Want to join military but have DUI

[THE.PA.PAC]

I also have a thread going in General Discussion regarding the difficulties obtaining state licensure, but how will this affect my ability to join the military?

 

(In case you haven't seen the other thread: I was convicted of DUI about four years ago, and I have since met all the terms of my sentence with regards to fines and probation.)

 

I am interested in the Air Force, Navy and Army (in that order). I know the Air Force will probably be the most difficult (from what I've been researching they are downsizing and qualified applicants are numerous). I have immediate family in the Navy and that is the route I would definitely consider if the Air Force is a no-go. As far as the Army is concerned, that would be my last option -- no disrespect to Army PAs intended.

 

Deployment is not an issue, I just want to start ASAP. With that being said, how long does it take from meeting with recruiters, obtaining a waiver, and starting OTS/OCS? If sign-on bonuses are involved, when are they given out (and is it paid as a lump sum, over the course of the first year or over the length of enlistment, and how much are the bonuses for each respective branch)?

 

As far as etiquette is concerned, I will be meeting with Air Force and Navy recruiters next week, so do I let the recruiters know I am considering other branches or will this look bad with regards to commitment? Also, what rank do you assume after OTS/OCS if you have no prior military service? Do I ask for their help in obtaining a waiver for my DUI conviction at this first meeting? If they know about my meetings with other branches, can I still ask their help in obtaining a waiver (or is the waiver only fought for after you've made a verbal commitment to join one particular branch)?

 

A lot of information I have found requires only NCCPA certification, but I have not found out whether or not you need a state license. I am eager to serve, and I just hope I get the opportunity to do so.

 

Finally, what did you ask your recruiters?

 

Thanks for your replies.

[pH_7.40]

Maybe things are different now, but five years ago when I joined the Navy they wouldn't even look at you if you had a DUI or any drug convictions. Not to mention that anybody that gets a DUI while in is almost guaranteed a trip out the door, at least on the medical side of house.

[Maverick87]

Maybe things are different now, but five years ago when I joined the Navy they wouldn't even look at you if you had a DUI or any drug convictions. Not to mention that anybody that gets a DUI while in is almost guaranteed a trip out the door, at least on the medical side of house.

 

This is very true. It's actually even worse now. I think you would get in more trouble for getting a DUI than you would for killing someone (I'm exaggerating, but it's not terribly far off). If you get a DUI while you're in, you WILL go into confinement (jail) for at least a year. Then you'll be stripped of your rank and dishonorably discharged.

 

My base actually gives us ("us" meaning the entire base) a day off if nobody gets a DUI for 100 days straight.

 

With that said, OP, I've never met anyone that tried to get in with a DUI. So you might as well talk to your recruiter and see what your options are. You never know.

 

Good luck! :)

[HMtoPA]

If you get a DUI while you're in, you WILL go into confinement (jail) for at least a year. Then you'll be stripped of your rank and dishonorably discharged.

 

 

This is not even remotely true. Confinement for a year?!? And Dishonorable discharge? NJP w/ 30-45 days restriction (not actual confinement) and reduction in rank, yes, but this other nonsense, no. Where are they doing this?

[Just Steve]

I googled the question "can i join the military if I have a DUI" because I am curious of the answer. Of course with this being the internet and everyone is an expert, things require a bit of sifting to decipher what the answer may be. Apparently, it takes a waiver. So with that, it depends on what you have to offer the military and what the needs of the military are at the time you apply for the waiver. There is no punishment for applying for a waiver so if you're heart is set on it, go talk to them.

[pH_7.40]

This is not even remotely true. Confinement for a year?!? And Dishonorable discharge? NJP w/ 30-45 days restriction (not actual confinement) and reduction in rank, yes, but this other nonsense, no. Where are they doing this?

