Moderator EMEDPA Posted December 6, 2014 Moderator Share Posted December 6, 2014 If I could talk the family into this move I would have already applied. seen today on the sempa job site: Job Title: Physician Assistant Company: National Medical Services(employer detail) Location: Ellsworth, Maine Date Posted: 11/21/2014Full Time/Part Time: Full TimePermanent/Temporary: RegularEmployment/Contract Work: EmploymentVisa Waiver Available: N/AJob #: 1587018 Apply View Similar JobsSave this JobForward to a Friend Job DescriptionWe are seeking a Physician Assistant for an Emergency Medicine position on the coast of Maine. Will consider experienced providers or strong new graduates with previous EM background. Moderate average patient volume although it fluxgates seasonally. Schedule will be 72-24 hr. shifts/yr. (6 per month). Schedule flexibility (ask for details). No call, occasional weekends as schedule dictates. Option for additional shifts for additional pay. EMR. Salary will be $90 - 100k+ with a comprehensive benefit package including 26 days PTO, malpractice, health insurance, dental/vision/disability, retirement, and 1 wk paid CME. Relocation assistance. Maine is noted for its natural scenic beauty and gourmet sea food. Dine on Lobster daily, if you wish. Unlimited outdoor recreational activities year round. Spectacular outdoor festivals. A place to leave the clutter behind and rediscover the peace and quiet that is good for the soul. Everyone waves hello. Affordable housing, great schools, many amenities and an amazingly authentic lifestyle. Awesome coastal location. This is your place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nonlegit Posted December 6, 2014 Share Posted December 6, 2014 Now thats what I'm talking about! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbrothers98 Posted December 6, 2014 Share Posted December 6, 2014 Salary is too low for 2 reasons. Unless spouse has similar salary, cost of living is higher than normal. Entry to real estate in New England is not cheap. Nice home in nice neighborhood will run about 300k plus. Then there are taxes, heating, everything else more expensive than other areas of the country. Next, you are practicing at the very peak of your license. Resuscitations, critical care, likely responsible for care of inpatients some of the time. This should be 150k period. If this was offered to a physician with EM experience, it would start at 200k. Board cert EM docs in New England median salary is $250-270k. You will be held responsible to the level of a physician caring for this population, you should get paid commensurately. G Brothers PA-C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted December 6, 2014 Author Moderator Share Posted December 6, 2014 Salary is too low for 2 reasons. Unless spouse has similar salary, cost of living is higher than normal. Entry to real estate in New England is not cheap. Nice home in nice neighborhood will run about 300k plus. Then there are taxes, heating, everything else more expensive than other areas of the country. Next, you are practicing at the very peak of your license. Resuscitations, critical care, likely responsible for care of inpatients some of the time. This should be 150k period. If this was offered to a physician with EM experience, it would start at 200k. Board cert EM docs in New England median salary is $250-270k. You will be held responsible to the level of a physician caring for this population, you should get paid commensurately. G Brothers PA-C agree. I know about your current job site and consider your job the best em pa job in the country today. not every similar site will be able to meet the same pay /benefits level. I ask my wife every few years if we are ready to apply for positions in your neck of the woods... my thought was the value of the benefits package makes up for some of that. 26 days vacation is a lot more than I get now, almost double( I currently get 14 eight hr days/yr, but it's em so I can flex time as much unpaid leave as I want). this also includes relocation and a week of cme leave( I currently get cme funds but no paid days) with pay plus full medical/dental/vision/retirement. the base schedule is 6 days/mo. I would probably do 7, so assuming the same rate of pay(although it might be 1.5x for extra?) of basically 58/hr that adds around 17k/yr. for 23-24 days off/mo and a great benefits package in a great location I would work for the approx 120k/yr this job offers. It's less than I make now, but the lifestyle would be so much better. cost of living is about equivalent to where I live now. scope of practice is as good as my best per diem job. a thread from a few years ago applies here. lowest acceptable salary for perfect dream job: http://www.physicianassistantforum.com/index.php?