DERM interview tomorrow. Soon to be New grad. Questions

[TPA16]

Graduating Jan 1st, 

Currently on my derm rotation so ive picked up basics but obviously have a lot more to learn.

I have read the warning threads so im feeling skeptical going in tomorrow because..

1) I have heard from my current derm preceptor that she knows this job to have a relatively known PA turn over rate 

2) the secretary for the doc I spoke with on phone says that there is a training period where I will be "scribe/follow" 

3) the commute is an hour away

I have heard that it is hard to get your foot in door with derm so I am going just incase...

but I don't have a great feeling about things already.

-------------------------------------------

Questions to all:

What is the minimum training salary you would accept for a derm office?

Should I ask what the salary post training is? or is that pretentious 

also, Is it pretentious to ask for a training contract in writing that states "after x amount of months, I will be making this much"

 

Thanks a lot, and of course I will keep posted with the offer

 

[anewconvert]

No, asking what you will be paid is not pretentious, nor is asking that it be put in writing. If they won’t tell you the rate or put it in writing that is your sign to run away. 

[TPA16]

33 minutes ago, anewconvert said:

No, asking what you will be paid is not pretentious, nor is asking that it be put in writing. If they won’t tell you the rate or put it in writing that is your sign to run away. 

got it, thanks

[south]

1 hour ago, anewconvert said:

No, asking what you will be paid is not pretentious, nor is asking that it be put in writing. If they won’t tell you the rate or put it in writing that is your sign to run away. 

I agree with this in the strongest way.  Lots of red flags here, but I get it.  Go anyway, give it your 100% best shot, the worst that can happen is that one of you says no, and you get another interview under your belt.  

[DontBeTachy]

I'm curious what others may say, too, especially about the training salary. One PA told me her training salary was15% less than full-time pay. 

I definitely understand where you're coming from too in the aspect of wanting to get into dermatology... to me, it's worth it to accept a lower pay since I will be learning/observing for a longer period of time then say my peers practicing in family medicine (where they could comfortably diagnose easy cases as soon as they start working or at least see well-visits and contribute greatly to their practice...) me on the other hand, I might not be contributing as an independent provider for a longer period of time in a specialty like derm. Our derm training at my PA school was extremely minimal, and it's not a specialty like cardiology/pulmonology/GI where we would've spent more time in the basics of those specialties. I think any type of general practice (gen surg, FM, Peds, Internal Med, EM) is the type of place where a training salary for a PA is unacceptable... something like derm, though, I'm feeling more lenient about. Plus it's such a competitive field to get into, not just for PAs. 

[camoman1234]

11 hours ago, DontBeTachy said:

I'm curious what others may say, too, especially about the training salary. One PA told me her training salary was15% less than full-time pay. 

I definitely understand where you're coming from too in the aspect of wanting to get into dermatology... to me, it's worth it to accept a lower pay since I will be learning/observing for a longer period of time then say my peers practicing in family medicine (where they could comfortably diagnose easy cases as soon as they start working or at least see well-visits and contribute greatly to their practice...) me on the other hand, I might not be contributing as an independent provider for a longer period of time in a specialty like derm. Our derm training at my PA school was extremely minimal, and it's not a specialty like cardiology/pulmonology/GI where we would've spent more time in the basics of those specialties. I think any type of general practice (gen surg, FM, Peds, Internal Med, EM) is the type of place where a training salary for a PA is unacceptable... something like derm, though, I'm feeling more lenient about. Plus it's such a competitive field to get into, not just for PAs. 

I think any type of general practice (gen surg, FM, Peds, Internal Med, EM) is the type of place where a training salary for a PA is unacceptable... something like derm, though, I'm feeling more lenient about. Plus it's such a competitive field to get into, not just for PAs.

Your comments above do not make much sense to me. Just because you want to get into derm. does not mean you should take a lower salary. This is what they want PAs/NPs to think. They are trying to make this the norm, but it should not be. How about the PA that goes into urology and first assist the doc, since this is a hard specialty to get into and you have to learn all the OR stuff/procedures, 1st assist, etc doesn't mean I should be paid less, this is part of the job. The only reason derm. pays less is because they are not making a lot of money off you at first and a lot of derm is based off of RVUs which means they care more about money than your training. If your RVUs are low while training (which is excepted) this should not supersede great training, but sounds like derm is more about get them in and out with LOTS of procedures to make the $$$. I would never settle for less and would never take a training salary, if everyone would stick together and say NO this is not acceptable then magically those training salaries would go away. To each their own, but every time you settle less for something it hurts ALL PAs/NPs.   

[DontBeTachy]

7 hours ago, camoman1234 said:

I think any type of general practice (gen surg, FM, Peds, Internal Med, EM) is the type of place where a training salary for a PA is unacceptable... something like derm, though, I'm feeling more lenient about. Plus it's such a competitive field to get into, not just for PAs.

Your comments above do not make much sense to me. Just because you want to get into derm. does not mean you should take a lower salary. This is what they want PAs/NPs to think. They are trying to make this the norm, but it should not be. How about the PA that goes into urology and first assist the doc, since this is a hard specialty to get into and you have to learn all the OR stuff/procedures, 1st assist, etc doesn't mean I should be paid less, this is part of the job. The only reason derm. pays less is because they are not making a lot of money off you at first and a lot of derm is based off of RVUs which means they care more about money than your training. If your RVUs are low while training (which is excepted) this should not supersede great training, but sounds like derm is more about get them in and out with LOTS of procedures to make the $$$. I would never settle for less and would never take a training salary, if everyone would stick together and say NO this is not acceptable then magically those training salaries would go away. To each their own, but every time you settle less for something it hurts ALL PAs/NPs.   

8

 

@camoman1234 I understand what you are saying and I see your point.

However, your statement "just because you want to get into derm doesn't mean you should take a training salary" is not at all what I was trying to say.  I know that I could also get a job in plastic surgery, neurosurgery, and surgical oncology eevn as a new graduate. I also know that I would not take a training salary for those positions, even if I want them. This is because I know these jobs are easier for me to get. Again, What I mean is that Dermatology is a specialty that's harder to get into, especially as a new graduate unless you've had past experience in derm such as an RN or MA. I hope I'm making a little more sense to you. Dermatology is a higher coveted specialty than urology. I have turned down two urology jobs, one a verbal offer, the other was an interview where they invited me back for a second interview but I declined. 

[camoman1234]

12 hours ago, DontBeTachy said:

 

@camoman1234 I understand what you are saying and I see your point.

However, your statement "just because you want to get into derm doesn't mean you should take a training salary" is not at all what I was trying to say.  I know that I could also get a job in plastic surgery, neurosurgery, and surgical oncology eevn as a new graduate. I also know that I would not take a training salary for those positions, even if I want them. This is because I know these jobs are easier for me to get. Again, What I mean is that Dermatology is a specialty that's harder to get into, especially as a new graduate unless you've had past experience in derm such as an RN or MA. I hope I'm making a little more sense to you. Dermatology is a higher coveted specialty than urology. I have turned down two urology jobs, one a verbal offer, the other was an interview where they invited me back for a second interview but I declined. 

I got your comments the first time and understand what "you think is the correct answer" but taking a training salary only hurts you plus others that come after you. Why settle for less? WE are better than a training salary and do not need to pick and choose which specialty will pay us a training salary and which one will pay us fair salary from day one. Does not make sense that your trying to justify that derm. is some special part of medicine that only a select few get into....that could be said about lots of positions in medicine and to each their own, but don't settle for what the bean counters think your worth. If you don't get this job there will be PLENTY in your career. You will never have the "perfect" in medicine so don't lie to yourself. Good luck.