ATCLATEMTB Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 What the original poster also failed to mention, which is far more important to those of us already practicing in Indiana.....is the addition of schedule II drugs! Finally, (as of july 1, 2013) I won't have to ask an NP to write for Percocet to discharge a patient. Honesty, the whole first year without Rx was a pain the butt, but routinely having to find an NP / MD in my practice to sign II narcs is annoying! Also, are gaining the ability to provide refills on controlled substances. This is going to be HUGE (I hope) for PA positions in Indiana. There is a strong pull in some systems / locations for NP's in Indiana based partly on restrictive Rx laws. The laws have been restrictive for PA's since we gained the ability to prescribe in circa 2007(?) because our State Legislature has a particularly ANTI-PA former nurse now lawmaker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATCLATEMTB Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 What the original poster also failed to mention, which is far more important to those of us already practicing in Indiana.....is the addition of schedule II drugs! Finally, (as of july 1, 2013) I won't have to ask an NP to write for Percocet to discharge a patient. Honesty, the whole first year without Rx was a pain the butt, but routinely having to find an NP / MD in my practice to sign II narcs is annoying! Also, are gaining the ability to provide refills on controlled substances. This is going to be HUGE (I hope) for PA positions in Indiana. There is a strong pull in some systems / locations for NP's in Indiana based partly on restrictive Rx laws. The laws have been restrictive for PA's since we gained the ability to prescribe in circa 2007(?) because our State Legislature has a particularly ANTI-PA former nurse now lawmaker. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasip Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 Out of curiosity, does/will the state of Indiana require a special form for the schedule II or can you write it on a traditional pad? In Texas, they're on (or at least have been on, the last time I saw one) triplicate forms with a copy going to the pharmacy, the prescriber keeping a copy, and one going to Tx Dept of Pub Safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasip Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 Out of curiosity, does/will the state of Indiana require a special form for the schedule II or can you write it on a traditional pad? In Texas, they're on (or at least have been on, the last time I saw one) triplicate forms with a copy going to the pharmacy, the prescriber keeping a copy, and one going to Tx Dept of Pub Safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teasip Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 Out of curiosity, does/will the state of Indiana require a special form for the schedule II or can you write it on a traditional pad? In Texas, they're on (or at least have been on, the last time I saw one) triplicate forms with a copy going to the pharmacy, the prescriber keeping a copy, and one going to Tx Dept of Pub Safety. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 What the original poster also failed to mention, which is far more important to those of us already practicing in Indiana.....is the addition of schedule II drugs! Finally, (as of july 1, 2013) I won't have to ask an NP to write for Percocet to discharge a patient. Honesty, the whole first year without Rx was a pain the butt, but routinely having to find an NP / MD in my practice to sign II narcs is annoying! Also, are gaining the ability to provide refills on controlled substances. This is going to be HUGE (I hope) for PA positions in Indiana. There is a strong pull in some systems / locations for NP's in Indiana based partly on restrictive Rx laws. The laws have been restrictive for PA's since we gained the ability to prescribe in circa 2007(?) because our State Legislature has a particularly ANTI-PA former nurse now lawmaker. NPs are allowed to sign a PA script? Did you have to discuss the case with them and then they would write the script and dictate a note about the patients condition? I find it odd that Indiana allowed that. Why didn't your SP sign the scripts? Did you dictate the NP wrote and signed the script and agreed with your assessment? Would they be liable if the patient used the controlled substance criminally or died from an overdose? It cares me to think an NP "signing" for a PA.....and leads me to think of them someday gaining control over us! I've probably jumped to a conclusion from your post.....but please clarify! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 What the original poster also failed to mention, which is far more important to those of us already practicing in Indiana.....is the addition of schedule II drugs! Finally, (as of july 1, 2013) I won't have to ask an NP to write for Percocet to discharge a patient. Honesty, the whole first year without Rx was a pain the butt, but routinely having to find an NP / MD in my practice to sign II narcs is annoying! Also, are gaining the ability to provide refills on controlled substances. This is going to be HUGE (I hope) for PA positions in Indiana. There is a strong pull in some systems / locations for NP's in Indiana based partly on restrictive Rx laws. The laws have been restrictive for PA's since we gained the ability to prescribe in circa 2007(?) because our State Legislature has a particularly ANTI-PA former nurse now lawmaker. NPs are allowed to sign a PA script? Did you have to discuss the case with them and then they would write the script and dictate a note about the patients condition? I find it odd that Indiana allowed that. Why didn't your SP sign the scripts? Did you dictate the NP wrote and signed the script and agreed with your assessment? Would they be liable if the patient used the controlled substance criminally or died from an overdose? It cares me to think an NP "signing" for a PA.....and leads me to think of them someday gaining control over us! I've probably jumped to a conclusion from your post.....but please clarify! