lmccary31 Posted October 6, 2016 Share Posted October 6, 2016 Hello, I have an issue that I need an opinion on. I am a new graduate physician assistant as of August 6th and am currently certified. However, I live in Kentucky and am finding that the state license process is very long and the hiring process is even longer. The hospital says the credentialing process will take 3 months before I can get started and they need to find me a supervising physician and an alternate physician to sign off on me just for my state license. I decided to work locum tenems for the Indian Health Services but I need a state license (from anywhere). I went through Utah and got my license in 1-2 days. Now I am applying for my DEA license and I have hit a speed bump. It needs me to list an address in Utah. I cannot list my Kentucky address as it will say I have no schedule authority there. Any thoughts on what to do? I just need my DEA so I can work in NM, NE, and SD areas for 2 weeks on/off until I start working here in Kentucky. What do people from other states who have DEA licenses without schedule authority in their state do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator rev ronin Posted October 6, 2016 Administrator Share Posted October 6, 2016 Ask your contact at the IHS what to do about that if you need your DEA license for your IHS job. If you don't, then just wait until you have a KY license. Since DEA numbers are only good for one state at a time, you would only be able to prescribe in Utah, so it makes sense for you to need an address there. Overall, I've found the DEA far more reasonable than most states' licensing (Washington state rocks, though) or credentialing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmccary31 Posted October 7, 2016 Author Share Posted October 7, 2016 Thanks for your response. Unfortunately Kentucky does not allow prescribing of schedule drugs so I cannot get a DEA in Kentucky. I will contact them tomorrow and see if there is an alternative Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator rev ronin Posted October 7, 2016 Administrator Share Posted October 7, 2016 Thanks for your response. Unfortunately Kentucky does not allow prescribing of schedule drugs so I cannot get a DEA in Kentucky. I will contact them tomorrow and see if there is an alternative Then why do you need a DEA license? The IHS locums work? Seems pretty spendy for such occasional work... And locums work as a new grad is an interesting proposition (read: you are likely getting in over your head), made even more potentially interesting by the possibility of prescribing controlled substances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aquafresh11 Posted October 7, 2016 Share Posted October 7, 2016 I don't know if it applies for locums, but IHS employees are eligible for free DEA, it is restricted to use only in tribal clinics and hospitals, but doesn't cost a thing. I would inquire with your employer or better yet the site where you would be placed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpackelly Posted October 7, 2016 Share Posted October 7, 2016 Use the main IHS office in the state you are working in for the application. Then you will need to change the license info to the exact office where you are prescribing controlled drugs. Alternatively, actually I would do this first, contact the IHS. You do need. Site specific dea for each state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmccary31 Posted October 9, 2016 Author Share Posted October 9, 2016 Then why do you need a DEA license? The IHS locums work? Seems pretty spendy for such occasional work... And locums work as a new grad is an interesting proposition (read: you are likely getting in over your head), made even more potentially interesting by the possibility of prescribing controlled substances. Well I graduated in August and all I have found for work in my area (moving isn't an option unfortunately) is a PRN job and the company(TeamHealth) is taking an excruciating aamount of time to find me an SP and an alternate SP to sign off on my Kentucky license. Then they have background cchecks and etc. To do which is projected to take 3 more months. I have 2 children to support and II'm working in a restaurant to pay my bills and need to start working sooner. Indian Health Services as a locums opportunity seems to be a viable and practical option until I can find full time work. I do understand the concern with me being a new grad but I need to put my family first. Also, I was not eligible for the dea license due to not actually working in Utah and I am not considered a goverenment employee who is fee exempt for the license if I do locum IHS. Thanks for the replies, hopefully they will contract me without one amd allow me to use the facility dea or just have the SP do those scripts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator rev ronin Posted October 10, 2016 Administrator Share Posted October 10, 2016 You're getting off to a terrible start in your career. Without relatively rapid licensure and solid PA work soon after your graduation, you're going to be less and less employable as time goes on. Probably less so in a state like KY, but if you are eventually able to leave, you will need to explain resume gaps like that--if you're even given a chance to do so. It makes me sick inside to hear these sorts of stories from new grads--where is your PA program? Did they not help you prepare for the slog and delays in an unfriendly state like KY? IHS is not a place where you are likely to find easy patients or good MD support, I suspect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dchampigny Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 You're getting off to a terrible start in your career. Without relatively rapid licensure and solid PA work soon after your graduation, you're going to be less and less employable as time goes on. Probably less so in a state like KY, but if you are eventually able to leave, you will need to explain resume gaps like that--if you're even given a chance to do so. It makes me sick inside to hear these sorts of stories from new grads--where is your PA program? Did they not help you prepare for the slog and delays in an unfriendly state like KY? IHS is not a place where you are likely to find easy patients or good MD support, I suspect. It really is difficult out there. My program told us that I would be a long haul before we would be licensed, DEAed, and credentialed. But when you are an eager beaver who just passed their PANCE, you want to believe in your heart that you will be able to see patients sooner rather than later. That is not true, especially in my experience! I graduated May 15, Pance on May 23, PA-C on June 2...........only now am I slowly starting to see patients independently based on insurances, with plenty of days to wait for