/topic/69-perfect-job-minimal-acceptable-salary/?hl=%2Breasonable+%2Bbenefit+%2Bchild+%2Bcare Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbrothers98 Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 agree. I know about your current job site and consider your job the best em pa job in the country today. not every similar site will be able to meet the same pay /benefits level. I ask my wife every few years if we are ready to apply for positions in your neck of the woods... my thought was the value of the benefits package makes up for some of that. 26 days vacation is a lot more than I get now, almost double( I currently get 14 eight hr days/yr, but it's em so I can flex time as much unpaid leave as I want). this also includes relocation and a week of cme leave( I currently get cme funds but no paid days) with pay plus full medical/dental/vision/retirement. the base schedule is 6 days/mo. I would probably do 7, so assuming the same rate of pay(although it might be 1.5x for extra?) of basically 58/hr that adds around 17k/yr. for 23-24 days off/mo and a great benefits package in a great location I would work for the approx 120k/yr this job offers. It's less than I make now, but the lifestyle would be so much better. cost of living is about equivalent to where I live now. scope of practice is as good as my best per diem job. a thread from a few years ago applies here. lowest acceptable salary for perfect dream job: http://www.physicianassistantforum.com/index.php?/topic/69-perfect-job-minimal-acceptable-salary/?hl=%2Breasonable+%2Bbenefit+%2Bchild+%2Bcare One can definitely look at this 2 ways. Compare to what you have now and it is an improvement, so position is viewed in a positive light. But view it for what it really is, an autonomous high functioning position that you will have to do much work outside of to maintain competency. Put all that together and the current package is not sufficient. What you are doing above is an apples to apples comparison. I am not doing a comparison, I am pointing out that salary is not commensurate with the job requirements. You can make 90 to 100k in New England without the responsibility, experience or knowledge base needed here. So I hear and understand your argument and rationale, it makes sense from within your situation and your employment experience. I am throwing that all out cause I think along with striving for independent practice, that there are a multitude of PAs whom practice at the top of their license that are not paid their worth. My question is why? Because we continually work within salary ranges and let others dictate what our worth is, even when they are wrong. Likely many of us are stuck, kids in school, family in a certain region, house under water, just cant tell those others to blow it out their a$$ and leave for a better deal. But moving to a new position such as this is an opportunity to improve. But once precedent is set, precedent is difficult to break. Difficult to negotiate improved compensation in a job you are already doing competently at an established salary. There is little legitimate justification, they already have you and most people wont do what they have to in order to affect change. Plus entertaining strong new grads for a position such as this is an insight that the recruiter advertising has no idea what they are getting someone in for. GB PA-C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted December 7, 2014 Author Moderator Share Posted December 7, 2014 agree that a position such as this SHOULD pay 150k+ and they SHOULD NOT take a new grad. I don't know of too many solo jobs which offer autonomy + high pay. that is the holy grail of em pa positions. most offer 1 or the other. There are many more solo positions on the east than the west coast. I know of less than 5 jobs total west of the rockies. I am much more concerned about autonomy/scope of practice/respect at this point in my career than money. I have no school loans and no significant debt other than things like mortgage, car payments, etc. I know what I am worth, but also know some things are more important to me than money. I am hoping to work my way into a position at one of my current per diem jobs which you would approve of. only full time guy retiring soon. All 4 per diem PAs likely want it. 2 of us have the CAQ. 3 of the 4 have > 15 years em experience. I figure I am only competing against 2 other folks for this, both 5+ years older than me so likely to retire sooner. the one I don't feel is competition has < 7 yrs experience and also does not have the CAQ. 8 24 hr shifts/mo @ 70/hr= $161,280 + full benefits. solo coverage, high acuity, low volume. 30+% admit/transfer rate, 12-14 pts/24 hrs. typical pt is > 65 yrs old with multiple comorbidities. I applied to this job every year for a decade before I even got an interview. my last 12 hr night shift there I saw 5 pts; admitted 2 and transferred 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delco714 Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 I may be able to squeeze into this position eventually..about 30 miles south down route 1 from my work house :) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delco714 Posted December 7, 2014 Share Posted December 7, 2014 Oh also about cost of living? Sure some taxes suck..like state, car registration... but property tax is low, and real estate cheap.. I have two "nice" houses in Maine that are $300k together..the coast can be more expensive at time depending on desires and specific location, sure, but living in Maine has far too many upsides. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treejay Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 on a different note, Ellsworth itself is kind of an ugly town IMO, but it's the gateway to Mt Desert Island which is not far away and is stunning (including Acadia NP) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted December 8, 2014 Author Moderator Share Posted December 8, 2014 on a different note, Ellsworth itself is kind of an ugly town IMO, but it's the gateway to Mt Desert Island which is not far away and is stunning (including Acadia NP) Just at FYI- The MDI hospital is also a solo pa gig...I see the job advertised every few years...also on my top 10 fantasy list.