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 What the original poster also failed to mention, which is far more important to those of us already practicing in Indiana.....is the addition of schedule II drugs! Finally, (as of july 1, 2013) I won't have to ask an NP to write for Percocet to discharge a patient. Honesty, the whole first year without Rx was a pain the butt, but routinely having to find an NP / MD in my practice to sign II narcs is annoying! Also, are gaining the ability to provide refills on controlled substances. This is going to be HUGE (I hope) for PA positions in Indiana. There is a strong pull in some systems / locations for NP's in Indiana based partly on restrictive Rx laws. The laws have been restrictive for PA's since we gained the ability to prescribe in circa 2007(?) because our State Legislature has a particularly ANTI-PA former nurse now lawmaker. NPs are allowed to sign a PA script? Did you have to discuss the case with them and then they would write the script and dictate a note about the patients condition? I find it odd that Indiana allowed that. Why didn't your SP sign the scripts? Did you dictate the NP wrote and signed the script and agreed with your assessment? Would they be liable if the patient used the controlled substance criminally or died from an overdose? It cares me to think an NP "signing" for a PA.....and leads me to think of them someday gaining control over us! I've probably jumped to a conclusion from your post.....but please clarify! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATCLATEMTB Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 Yes, you jumped to conclusions. We work for the same service, have same SP's / collaboration physicians. In Indiana physicians can only supervise two PA's max. (currently) So to get around this hospitals will simply hire NP's (who have no max ratio) to assist our teams while we PAs/MDs are in the OR. I often prep discharges early in the morning, then head to the OR with my doc.....leaving the NP to finish discharges durning more normal hours. They do discharge education, discharge summaries, and any special follow-up visits like INR checks. We work as a team, for more efficient, comprehensive, and timely care. While I share you concerns that on a large scale NP's are making great movements....in the trenches we work together for patient care. I should have more clearly outlined the structure in my first post, so as not to confuse readers. That does remind me though....part of the new legislation also reduces the number of chart reviews and co-signs required by PA's/MD teams....but also changes the language of the law making a maximum number of PA's an MD can supervise at ONE TIME to two. Which will create more flexible / dynamic staffing models and I hope will make hiring PA's a little more desirable then in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATCLATEMTB Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 Yes, you jumped to conclusions. We work for the same service, have same SP's / collaboration physicians. In Indiana physicians can only supervise two PA's max. (currently) So to get around this hospitals will simply hire NP's (who have no max ratio) to assist our teams while we PAs/MDs are in the OR. I often prep discharges early in the morning, then head to the OR with my doc.....leaving the NP to finish discharges durning more normal hours. They do discharge education, discharge summaries, and any special follow-up visits like INR checks. We work as a team, for more efficient, comprehensive, and timely care. While I share you concerns that on a large scale NP's are making great movements....in the trenches we work together for patient care. I should have more clearly outlined the structure in my first post, so as not to confuse readers. That does remind me though....part of the new legislation also reduces the number of chart reviews and co-signs required by PA's/MD teams....but also changes the language of the law making a maximum number of PA's an MD can supervise at ONE TIME to two. Which will create more flexible / dynamic staffing models and I hope will make hiring PA's a little more desirable then in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATCLATEMTB Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 Yes, you jumped to conclusions. We work for the same service, have same SP's / collaboration physicians. In Indiana physicians can only supervise two PA's max. (currently) So to get around this hospitals will simply hire NP's (who have no max ratio) to assist our teams while we PAs/MDs are in the OR. I often prep discharges early in the morning, then head to the OR with my doc.....leaving the NP to finish discharges durning more normal hours. They do discharge education, discharge summaries, and any special follow-up visits like INR checks. We work as a team, for more efficient, comprehensive, and timely care. While I share you concerns that on a large scale NP's are making great movements....in the trenches we work together for patient care. I should have more clearly outlined the structure in my first post, so as not to confuse readers. That does remind me though....part of the new legislation also reduces the number of chart reviews and co-signs required by PA's/MD teams....but also changes the language of the law making a maximum number of PA's an MD can supervise at ONE TIME to two. Which will create more flexible / dynamic staffing models and I hope will make hiring PA's a little more desirable then in the past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATCLATEMTB Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 At this time Indiana has no special requirements for narc scripts, as it seems Texas does. Paper scripts, with DEA#, and signature is all. This is the same across the board for MD's/DOs/PA's/NPs/DDS etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATCLATEMTB Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 At this time Indiana has no special requirements for narc scripts, as it seems Texas does. Paper scripts, with DEA#, and signature is all. This is the same across the board for MD's/DOs/PA's/NPs/DDS etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATCLATEMTB Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 At this time Indiana has no special requirements for narc scripts, as it seems Texas does. Paper scripts, with DEA#, and signature is all. This is the same across the board for MD's/DOs/PA's/NPs/DDS etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Febrifuge Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 Mea Culpa. in my haste, I was conflating "low potential for abuse" with "no significant potential for abuse," so I lumped everything together on the high-numbered end of the scale. it's true -- the DEA doesn't put BP meds in any Schedule category. The larger point though is that someone who can only prescribe "non-controlled" meds will still wind up being unable to write some pretty common and