certain insurances. I definitely can relate. It's a struggle. I did not receive my first pay check until about 3 months after graduation. It's a long haul for sure. IF you are a PA-S reading this..........set out atleast 3 months worth of expenses post graduation! You may not get paid until then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Z PA-C Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 It really is difficult out there. My program told us that I would be a long haul before we would be licensed, DEAed, and credentialed. But when you are an eager beaver who just passed their PANCE, you want to believe in your heart that you will be able to see patients sooner rather than later. That is not true, especially in my experience! I graduated May 15, Pance on May 23, PA-C on June 2...........only now am I slowly starting to see patients independently based on insurances, with plenty of days to wait for certain insurances. I definitely can relate. It's a struggle. I did not receive my first pay check until about 3 months after graduation. It's a long haul for sure. IF you are a PA-S reading this..........set out atleast 3 months worth of expenses post graduation! You may not get paid until then! It really does vary widely by state. It seems like credentialing is what takes the longest depending on institution. In CA, I was able to get licensed and start work 3 weeks after graduation and it could have been as early as 2 weeks if NCCPA could release scores faster. I totally understand your desire to start making an income 2+ years is a long time to go with no positive cash flow, especially with a family to support. Do what you have to do! Sounds like your situation is just temporary so hopefully you're able to find something more stable very soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ohiovolffemtp Posted October 10, 2016 Share Posted October 10, 2016 Imccary31, You need to take a look at each piece of the process to understand where the delays are. KY does require a supervising and alternate supervising physician before you can get your license. It's your employer's responsibility to do that. Push on your recruiter to identify these folks and get their signatures. Once they have that done, you can apply for your temporary license. You'll also need information from your school, PANCE, etc. I got a temporary KY license in 30 days. I also have an Ohio license and the doc was eager to get me working. Credentialing at a hospital is a separate and typically slow (3 months-ish) process. Your employer should also be helping - they can't make any money off you until you have a license and are credentialed. KY does not currently allow a PA to prescribe any schedule medications, so you can't get a DEA # for KY. You also won't be able to get an ID for CASPER, KY's narc prescription registry. Talk to your employer about what the hold-ups are and how they can help. Also, if you're close to any border state, talk to your employer if they have any needs. Your employer has lots of openings in Ohio, some in Indiana. They may want to use you there as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ERCat Posted October 13, 2016 Share Posted October 13, 2016 How is this PA getting a terrible start on his or her career, Rev Ronin? Why are we already freaking out about not being employable due to gaps in employment? Most employers are well aware that between boards, license, DEA and credentialing it can take months to start working. Nothing abnormal or concerning about this at all. I graduated July 30 and did not start working until December 1! I took my boards two weeks after graduation, got the results two weeks after that. Got my license in mid October. THEN got my DEA two weeks after that. The hospital I work for wouldn't even START my credentialing until I had my license and DEA. So basically I was unemployed for four full months after graduation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DizzyJ Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Out of curiosity....if you are working for the federal government, such as IHS, do you really need to have a DEA for each site/state? Are you not following federal regulations and not state regulations? I guess it would matter where your prescriptions are filled perhaps. Do you write an RX at the IHS site that then goes to a CVS or do they have their own government pharmacy? Seems there should be a process to get a DEA in KY if you are working federally within the state. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator rev ronin Posted October 14, 2016 Administrator Share Posted October 14, 2016 How is this PA getting a terrible start on his or her career, Rev Ronin? Why are we already freaking out about not being employable due to gaps in employment? Most employers are well aware that between boards, license, DEA and credentialing it can take months to start working. Nothing abnormal or concerning about this at all. You're right, I was conflating two things and probably came across worse than it is. There are really two separate issues: 1) Licensing delays. As you pointed out, some of that can be normal. KY is a special kind of stupid, however, as are several other states. I may just be spoiled, living in Washington, but I was working within six weeks of graduation--final license, DEA, credentialing, etc. 2) Locums off the bat, and IHS at that. The reason they'll hire new grad locums is almost certainly because they are short-staffed. That means lots of work thrown at a new grad, without much or any support. I never want my students to be in that situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loliz Posted October 14, 2016 Share Posted October 14, 2016 Your DEA needs to be in the state where you are working. Ask IHS what your practice address is and ask them how to handle this. Having a DEA and license in a state that you are not working is effectively worthless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aem19 Posted November 9, 2016 Share Posted November 9, 2016 Jumping on this topic to ask a DEA related question. I am changing jobs within the same hospital and will have a new supervising physician. Do I need to inform the DEA about the Supervising Doc change. As far as I can tell from online search and bringing up the DEA "change" application, there is no mention of my Supervising doc. The only place I can find that I need to change the supervising do is on my Massachusetts controlled substance registration. Does any know if I need to let the DEA know? Thanks Allison Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DizzyJ Posted November 9, 2016 Share Posted November 9, 2016 No, you don't need to inform the DEA. They don't ask about this on your initial application nor renewal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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