Please Read if you oppose a title change to Medical Care Practitioner

[sas5814]

Its a title I aspire to...

[sas5814]

On 11/26/2020 at 1:21 AM, JDB91 said:

I'm just a student, so apologies if I've stepped out of my lane. However, the more thought I give to MCP, it doesn't seem so bad. What comes to mind are other generic title acronyms like EMT: Emergency Medical Technician. That's a relatively generic name but implies the point "I am a technician that provides emergency medical care". No one second guesses what an EMT is anymore, even if 99% of EMTs do not actually provide emergency medical care.

Now, with MCP: "I am a practitioner, who provides xyz medical care"... Medical care is generic as generic gets, but if you lead up to the "medical care" part of the title WITH YOUR SPECIALTY, for example;  EM guys/gals - an Emergency Medical Care Practitioner.

Ortho folks; Orthopedic Medical Care Practitioner.  Urologic medical care practitioner.  Cardio-thoracic Medical Care Practitioner. Voluntarily drop the "care" for introductions, if you please, just to streamline the delivery; Emergency Medical Practitioner. Not so bad. Patients will be able to associate the role of "Practitioner" with the type of care provided.

I work with a lot of NPs and they don't say "Hey, I am John, the Advanced Registered Nurse Practitioner."  He is "John, the NP".  And I'll tell you what, the vast majority of my patients/family know what an NP is without hesitation, just due to exposure over the years. But a decade ago, when I would make an appt at my PCP and the clerk would say I'm booked for "Cindy the Nurse Practitioner at 4pm", I didn't know wtf a Nurse Practitioner was, but as a patient, I eventually figured it out: someone with a higher level of education who can prescribe me those Abx jawns, and that's all I cared about.

Some patients may be perturbed by hearing "assistant." However, toss out "assistant" for "practitioner" and I guarantee nobody will think twice about it. "Practitioner" is common tongue and associated with some "advanced medical care person".  To the lay person, "Assistant" has never and will never be associated with anything "advanced", regardless if you tell them 1000 times that PA's are advanced. Critical thinking is slim pickings. At the end of the day, most patients just want to be treated, and treated well. If you screw up, it doesn't matter what your title is... MD, RN, Plumber... they'll remember you and associate you with shit care until the day they die.

Be a GOOD MCP --> win patient trust --> make hospital admins happy --> everyone that matters is happy.

I think the name change should be dealt with swiftly and attention turned back to bigger fish like FPA and rebuilding that relationship with the VA. Also, maybe the AAPA and AMA can find common ground in combating the NP creep. MCPs and MDs can be a unified force, instead of belligerents in a three-sided war. We need  docs, and docs need us, but the idea that mid-levels can replace docs is dangerous. Forums like SDN and /r/residency can spread all the hate they want about NPs, but PAs (MCPs) should do all they can do avoid that negative attention. Some of you may think anecdotal rhetoric on internet forums/social media is nonsense and shouldn't be used as a metric to gauge the bigger picture... but this is the internet age, where platforms like reddit/twitter and forum boards influence millions upon millions of opinions, even swaying national elections. As a student, it disheartening to hear some of you consider jumping ship to NP. Honestly, that's not even a lateral transfer, its a downgrade. If you're so hell bent on being a completely independent clinician, go to med school.  NPs have a healthy head start, but that gap can be closed. While we argue over semantics of MCP, the NPs conquer entire states and with them thousands of jobs.

Time to move forward, quickly.

I don't know if I said this before but this is your future so it is very much your lane of traffic. My plan is to retire in 4 years, 10 months, 1 week and 4 days.... but who is counting?

You and your classmates have years and years to look at and that is hopefully what all the work everyone is doing will secure.

[EMEDPA]

On 3/6/2021 at 8:28 PM, PACali said:

EMEDPA, I remember this letter and I thought we had a good chance of changing it because the momentum was so strong. But here we are,  10 year anniversary of the 100 leaders letter and still talking about title change. It is pathetic. We have to change this time, doesn't matter if you support associate or MCP, assistant has to go! I don't want to be talking about this again! Because we will, if we don't change it this time. 

