that I was never convicted of a crime, misdemeanor, or felony anywhere. I have since gotten a job with American Red Cross as a Blood Collections Tech II. I have been doing this job for almost 3 years and while it pays good money the job is becoming kind of boring. I currently have an Associates of Science in Business Administration from Schenectady County Community College and a Medical Assistant Certificate from Branford Hall in Albany, NY. I am considering going to school to be a physician assistant but before going back to school to finally get my Bachelors Degree I am wondering if it is even possible to become a physician assistant with those arrests on my record and if so what is really the best choice to get my bachelors degree in. Another thing I worry about with the cost of getting the degree is whether or not I can even be licensed as most license boards say any conviction of a crime of dishonesty or fraud or deceit or crime that was committed for one’s own personal gain is automatic disqualification. Being that I was never actually convicted of the crime would I still be disqualified. I only ask this because it makes no sense to go back to school and get the degree if I could never be licensed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Contrarian Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 Being "Arrested" isn't the issue... its being "convicted" of certain things that becomes a problem. LOTS of PAs have been "arrested" for a multitude of alledged crimes. I'd venture to say that few practicing PA-C have been convicted of the crimes they were "arrested" for. For example... I've been "arrested" for multiple "Assaults"... "Battery" anda handful of "Attempted murders"... I've never been actually convicted of any of these charges because once the entire story/chain of events was revealed in open court... I was either aquitted or the charges were simply dismissed... :wink: These "arrests" still show up and every so often... a insurance company hesitates to empanel me as a "preferred" provider... but for the most part these arrests have not been a problem. What can I say except that I'm a "kinetic" kind of guy.... :heheh: So ...it seems that being "Arrested" isn't the issue... its being "convicted" of certain things that becomes a problem with licensing, the NCCPA, and the DEA, and MANY Third Party Payors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SungSam Posted December 24, 2012 Share Posted December 24, 2012 Exactly, the question is about criminal record. Most schools would require you can pass a criminal background check. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fjcarmo Posted December 24, 2012 Author Share Posted December 24, 2012 Thank you for the input guys. I appreciate your responses! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyM2 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I know this thread is a year old but doesn't anyone have the integrity and the pride in their profession to tell this person the obvious. It is stunning that you got shoplifting charges reduced twice, and great luck for you, but it only demonstrates how reluctant store owners are to prosecute shoplifters. Sheesh! The PA profession (and, yes, it is a profession, not a job like flipping burgers) needs to be beyond reproach. It does not need people with no moral compass. We can only hope you will never become a licensed PA. As for the rest of you who have read this post and just moved on without responding, do you really want your ranks contaminated with people like this. That would truly make you a Physician's Assistant, not a Physician Assistant. Sent from my Kindle Fire HDX using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jsfelder0417 Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 I am going to give the OP the benefit of the doubt and assume that they shoplifted when they were young. If this was the case, no, I don't think that should automatically DQ someone from becoming a PA. None of us are saints, plenty of us have done stuff we could have been arrested for, had we been caught. Point is, we don't know the full story, so armchair generaling is just speculation, and not enough to say that someone has no moral compass. Having this opinion does not make me a Physician'S Assistant, either. I am my own man. I belong to no one except the big man upstairs. By the way, the world needs burger flippers, so I don't look down on those that make that their profession. Instead, I give them my hard earned dollar to eat that meaty, cheesy goodness... because I love burgers, and burgers love me. Pump the brakes a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
genuineonline Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 You have mentioned great information, thanks for sharing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AREID Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 Just because people make mistakes doesn't mean they should be punished for life. Seriously, this guy shoplifted, does that mean he will be a bad PA? No. Does that mean he will steal narcotics? No. I hope he does become a PA if that's what he really wants. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
db_pavnp Posted January 8, 2014 Share Posted January 8, 2014 It strikes me as somewhat unAmerican to penalize someone for life for mundane issues which have been redressed and addressed over time. Emphasis on 'mundane' and open to interpretation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyM2 Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Had s/he been a minor there would never have been any question about it being on any public record and the post indicated that s/he had called an attorney suggesting they were independent at that time. No particular criminal offense means someone will commit the same or a similar offense in the future. It's an issue of character. We are talking about TWO incidents of shoplifting here. Regarding the comment that many of us have done things we could have been arrested for, that is perhaps true, but most of us haven't. Anyway, none of that is pertinent here. I also believe people should be able to atone and move on with their lives but the medical profession needs people with higher standards and the PA profession cannot afford people who don't have the character to maintain high ethical standards. This person can still do many things in life. In our society, a lack of ethics and character seems to be tolerated in almost anything but should not be tolerated in medicine. So, I stand by my earlier comments and have to wonder about those who want to find ways to excuse this behavior. Sent from my Kindle Fire HDX using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CCEMPA Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Since you presume to make judgements about someone else's character based upon two incidents in an entire lifetime, would it be fair for us to make a few about you? Although I don't know you personally, it is my presumption that you have been born in a fairly well to do family and have probably never had to