Are Physicians Our Friends?

[SinkingShip]

On 4/16/2018 at 11:22 AM, pafrankc said:

I am one of those old timers mentioned frequently in this thread.  I've been in practice for 36 years and am retiring from clinical practice this summer.  While I do not consider physicians (read that as physician groups) as our friend, they must be recognized for what they really are to the PA profession--part of a symbiotic relationship.  We can't survive without them, they can't survive without us. 

We can't survive without them.  After 50+ years as a profession, we are not going away.  BUT: They control the medical boards, they control state medical societies, and they have more control over legislators than we do.  We have neither the numbers, nor the political clout to move toward "independence."  Consider Tennessee and West Virginia.  Both states put forth legislation and got it into committees with calls for more "independence."  The WV legislation was cosponsored by the committee chair (a physician), a lawyer, a nurse, and a lawyer!.  It was on the agenda for a meeting, and was pulled from the agenda at the last minute.  The TN legislation actually called for a new profession (Doctor of Medical Science) with significant independence, and the writers actually used "comparable to MD/DO" in the wording.  In both cases, the physicians gathered together, used their communication network, and put enough pressure on the legislators to keep the bill from moving forward.  That will happen again and again, even with millennials trying to make the changes.  It has nothing to do with being a dinosaur as a PA, it has to do with medical politics.

They can't survive without us?  Perhaps, and perhaps not.  Again, age doesn't matter--it's the political reality, and in this case, a financial reality.  Like us, most physicians go into medicine wanting to make a difference and practice altruistic medicine.  They soon realize that student loans and current income level take precedence over the altruism.  They now want to maximize income, and the two best ways to do that are to hire a PA, or hire a NP.  They hire us because of what we bring to the bottom line.  Despite their massive amounts of education and training, they refuse to be educated on what we bring to the table medically.  How many physicians know about our training?  Even those that serve on medical boards do not know our training or education.  They do not know that our clinical rotations are as close to the MD/DO internship as possible, without being an intern.  Because they lack that knowledge, they automatically compare us to another profession with a similar job description. 

             

 

Actually, the politics can be won. THe problem is that nobody here has the courage to fight. I posted about a guy who was a government appointment executive and a PA (Denni Woodmansee). I described how he effectively ended the future of 1600 PAs by advocating AGAINST independent practice when NPs were given total independent practice. PAs lost. NPs won. It happened because Woodmansee worked at the NCCPA as the chairman of the board. NCCPA position is that PA should NOT be independent. Remember the NCCPA president made a video stating PAs should not be independent. NCCPA policy is that its board members cannot advocate for independence. So, there you have Woodmansee, CHairman of the NCCPA , with his hands tied because they won't let him advocate for independent practice and at the same time working at VA as top PA executive in charge of advising the Secretary (Shulkin). Woodmansee tells Shulkin "Sir, these PAs should never be independent" and the fate of PAs is forever sealed. However, one PA at the VA wrote to Shulkin and explained the situation and conflict of interest. 90 days after the letter hit Dr Shulkins desk, Denni Woodmansee was out of a job. that is what politics are about people. IF you won't fight hard, you won't win. It isn't about joining the AAPA and donating money to them.  You need to get blood on your knuckles.

[sas5814]

It's funny because this is a variation of a conversation I have had many times with lots of people. This isn't unique to use but we have a very small percentage of PAs who are even aware of the major forces in play that affect their professional careers and an even smaller percentage doing the work.

I have been railing about this for years and we still lack the chops. The nurses are running circles around us while our elder statesmen continue to talk about our precious and valuable relationships with physicians. There was a time when it was true...it isn't any more.

Yes we need to have a relationship with physician groups. It should not be a hat-in-hand-please-sir relationship. It should based on the fact that we are a mature profession and deserving of respect. relationships can be parental, friendly, abusive, or many other things. We need to have a relationship with physician groups but it should be on our terms.

[Hope2PA]

7 hours ago, SinkingShip said:

Actually, the politics can be won. THe problem is that nobody here has the courage to fight. I posted about a guy who was a government appointment executive and a PA (Denni Woodmansee). I described how he effectively ended the future of 1600 PAs by advocating AGAINST independent practice when NPs were given total independent practice. PAs lost. NPs won. It happened because Woodmansee worked at the NCCPA as the chairman of the board. NCCPA position is that PA should NOT be independent. Remember the NCCPA president made a video stating PAs should not be independent. NCCPA policy is that its board members cannot advocate for independence. So, there you have Woodmansee, CHairman of the NCCPA , with his hands tied because they won't let him advocate for independent practice and at the same time working at VA as top PA executive in charge of advising the Secretary (Shulkin). Woodmansee tells Shulkin "Sir, these PAs should never be independent" and the fate of PAs is forever sealed. However, one PA at the VA wrote to Shulkin and explained the situation and conflict of interest. 90 days after the letter hit Dr Shulkins desk, Denni Woodmansee was out of a job. that is what politics are about people. IF you won't fight hard, you won't win. It isn't about joining the AAPA and donating money to them.  You need to get blood on your knuckles.

Fate Forever sealed.... Who took Woodmansee's position? Shulkin's now under investigation for some bad decisions. If someone was inclined to write a letter, to whom should it be addressed? 

[sadiebee]

Everyone's out for themselves. Whether they're nurses, MAs, or physicians. It doesn't matter. I've also learned very quickly that people will turn their head to injustices in the work place. You can rely on yourself.

[MidwesternTexan]

It's ironic that the NP profession- lesser trained, less hours for the degree, and Natl. Boards?  One and done.

Yet in many states THEY have privileges that surpass the PA's?

Sucks to be a PA when you think about that.  And I love being a PA, and everything I've done as one, etc.