 

The year confinement is BS. At our command its a 96 hour lib for 96 days though we rarely go past two weeks. The offenders usually get the 45/45 and reduction in rate and the boot out the door. Most people I know who have gotten one end up with a general discharge. On a few cases it ends up other than honorable (guy blew a .16 with his toddler in the car). Either way like others have said it doesn't hurt to ask the recruiter. I know friends who joined the Army instead because they were a little more friendly towards wavers.

[d2305]

ARS used to be a ticket punch to make MCPO, but times have changed.

[kwjxn]

DUI is waiverable, but the military can afford to be picky right now, so maybe not so good of chance for Navy or AF, but a decent chance at Army reserve or National Guard. Once you get in there

try to go active.

[doubledown10]

When I joined the Army in 1992, There was a time when I thought they gave out badges or ribbons for a DUI because everybody was getting them and there were no real consequences. But as the civilian sector cracked down, the Army and Armed Forces followed along. If you're an officer and get a DUI now, it's the end of your military career. There are three things that you can no longer do in the Army or Armed forces and no have it terminate your career immediately. Write bad checks, beat your wife, and drink and drive. There are others, but those typically ger people crushed. The Air Force won't even look at you. They disqualify people for having hereditary hypercholesterolemia, which caries no fines. With the downsize, you need them, not the other way around

[CCEMPA]

I'm curious as to the outcome of your meeting with the recruiters, please follow up with the results

[Maverick87]

This is not even remotely true. Confinement for a year?!? And Dishonorable discharge? NJP w/ 30-45 days restriction (not actual confinement) and reduction in rank, yes, but this other nonsense, no. Where are they doing this?

 

I'm in the Air Force. Yes, it is true. At my base, we have a jail very nearby, where people come in for confinement physicals. Many of them have had DUIs.

 

Sorry, but this is what's happening. The military (well, at least the AF) is cracking down on DUIs.

 

As I said, I don't know about the waiver situation. So I still think OP should talk to their recruiter about potential options.

[sartort]

I haven't been in the army since 2010, but I knew a lot of people who got DUIs while they were in and received either no or very minor consequences. Demotions happened to lower enlisted along with extra duty/decreased pay/restriction but that was all from what I saw. The people who got kicked out did other things. I knew a couple of E-6's who didn't get extra duty or anything at all. The off-post ones were treated much more lightly than the on-post ones though because there were civilian consequences, and I don't know of anyone who had a DUI when they entered service. I agree that your recruiter should give you the options. Just be honest about it during the process and if it's a no-go then you'll find something else to do.

[FEtoPA]

I'm in the Air Force. Yes, it is true. At my base, we have a jail very nearby, where people come in for confinement physicals. Many of them have had DUIs.

 

Sorry, but this is what's happening. The military (well, at least the AF) is cracking down on DUIs.

 

As I said, I don't know about the waiver situation. So I still think OP should talk to their recruiter about potential options.

 

Are you sure you are not confusing the confinement for one year with losing base driving privileges for 1 year?

 

Not trying to start a flame war, but I agree with HMtoPA. I have been in the Air Force for 18 years, held positions such as squadron superintendent, additional duty first sergeant and flight chief. Although I am only a lowly IPAP student now, I have, in the past, been involved with many Article 15 actions for DUI and other various alcohol infractions. The closest thing to confinement for a strait DUI I have ever seen was 45 days restriction to base. That was only because the individual decided to take it to Summary Court Martial rather than accept the Article 15. The only ones I have ever seen that result in confinement, had other aggravating factors such as hard drug use, domestic violence etc.

 

Here's an example that I would call typical for an officer: about a year before I left for IPAP my squadron had a Lt Col pilot get nailed on base. He was served his Article 15 by the 2-star, lost half his base pay for 3 months with the associated LOR and UIF. He also lost on-base driving privileges for a year.

 

Now, to answer the OP's question. You may get lucky, the Air Force is short on PAs and it is pretty much up to the corps chief if they want to take you. Realistically, I put your chances at somewhere around 1-2%. Probably not what you wanted to hear, but as my old boss used to tell me "play stupid games, win stupid prizes."

 

Good Luck!