work hard for anything in your life. I mean, how else could someone demonstrate such elitist values without any remorse? It's only once you have reached the tope echelon of society that you can truly worry about "those other people contaminating the ranks" of "your" profession like some sort of parasite. Are you kidding me? Who made you the authority on who can be a PA? If you look at one person on a message board like that, I can only imagine what you say about your patients behind close doors. In fact, how can you even stand to treat these people? Wait, don't answer that, your character and the language you have unwittingly demonstrated have already answered that question for me and everyone else here. For someone harping about ethics, yours really don't seem that impressive. And since when was a job "(and, yes, it is a profession, not a job like flipping burgers)" any less valuable to society than say I don't know, a PA? Why? Because you practice medicine? Did it ever occur to you that that guy driving your cab might have been a successful doctor in India, who upon moving to America for a better life, didn't have the time, money, or ability to go to medical school/obtain licensure in the U.S.? Or that maybe that burger flipper has three jobs to support a family. Probably not, but I sure hope that in the event your house ever catches fire, or a family member is treated by "ambulance drivers", that you are sure to tell them their job is nowhere near as important as your "profession". What your profession needs is fewer people with attitudes like yours, and more people who are hardworking, caring, and dedicated to improving the lives of other people. If fjcarmo had those qualities, I'd rather have 1000x of them treating my family members than one of you. Regardless of past indiscretions. To quote you so eloquently, "We can only hope you will never become a licensed PA." Well in your case, we can only hope the perfect never falter, and when they do, we can only hope the judgement you receive is equal to that you give out. You take care now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyM2 Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Your presumptions about my background are entirely wrong. Quite the opposite, but I do maintain very high ethical standards and expect such high ethical standards from those who practice medicine, police officers, attorneys, judges, politicians and others who have the public trust. It is indeed unfortunate that there are bad apples in those and many other professions but in each of those professions, those who violate the rules of conduct if and when caught, are commonly suspended or dismissed. If you will search the word "misdemeanor" on PA forum, you will find many sad cases of people with a single DUI or other misdemeanor not getting into PA school or not being allowed by their state licensing authority to practice. Why do you think the authorities don't just forgive them? I mentioned hamburger flippers only because that isn't a job where employers and customers typically demand the highest ethical standards. I have done that job and a number of even less romantic jobs like digging ditches, mowing lawns and house painting. I don't look down on those jobs but they aren't where I want to spend my professional career and I repeat that when those in a profession lose the public trust, that profession and every one in it is diminished...think politicians and bankers. I wouldn't want to see that happen to the PA profession. I don't know where your apparent anger is coming from but if you try showing this entire thread to a number of professional PAs I suspect more of them will agree with my position than yours. You are, of course, entitled to your own opinion, but not your own facts. I was simply responding to the facts from the original post. Aren't you at all curious about how someone would shoplift twice? Does that not give you any pause? What conduct WOULD you consider inexcusable? Sent from my Kindle Fire HDX using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
db_pavnp Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I don't want to presume things about you, but it does bother me that you have suggested that there must be something wrong with people who believe minor indiscretions can be atoned for (last sentence, post #10). Ethics are intuitive. People have different intuitions. The way this is phrased does have an air of intolerance to it, as it isn't just the offender you take issue with, but anyone who isn't as strict as you are. I feel it is better to struggle with morality and to have won than it is to never experience temptation. Only through trials are our true characters found and we cannot all win every challenge. Disappointment in oneself can be an extremely powerful motivator. I wanted to edit this in, too: Society does have high ethical standards in place regarding individuals who prepare food. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cinntsp Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 As for the rest of you who have read this post and just moved on without responding, do you really want your ranks contaminated with people like this. That would truly make you a Physician's Assistant, not a Physician Assistant. Sent from my Kindle Fire HDX using Tapatalk 2 Huh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bodiggler Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 You might get into a program and graduate MAYBE. However, that doesn't mean an employer will want to hire you or that the Medical Board will grant you a DEA license. I know people who have gotten DUIs and had a very hard time finding a job as a PA and a hard time getting their DEA license. Shop lifting is bad, but the fact that you did it twice says you don't learn from your mistakes. It will be hard to convince and ADCOM of this. Best of luck. Sorry your past is coming back to haunt you, however each choice we make has consequences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyM2 Posted January 24, 2014 Share Posted January 24, 2014 Bd_kiliman. You can argue as much as you want with what you perceive as my intolerance. As Boddigler points out, the real problem will come from adcoms, licensing boards and prospective employers. They may have a built-in bureaucratic intolerance that is hard to overcome and they have the power to limit careers. Sent from my Kindle Fire HDX using Tapatalk 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SHU-CH Posted January 25, 2014 Share Posted January 25, 2014 Speaking for adcoms, I like to think we do not have a "built-in bureaucratic intolerance." We have to make decisions about distributing a very limited resource (seats). With 10 applicants for a seat, a criminal history is one of many things that will come under consideration. I can see that a licensing board might be like that. They do not care how many licenses they give out, they just need to make a go/no go decision regarding your qualificiations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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