Ten years later and we did it. When I was in PA school 25 years ago we all thought we would be associates within a decade. Slower than expected or hoped for, but anything that isn't assistant is a win. 

[Cideous]

4 minutes ago, EMEDPA said:

Ten years later and we did it. When I was in PA school 25 years ago we all thought we would be associates within a decade. Slower than expected or hoped for, but anything that isn't assistant is a win. 

What did we do?  Become "associates"?  NOT listen to the consulting experts?  Not listen to our colleagues? AND MOST IMPORTANTLY NOT LISTEN TO PATIENTS IN THE CONSULTING SURVEY FINDINGS?  Did you guys even READ the findings???

 

I'm curious, just what exactly do you think we accomplished???

 

Here is what we did do....Spend 1 million dollars.  Piss all over the results while at the same time professing to hold up "data driven science".  Why?  Because PA's are and will always be self destructive. 

Tag this thread, come back in 10 years and see where these new grads are in the job market.  See how many states we are getting our asses kicked by Independent NP's and tell me that "Associate" was the way to go.  

[EMEDPA]

4 minutes ago, Cideous said:

What did we do?  Become "associates"?  NOT listen to the consulting experts?  Not listen to our colleagues? AND MOST IMPORTANTLY NOT LISTEN TO PATIENTS IN THE CONSULTING SURVEY FINDINGS?  Did you guys even READ the findings???

 

I'm curious, just what exactly do you think we accomplished???

 

Here is what we did do....Spend 1 million dollars.  Piss all over the results while at the same time professing to hold up "data driven science".  Why?  Because PA's are and will always be self destructive. 

Tag this thread, come back in 10 years and see where these new grads are in the job market.  See how many states we are getting our asses kicked by Independent NP's and tell me that "Associate" was the way to go.  

I agree that MCP would have been a better title, however anything is better than assistant. It's not ideal, but I still count this in the win column.  If we were going to do associate all along it is a shame that we had to waste 1 million dollars on a survey and then disregard its findings, but that is another issue. I probably have 20 years left in paid practice, not counting volunteer work, so I am happy to do those years as an associate and not an assistant. 

[CAAdmission]

1 hour ago, EMEDPA said:

I probably have 20 years left in paid practice, not counting volunteer work, so I am happy to do those years as an associate and not an assistant. 

Hopefully the market will afford you that opportunity. I'm not taking that as a given anymore.

[EMEDPA]

31 minutes ago, CAAdmission said:

Hopefully the market will afford you that opportunity. I'm not taking that as a given anymore.

As long as I am better than the FP docs and cheaper than the EM docs I will always have a job. If there are suddenly lots of EM docs willing to work for 1/2 what they currently make in very rural areas I might be in trouble. 

[ohiovolffemtp]

I think the folks that are going to be in trouble are:

• the new grads (who haven't done a residency) who don't have enough experience to be attractive enough to overcome the need for "supervision" vs the NP's.
• the mid-career PA's who get downsized from their current jobs (think of the past 18 months) and they're back competing in the open market.

Those of us who've found our niche are probably going to be OK - but we're far from representative.

I said this on the Huddle - only a single private response.  I think folks just don't understand how the world is different now.

[UGoLong]

No one knows the future but I think the massive vote to change the name in the AAPA HOD is a good metric of a sea change. As a former consultant, I know that it’s not unusual for a client to accept only part of a recommendation. A consultant’s study is not a randomized, double-blinded, objective clinical trial: it’s a subjective study with limited participation and is influenced by the options presented to the study participants and the wording of the questions.

I kind of wanted MCP (after it grew on me). I was a “plumber’s helper” going through college (without a wooden stick coming out of me!)  Other than that experience, I offhand can’t think of a job (and that one certainly wasn’t a "profession") that references another profession in its name.

Still, “Physician Associate” it’s a step in the right direction and we shouldn’t break apart by letting the “best” become the enemy of the “good.” And we still need to work on practice rules like OTP (and where that might lead next.)  As it is, I already see a little “reluctant dragon” speech peeking out in the recent AAPA news release so let’s not let up and walk away because we didn’t get exactly what we need.