[Maverick87]

Are you sure you are not confusing the confinement for one year with losing base driving privileges for 1 year?

 

Not trying to start a flame war, but I agree with HMtoPA. I have been in the Air Force for 18 years, held positions such as squadron superintendent, additional duty first sergeant and flight chief. Although I am only a lowly IPAP student now, I have, in the past, been involved with many Article 15 actions for DUI and other various alcohol infractions. The closest thing to confinement for a strait DUI I have ever seen was 45 days restriction to base. That was only because the individual decided to take it to Summary Court Martial rather than accept the Article 15. The only ones I have ever seen that result in confinement, had other aggravating factors such as hard drug use, domestic violence etc.

 

Here's an example that I would call typical for an officer: about a year before I left for IPAP my squadron had a Lt Col pilot get nailed on base. He was served his Article 15 by the 2-star, lost half his base pay for 3 months with the associated LOR and UIF. He also lost on-base driving privileges for a year.

 

Now, to answer the OP's question. You may get lucky, the Air Force is short on PAs and it is pretty much up to the corps chief if they want to take you. Realistically, I put your chances at somewhere around 1-2%. Probably not what you wanted to hear, but as my old boss used to tell me "play stupid games, win stupid prizes."

 

Good Luck!

 

I've had patients come in to have a physical to go into confinement. I was told that they were there because of a DUI. I don't know if the patient did anything else or if it was solely the DUI that put them there (it's not really my place to ask). My commanding officer seemed to think that this was a sufficient reason for them being there. Again, I'm only going based on my observations in my limited military career.

[FEtoPA]

I've had patients come in to have a physical to go into confinement. I was told that they were there because of a DUI. I don't know if the patient did anything else or if it was solely the DUI that put them there (it's not really my place to ask). My commanding officer seemed to think that this was a sufficient reason for them being there. Again, I'm only going based on my observations in my limited military career.

 

If the threat of jail time makes someone in your squadron think twice before they get behind the wheel after drinking, then your commander is doing it right.

[Will352ns]

Wow, like FE to PA I have been in AF for a while (20 years). I have done the First Sgt gig and been involved in many administrative actions (which most DUI's would fall under). Typically an E, if they aren't a dirtbag to begin with, will get a reduction in rank which may or may not end them depending on HYT. There will usually be a financial or extra duty punishment tagged on. For an O, usually an LOR which ends pretty much ends their career.

 

Another thing to consider, the punishments will also depend on where the DUI happened. On base, the CC can run the gamit. Off base, not so much; double jepardy applies...yes, even for the military.

 

To the OP, just see if the recruiter is willing to put in a waiver for it.

[roger777]

YOu might be able to join the National Guard as a medic. Even if it was not as an officer you could always commision later. The NG and the regular army have different morals standards. I am a medical NCO in NYNG and joined in 2011 with a 20 year old possession offense on my record and fully disclosed it. The military uses age limits and morals standards as the two main tools to control recruitment levels. At that time it was already tight and you could not join the reg. army with a misdemeanor conviction but you could join the guard (there are felons in the army now who joined when Iraq was hot in 2006. It was like the foreign legion then!). The training is the same for active and NG the first 6 mos. and you would at least have "3 hots and a cot" and pay off some bills. You could always commission later and it might burnish your case with your licensing board to be serving. You would have to check state by state by calling recruiters. The age limit has been lowered for both but I'm pretty sure one DWI is OK in NG if not the army as well.

[OrthoSurgeryPA]

IMHO as a prior MEPS MO:

 

You should be able to go through MEPS. Then you will have to answer the why questions and the MEPS medical officer will have to determine if a waiver is in the best interest of the Armed Forces. Not automatic that a waiver will be granted or even considered regardless of need. And yes, they are being more selective. I would say that the AF is a long shot, at least active duty.

 

This would fall under DoDI 6130.03.29.s as alcohol abuse. Then each service has their own policies as well. It is seen as a character issue primarily to the Army. They have "moral waivers".