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatswain2PA Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 I am intimately familiar with that neck of the woods, and still own a rental house (a beautifully renovated 160 year old farm house) about 15 minutes east of there. Was just there this summer (or, "summah" as they say there) that I might sell to the right person! The hospital in Ellsworth is Maine Coast Memorial Hospital, and is actually the hospital where I met my first PA in about 14 years ago..and the person who got me interested in becoming a PA myself. The ED gets over 18K visits a year, but I would imagine that, like everything else in town, the vast majority of these come during the summah months, so I would guess they double cover these months (although I don't know that). As for housing: South of Ellsworth the housing approaches Boston prices, mostly because many of the wealthy Bostonians also own land on or near Mount Desert Island (home of Acadia National Park, and Bar Harbor - where MDI hospital is). North and west of Ellsworth is also expensive, but less so. If you go east of Ellsworth the prices drop dramatically because none of the uber-wealthy go further east of Ellsworth as they travel to "The Island" every summer. "The Island" is really just a tourist trap, worth seeing once a year if you live there, but not worth living on. The area is an absolutely beautiful place to live in if you like the outdoors. There are decently marked hiking trails very close to my house where I have hiked for three days without seeing more than 4-5 people. There are hundreds of "ponds" that vary from ten to hundreds of acres in size. Amazing hunting and fishing. Snowmobiling and skiing if you're into that. However, be warned, as a guy who worked for me said once, it get's "OH MY GAWD EVACUATE THE F(@%!N& STATE COLD" there in the winter. Treejay - if you go up that way again, look at going just a little further East. Few people go to Schoodic Peninsula which has just as beautiful scenery as MDI. Or hike up the Schoodic Mountain trail system. LOTS to do in that area that doesn't involve fighting the congestion of MDI. EMED - I would take Ellsworth over MDI any day. If you work MDI, you will have to pay a half-million for a decent house, or commute. If you commute, you will be driving the same two-lane road on and off the island that probably 75,000 other people do every day. It's only 21 miles from Ellsworth to Bar Harbor, but in the summer months that can take you well over an hour to drive. Delco - huge difference in housing costs between Ellsworth area and Bangor...although I preferred living in Bangor over the Ellsworth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
delco714 Posted December 8, 2014 Share Posted December 8, 2014 Ive looked at housing all throughout that part of down east. I live in winterport. Plenty of reasonable real estate starting searsoort south Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatswain2PA Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Reasonable real estate in Belfast? Winterport has a sweet location between Ellsworth/MDI and Bangor along the back roads. I lived in Franklin, and commuted to the quiet-side of the island for four years. Terrible commute unless I did it at 0530. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treejay Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Treejay - if you go up that way again, look at going just a little further East. Few people go to Schoodic Peninsula which has just as beautiful scenery as MDI. Or hike up the Schoodic Mountain trail system. LOTS to do in that area that doesn't involve fighting the congestion of MDI. I do remember the Schoodic peninsula. It is quite lovely from sea but never stepped foot on it. Used to teach sailing out there in coastal Maine and I remember crossing Frenchman's Bay in thick pea soup fog hearing the roar of the power cat leaving from Bar Harbor headed for Nova Scotia, praying we wouldn't be crushed. "Securite Securite...." sounds like you're a sailor too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatswain2PA Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 Yup. I was the chief of the Coast Guard SAR station there. My crew was responsible from Petite Manan to Isle LA Haut. When the fishermen were coming in from the storms, we were pushing out for training. Western Way can get a bit bumpy when the swells are out of the south. Pan pan, pan pan, pan pan, hello all stations... I'm glad I retired, that is a young man's game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
primadonna22274 Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 I've only visited that coast once several years ago. It was beautiful...of course it was July lol Got a full-spectrum attending job in 2.5 yr for FM willing to cover ED and inpatient (no OB, yuck!!!) that qualifies for my NHSC LRP? ???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boatswain2PA Posted December 9, 2014 Share Posted December 9, 2014 FYI - this job is NOT in Ellsworth, its in Bar Harbor. With the cost of housing, and traffic for those who would commute, they should pay $150-$200K. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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