benign meds, stuff that has some abuse potential, but isn't Oxy either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Febrifuge Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 Mea Culpa. in my haste, I was conflating "low potential for abuse" with "no significant potential for abuse," so I lumped everything together on the high-numbered end of the scale. it's true -- the DEA doesn't put BP meds in any Schedule category. The larger point though is that someone who can only prescribe "non-controlled" meds will still wind up being unable to write some pretty common and benign meds, stuff that has some abuse potential, but isn't Oxy either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Febrifuge Posted May 5, 2013 Share Posted May 5, 2013 Mea Culpa. in my haste, I was conflating "low potential for abuse" with "no significant potential for abuse," so I lumped everything together on the high-numbered end of the scale. it's true -- the DEA doesn't put BP meds in any Schedule category. The larger point though is that someone who can only prescribe "non-controlled" meds will still wind up being unable to write some pretty common and benign meds, stuff that has some abuse potential, but isn't Oxy either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemegroup Posted May 6, 2013 Share Posted May 6, 2013 If I had to ask a NP to sign for meds for my patient ... I think I would move states, find a new career ... all after I yelled at the top of my lungs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemegroup Posted May 6, 2013 Share Posted May 6, 2013 If I had to ask a NP to sign for meds for my patient ... I think I would move states, find a new career ... all after I yelled at the top of my lungs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hemegroup Posted May 6, 2013 Share Posted May 6, 2013 If I had to ask a NP to sign for meds for my patient ... I think I would move states, find a new career ... all after I yelled at the top of my lungs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joanna.nola Posted May 6, 2013 Share Posted May 6, 2013 If I had to ask a NP to sign for meds for my patient ... I think I would move states, find a new career ... all after I yelled at the top of my lungs. I'm so jealous!! I'm on month four of practicing in what might possibly now be the last state that requires a year of work before giving prescriptive authority. And I have to admit, in a pinch, I've had my colleague (an NP) sign a scrip for me. Usually I'm ERXing everything under my SPs name. Still, a HUGE pain in the butt. If I didn't love New Orleans so much, I'd certainly move. But our city JUST got a PA program (I went to PA school out of state); I think change is in the air down here. But they do say that everyone will wissh they were in Louisiana when the apocalypse happens 'cause we are 20 years behind the rest of the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joanna.nola Posted May 6, 2013 Share Posted May 6, 2013 If I had to ask a NP to sign for meds for my patient ... I think I would move states, find a new career ... all after I yelled at the top of my lungs. I'm so jealous!! I'm on month four of practicing in what might possibly now be the last state that requires a year of work before giving prescriptive authority. And I have to admit, in a pinch, I've had my colleague (an NP) sign a scrip for me. Usually I'm ERXing everything under my SPs name. Still, a HUGE pain in the butt. If I didn't love New Orleans so much, I'd certainly move. But our city JUST got a PA program (I went to PA school out of state); I think change is in the air down here. But they do say that everyone will wissh they were in Louisiana when the apocalypse happens 'cause we are 20 years behind the rest of the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joanna.nola Posted May 6, 2013 Share Posted May 6, 2013 If I had to ask a NP to sign for meds for my patient ... I think I would move states, find a new career ... all after I yelled at the top of my lungs. I'm so jealous!! I'm on month four of practicing in what might possibly now be the last state that requires a year of work before giving prescriptive authority. And I have to admit, in a pinch, I've had my colleague (an NP) sign a scrip for me. Usually I'm ERXing everything under my SPs name. Still, a HUGE pain in the butt. If I didn't love New Orleans so much, I'd certainly move. But our city JUST got a PA program (I went to PA school out of state); I think change is in the air down here. But they do say that everyone will wissh they were in Louisiana when the apocalypse happens 'cause we are 20 years behind the rest of the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator True Anomaly Posted May 7, 2013 Moderator Share Posted May 7, 2013 I'm so jealous!! I'm on month four of practicing in what might possibly now be the last state that requires a year of work before giving prescriptive authority. And I have to admit, in a pinch, I've had my colleague (an NP) sign a scrip for me. Usually I'm ERXing everything under my SPs name. Still, a HUGE pain in the butt. If I didn't love New Orleans so much, I'd certainly move. But our city JUST got a PA program (I went to PA school out of state); I think change is in the air down here. But they do say that everyone will wissh they were in Louisiana when the apocalypse happens 'cause we are 20 years behind the rest of the country. Is this true of ANY PA who comes to practice in Louisiana...that you need a year of practicing in that state before you are able to write your own Rx's, or is that just new grads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator True Anomaly Posted May 7, 2013 Moderator Share Posted May 7, 2013 I'm so jealous!! I'm on month four of practicing in what might possibly now be the last state that requires a year of work before giving prescriptive authority. And I have to admit, in a pinch, I've had my colleague (an NP) sign a scrip for me. Usually I'm ERXing everything under my SPs name. Still, a HUGE pain in the butt. If I didn't love New Orleans so much, I'd certainly move. But our city JUST got a PA program (I went to PA school out of state); I think change is in the air down here. But they do say that everyone will wissh they were in Louisiana when the apocalypse happens 'cause we are 20 years behind the rest of the country. Is this true of ANY PA who comes to practice in Louisiana...that you need a year of practicing in that state before you are able to write your own Rx's, or is that just new grads? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.