Advice needed : BSN or Clinical Laboratory Science BS for PA

[mcmctalk]

I've searched and read through many discussion about BSN as stepping stone to PA. Unfortunately I'm still rather split on which major to pursue for my undergrad.

 

 

Quick info about me. I'm in my early 30s. I worked in the tech startup world for the last 8 years. Finally decided after many false starts to pursue PA full time. I unfortunately never got my college degree. I got certified as EMT-B thinking I can start building up HCE while working on pre-req and BS in Biology or Chem. Unfortunately in my area there is only one EMT company and there's a hire freeze. The market is also flooded with out of work experienced EMTs. I volunteer when I can but even volunteer as EMT has significant competitions, which makes fulfilling the 2000 hour HCE in my area impossible.

 

 

I've just about finished transfer requirement and have to decide what major to pursue. I originally thought BSN would be a good avenue to gain some HCE, plus the hands on patient care is intriguing to me. In my shadowing with nurses, they often speak of the overly flooded nursing market. When I mentioned this concern to my advisor, he recommended me to look into Medical Technologist since the entrance is less competitive and job availability will likely be better.

 

 

So my question is. Is Med Tech a good HCE? My local PA school considers it a HCE but doesn't say if it is placed higher or lower than EMT or nursing of other direct patient experience.

 

 

Or is my time better invested in a BSN. The admissions is crazy here but I'm willing to fight it out if it opens up door to PA school later.

 

 

I guess my fear is going to med tech route though easier now may pidgin hole me where I have to go get a rn or other specialty degree just to gain experience. Especially if PA school don't really look at MT as legitimate healthcare experience.

 

 

I also want to thank PAMAC for his inout on this topic in the past. It's really helped me reading through the responses.

 

 

Thanks

 

 

Mc

[EMEDPA]

bsn>>>>>>>med tech for pa school admissions.

some programs don't even interview lab folks as they don't consider it direct hce.

[mcmctalk]

Emedoa - thanks, that's the general impression I got as well. Would you think volunteer EMT + MT could make a strong candidate for PA school?

 

kind of sounds like I should just try to duke it out for BSN.

 

thanks again.

 

mc

[EMEDPA]

emt-basic is done by many folks and would be fine.

"top" level experience is generally considered to be rn, rt, or paramedic.

[Patho]

While it seems that direct patient care is a highly regarded by the majority of schools and PA in generally, I've been looking at this from a different angle. I've been working in the lab for 4 years now as a MLS (MT is the old name) and now have a desire to further my education and have more contact with patients, so PA is a good choice for me. With my lack of patient contact HCE, I've been shadowing quite a bit, an MD who specializes in Heme/Onc, two FNP, and a MD doing family medicine. Although I still have to complete a lot of hours, from what I've seen, providers usually spend more time going over labs and ordering additional labs then examining patients. The providers I've been shadowing typically spend 10-15 minutes with patients, unless it's something complicated, and the rest on ordering and looking at results. This is all outpatient btw, so it might be different for inpatient and in ER setting.

 

I might be a little bias here since I'm from the lab, but in practicality, close to 80% (if not more) of all diagnosis come results obtained through lab work. So if you understand lab tests, which ones to order, and how to interpret results, you are pretty solid. So I think MT would be a great way for you to learn about medicine. With that said however, it is important that you supplement that with actual patient contact also, there is no substitute for it. You have to be completely comfortable doing exams and talking to patients or else it will not work out.

 

If you go the MT route, you will satisfy most if not all your pre recs, in addition, you will take some high level health science classes such as hematology/coag, medical immunology, medical micro, parasitology/mycology, medical biochem, etc.

[mcmctalk]

Thanks bcao1, such great perspective from inside, it's exactly the information I'm looking for.

 

The direct route to satisfying pre-req was the reason my advisor advised MLS to me as well. I also agree with you that understanding lab is the foundation of much of modern day medicine. It's a shame many PA school don't consider it a valid HCE.

 

The area I'm in, Oregon. The schools happen to be extremely competitive, with OHSU being the primary PA school requiring 2000 hr HCE. Even the second tier school here requires 1000 hr HCE and UW is the next closest school which wants 4000 HCE. I'm finding myself needing to taylor my undergrad degree to the HCE.

 

How far are you in the application process, has your background in MLS hindered your application strength?

[EMEDPA]

I might be a little bias here since I'm from the lab, but in practicality, close to 80% (if not more) of all diagnosis come results obtained through lab work..

actually labs confirm your diagnosis previously suspected on history and physical exam....you see a pt, they have a sx and findings. you create a list of possible dx which lab/xray/ct help confirm....the hx and physical exam are far more important than the lab work....sorry...

[mbalaban]

It seems like your question is "what is the minimum I need to do to get by" as opposed to a statement such as "I have a strong desire to be in medicine and TREAT patients". As an applicant, I keep hearing about "dedication to medicine" and "do you really want to be a PA". I struggle to understand and see how the mentality of "what do I need to do to get the minimum" shows or confirms these. My personal opinion, if you want to get a good feel of what a PA is like, become a paramedic. Treat patients, while working under autonomous yet physician supervision. It teaches to you think, to work out a working diagnosis and, to me, most importantly, how to communicate with patients and family. Just my $0.02 (though some may think I should get change back. lol)

[EMEDPA]

yup, medic is great experience and military medics/corpsmen were the original PAs for just that reason....