We got something. Let’s rejoice and move forward.

Edited May 26, 2021 by UGoLong

[Lbarnum]

I am a PA-S2 so I fully appreciate that my opinion is inherently less informed than many on here. My only issue with MCP is that it doesn't really differentiate us at all from any clinician. I understand that can be true of virtually any title, but any practitioner of medical care is an MCP. It thoroughly relates to what we do, and marketing shows this, however it is not a career title. It feels like a concession to avoid ruffling feathers while calling ourselves something new. Truthfully, and honestly, if we are intending to create a 3rd independent provider field...we need to also work with MDs to redefine what THEIR role is. We dont want unending redundancy in medicine because we will lose sight of what the intended purpose of our profession is, to increase primary care access to fully qualified medical professionals. On the other hand, we shouldn't kneel before the AMA and concede that physicians own medicine and how it is distributed, big picture...they are just another provider albeit with more specialized expertise. We're not assistants (and I'd argue we're closer to associate physicians than physician associates) but we're also not a unique provider in the way that NPs can claim (nursing model training, etc.). I think the end goal would see MDs as the top of the pyramid, complex cases, specialty practice, research, etc....and PAs after a few years of collaborative practice can apply to be FPA in General Practice or primary care however narrowly defined. Of course nothing would inhibit PAs from remaining in collaborative practice in a specialty or surgical setting, nor MDs in GP (lol the few that still work there) but that model creates defined purpose for both of us to exist with justification. We're both trained in the medical model, we both are trained to approach cases the same. This battle to keep PAs so distinct from MDs serves medicine in absolutely no capacity. The AAPA tiptoes around it when the fact is the medical industry NEEDS us. Docs are not doing us a favor by "allowing" us to exist. We have to stop apologizing for what we are, and definitely have to stop bending over backward to ensure no one ever confuses us for a physician. Cardiologists dont panic if their patient starts going into GI complaints. Its far past time to stop placating egos and tradition.

[Cideous]

8 hours ago, Lbarnum said:

I am a PA-S2 so I fully appreciate that my opinion is inherently less informed than many on here. My only issue with MCP is that it doesn't really differentiate us at all from any clinician. I understand that can be true of virtually any title, but any practitioner of medical care is an MCP. It thoroughly relates to what we do, and marketing shows this, however it is not a career title. It feels like a concession to avoid ruffling feathers while calling ourselves something new. Truthfully, and honestly, if we are intending to create a 3rd independent provider field...we need to also work with MDs to redefine what THEIR role is. We dont want unending redundancy in medicine because we will lose sight of what the intended purpose of our profession is, to increase primary care access to fully qualified medical professionals. On the other hand, we shouldn't kneel before the AMA and concede that physicians own medicine and how it is distributed, big picture...they are just another provider albeit with more specialized expertise. We're not assistants (and I'd argue we're closer to associate physicians than physician associates) but we're also not a unique provider in the way that NPs can claim (nursing model training, etc.). I think the end goal would see MDs as the top of the pyramid, complex cases, specialty practice, research, etc....and PAs after a few years of collaborative practice can apply to be FPA in General Practice or primary care however narrowly defined. Of course nothing would inhibit PAs from remaining in collaborative practice in a specialty or surgical setting, nor MDs in GP (lol the few that still work there) but that model creates defined purpose for both of us to exist with justification. We're both trained in the medical model, we both are trained to approach cases the same. This battle to keep PAs so distinct from MDs serves medicine in absolutely no capacity. The AAPA tiptoes around it when the fact is the medical industry NEEDS us. Docs are not doing us a favor by "allowing" us to exist. We have to stop apologizing for what we are, and definitely have to stop bending over backward to ensure no one ever confuses us for a physician. Cardiologists dont panic if their patient starts going into GI complaints. Its far past time to stop placating egos and tradition.

Yours is the future of this profession.  If you want to be someones associate or assistant then have at it, but my guess is you are being trained to be...wait for it....A PRACTITIONER OF MEDICINE.