 

See: www.dtic.mil/whs/directives/corres/pdf/613003p.pdf

 

 

 

[roger777]

I concur. When I went thru MEPS at Ft. Hamilton in late 2011, the air force area was completely deserted. Even then they were taking very few people. Basically any morals issue and you were a no go in AF. NYC is not a big AF recruiting hotspot anyways, tho. I flirted with the idea of going active first but they told me it was a no-go (the official policy then was no morals waivers at all). Just as well. We had a great mission on KAF and got to do tons of PC with several PAs and a generous scope of practice. Great experience. With active first I probably would have spent deployment in a motorpool:) That was just luck tho. That was right when things were getting tight and I just got in under the wire with my age and the issue. 97 ASVAB might have helped.

 

To the OP:P It definitely isn't any less selective now so you will need to ask directly. But hey there are 50 states. This obviously not your preferred route but you definitely won't be able to go officer right away but it would allow you to work towards a personal goal and stabilize your financial situation while things sort out, which I'm sure they will. Your time in service will begin as soon as you enlist which will eventually help you make the next rank sooner when you do commission which you would be able to do eventually.

[Maverick87]

 

This is not even remotely true. Confinement for a year?!? And Dishonorable discharge? NJP w/ 30-45 days restriction (not actual confinement) and reduction in rank, yes, but this other nonsense, no. Where are they doing this?

Just ran into this thread again.

 

It is about a year later and I have much more experience now with confinement patients. Yes, you definitely can get confinement (though it won't be a year) AND a dishonorable discharge. Not all do, of course. It seems to be situational, to a degree.

 

I've had plenty of patients that had 1 DUI and received a courts martial. If you receive a courts martial, there's a good possibility that it will end in either a bad conduct or dishonorable discharge (that's from sitting in on courts martials whenever I had time at my base....because that stuff really interests me).

 

Also, I'm Air Force. I believe we come down on the hardest on our members for things like this.

[cm7sus4]

 

This is not even remotely true. Confinement for a year?!? And Dishonorable discharge? NJP w/ 30-45 days restriction (not actual confinement) and reduction in rank, yes, but this other nonsense, no. Where are they doing this?

 

You are correct.  Never heard of confinement on a single DUI charge - did see it happen to a Marine who plowed over a surgeon at a crosswalk in town, while driving under the influence.

[DreamingPA]

 I never heard of  a Soldier being confined for DUI either. But then again, if he/she is really screwed up and his command hates him/her, they can really mess him up. It sucks but that is how things are sometimes. Too many political BS in the military sometimes

 

However, I heard of one ortho resident in Tripler Medical Center that got booted out for DUI few years ago. Also, a former 1SG in my batallion was in the process of being reviewed for a possible chapter  after he received a DUI charge, even though he had  over 17 years in Service with 3 war-zone deployments. Needless to say he was fighiting his tooth and nail to stay in so that he can retire.

[Maverick87]

 I never heard of  a Soldier being confined for DUI either. But then again, if he/she is really screwed up and his command hates him/her, they can really mess him up. It sucks but that is how things are sometimes. Too many political BS in the military sometimes

 

However, I heard of one ortho resident in Tripler Medical Center that got booted out for DUI few years ago. Also, a former 1SG in my batallion was in the process of being reviewed for a possible chapter  after he received a DUI charge, even though he had  over 17 years in Service with 3 war-zone deployments. Needless to say he was fighiting his tooth and nail to stay in so that he can retire.

I've seen it a few times. I've also seen confinement and court martial for guys popping positive (granted, it was more serious than, say, weed).

 

The military is really cracking down on these kinds of things (especially these days with the draw down). There are also a lot of slugs that commanders are trying to get rid of. It really all depends on how much the commanders dislike someone and whether or not they are looking for someone to make an example out of.

 

For the guys that say "I was in for 20 years and I've never seen that", well, the military has changed a lot in the last few years (or so I've been told by fellow active duty guys that have 10+ years in). From what they tell me, the old military was far more lenient than the new military.