[mcmctalk]

I appreciate the comment mbalaban, I agree that paramedic is perhaps the best route to PA, and dedication to medicine should be the heart of the matter. If I could work full time as paramedic for a few years, I would. I do however need to feed myself, pay rent, etc.

 

The opportunity to practice as paramedic and EMT in general is difficult in my market (I'm a EMT-B and working on EMT-I and have been looking for work for a year). Also I need to get my BS done anyway, so I'm trying to pick a healthcare career with an eye on a future ambition of becoming a PA. Maybe I am a slacker that comes off as just trying to do the minimum. But isn't it a bit of a surface view to say someone is not trying hard enough when I'm outlining 7 years of my life to school (BS plus PA), along with spending all my extra personal time volunteering as EMT and shadowing PAs and NPs?

 

Maybe I need to look at military so I can be a practicing medic for a few years. It's honestly not something I seriously thought about before...

[EMEDPA]

medic, rn, or rt are all fine.

I would have no problem with someone who got their bsn, worked a bit, then applied. you would have more experience than a majority of the current applicant pool.

[MikeyRay]

Hey! Lab tech here (MLS, ASCP) and there are FAR better option to prepare you for PA. My five years of lab work doesn't count for much as I've noticed during my research into various programs. This is why I am transitioning into a MA role at a local clinic and quitting my FT lab job while I finish up a few prereqs. It's time to get the patient contact experience necessary, and unfortunately that means 1/2 my salary! LOTS of good advice here. Also, your friend was right there are lots of lab jobs. You could literally blindfold yourself, point to a spot on a map, call the local hospitals and find a handful of jobs to apply for. bca01 is correct that the MT curriculum covers a great deal of medical information, but the reality of it is that we don't use much of it in our day to day work. I might be able to recognize a heme disorder, and confirm it by looking up the diagnosis, but that isn't why I'm getting paid. Also, a BSN might help you get into PA school, but it would definitely open up the door to NP school after some experience. You have a lot of options! Good luck!

[dannydude57]

Having a BSN never stopped me from learning about lab tests or interpreting the results. On top of that, I am able to get the patient's story, quickly examine the patient, learn what the patient was presenting with and learn why the test was ordered in the first place. But..... the RN market is really saturated. I always suggest people to look into being a Respiratory Therapist. You'll get a lot of patient exposure that way. Is that something you might consider?

[mcmctalk]

dannydude57, thanks for the advice. You know, I never actually thought about RT as a possibility, main reason being that I've only seen RT in ICU during my shadow. From what I could tell, much of the skills seems to be able to be replicated by a trained RN. I am intrigued though, will have to do some research into the field and maybe get a few days of shadow if I can find someone.

 

Thanks!

[cnguyenle]

I'm also a MLS (ASCP). I think it depends on the school if it counts as HCE. The only bad thing about MLS is that you dont have direct patient contact which RN has. But look at it this way, Either way RN or MLS is a good career to fall back incase you dont get in. You can still use this time to build up your resume and reapply. The only difference is pay and market saturation.

[Patho]

I volunteer at a small clinic where the lab techs draws blood, which can be consider direct patient contact. In larger setting this will not be the case since they have their own team, but the MLS program will allow you to do the same work a phlebotomist does. During my MT training, I also did EKG in the phlebotomy outpatient center at a local hospital.

[Hallcrest]

The missing factor in doing EKG's, directly drawing lab, and working in a lab are that none of them require an actual exam of the patient. They are tasks - and crucial ones at that, don't get me wrong. But the reason why RN, RT, paramedic-type experience is preferred is because these providers are assessing their patients and making judgments on which particular intervention is needed, as opposed to mastering the skill in an of itself at the delegation of another who performed the exam. I'm and RN, and I sometimes think that RT would have been a great route to take because the RT's I work with in the CVICU have ample time during their day to spend. They can study, or read, or socialize, or even spend time on the phone as part of their 'other job - real estate'. I don't have that...and as I look forward to PA school, I find myself a little envious of them. It sure would be nice to pick up weekend shifts that would allow me to study for a few hours during a 12-hour shift.

[badger12]

I went the CLS route in college and am now a Medical Technologist (MLS-ASCP) at a small clinic. I give vaccinations, draw blood, do EKG's, collect samples, and process samples within the lab. I agree with Hallcrest though, everything you do is delegated to you by the doctor. It is also VERY difficult to find a position as a medical technologist where you have the opportunity to work directly with patients, and it comes at a cost- I get paid quite a bit less than I would at a larger hospital. Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love my job, but as an RN or RT you're guaranteed to work with patients and probably at a better salary.

[mcmctalk]

Thanks for the advice, it's been really helpful to get so many inside perspective from different medical fields. I think that's the beauty of the PA profession -- being able to draw experience from all healthcare professions. I think I have narrowed my decision down to RN or RT. My area has both schools. I'm scheduling with a RT to shadow but they're a bit harder to network than RNs.

 

For those of you in the field, did you find it difficult to find a job as a RT? In reading more about the profession, I"m fascinated by the variety of patients you get to treat on a daily basis. I feel that this might give you a clinical edge over RN in that it's more general vs. nursing these days tend to be quite specialized (ICU, ER, OR, etc).