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pay rate dilemma

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so the place where i work has been trying to get another pa/np for the position opposite me (working the nights i don't). I always am searching for new jobs on the internet and saw the ad posted, except the pay rate range was several dollars more per hour than what i was hired at. I was a new grad when they hired me and the ad included "new grads welcome." I've been at this place for only 7 months.


So long story short I raised this issue with them demanding the minimal amount I saw in the ad and they said they messed up and put in the per diem rate. What do you all think of this? The HR rep wouldnt budge at all from her stance and I just began to talk in circles with her and gave up. She said I would just have to have "good faith" that it was an honest misprint. Should I have held them to it? She tried comforting me saying I was due for an annual pay raise but that's not the issue so I could care less. Such BS, why can't HR people be easy to negotiate with?

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Leave. They screwed up, so they can pay for their screwup one of two ways:

1) They can give you the starting salary they're offering to new grads, or

2) They can replace you at the starting salary they're offering to new grads.


"Several dollars more per hour" does not cover benefits, unless by "several", you're talking $10-15/hour. HR is there to save the company money, and yes, if they can keep you ignorant of the true value of your labor and pay you less and keep you happy, the company wins. HR people are not there to help individual employees, nor are they legally prevented from lying in the course of their job.

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Its more of a contractual and integrity/maturity issue.


YOU agreed to work for a certain amount. They pay you what YOU agreed to work for. WE don't see what the problem is.

The closest analogy would be a NBA draftee agreeing to and signing a 10yr/$100 million contract to play for Cinncinati... then next yr, after the draft, this same NBA draftee who agreed to play for $100 million last yr, starts whineing about the $110 million contract a new draftee negotiated and signed.




You are sitting in a restaurant. You look at the menu and order a entree with standard side dishes.

The strangers at the table next to you also order their food.

Your food comes and you start to eat it with no problems.

The folks at the other table, food comes and you notice that they ordered the same thing you did, but they negotiated different and much more appealing side dishes.

So now you are upset, feel cheated and don't want to pay for your food, because YOU didn't negotiate different/better sides with your entree.


Before you accept the job, its considered a "negotiation" for a reason..!!!


The way you avoid this in the future is:


1.) ASK for what YOU want. "A closed mouth doesn't get fed." Hold out for what YOU want. Decline the job offer if it doesn't meet YOUR standards. Don't EVER accept a job that doesn't meet your standards in pay, benefits, or working standards because YOU are only setting yourself up to be miserable/disgruntled. This always ends poorly!!


Even if you prevail in getting a increase, you have "poisoned" your image/relationship with admin in large organizations and with your SP in a small practice.


2.) Your word/signature should mean something...!!! If you agree to something then follow thru and do what you agreed to do. The key here is NOT agreeing to unacceptable terms.


For instance... On one job, they paid "Mid-Levels" $50-$55/hrs for work and $3.00/hr for carrying the pager. When they told me that during negotiations, I smiled and said, "I haven't worked for less than $55/hr in 5 yrs, nor have I worked for less than minimum wage since I graduated highschool..!!! If I'm expected to be sober, able and available while waiting for someone to call I'm Working. Then be affiable when the calls come, I need to atleast be paid minimum wage."


I then went on to articulate why both parties (them & me) needed to feel good about the results of our negotiations and not feel like there was any arm twisting if we were going to truely build a solid team and working relationship. As a result, I'm the only one here that gets paid $57/hr and $10/hr for being on call.


The moral here is: Ask for what YOU want, and don't settle for less because you will only be unhappy. Once you agree to something, you can't blame others if YOU are unhappy with what YOU agreed to.


3.) Stop comparing yourself to others. The Psych NPs at one of my jobs tried this. They tried to compare their "Psych-Only" training and experience to my Internal Medicine (Cardiology, Critical Care, Urgent Care)/Addiction Medicine/ Psychiatry Experience.. and wanted to make as much as I did since they were there LONG before I was hired. They were eventually/politely told that when they can do MORE than Psych... HR will have the discussion about their pay equaling mine.


When one of them approached me complaining about the disparities in pay, for illustrative purposes, I handed her a set of lab results on one of her patients (CMP/CBC) and asked her to tell me, based upon the lab work in her hand, what type of Anemia her patient had and how would we treat it and to explain to me the liver inflamation pattern this patient had...


She smiled and said "Point taken"... :heheh: :wink:


Personally, I don't compare what I'm being compensated with to others around me AFTER the negotiations. Prior to negotiations YES... (so I know where to start or if I'm even interested) after negotiations NO.


Just some of MY initial thoughts.



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good thoughts C. agree with all of above. know what you are worth and don't accept less.

this brings to mind a thread from a few years ago about how low a salary would you accept for the perfect job...but that is another matter entirely...

here it is:


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Guest Paula

Contrarian has good points. If you are always searching for new positions on the internet, you must not be completely satisfied with your job. Stay a year if you can and in the meantime, learn how to negotiate and what you want. I wish my PA school would have had a class on negotiations, salaries, and how to get what you want. It was through trial and error I finally was able to get paid my worth at my new job (now 7 months into it) and I am extremely happy. My prior employer was upset when I resigned on the day they wanted to meet for new salary negotiations. I had asked to start the process 6 months before my contract was up, and they kept delaying it to one month before it was up. It gave me 5 months to negotiate with the new employer and work out a sweet deal.

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I don't disagree either, Contrarian, but I work in an at-will state, and that colors my perspective. I probably should have said "find a better job" rather than simply "leave", but not a lot of things will cause me to quit a job on the spot. Any time I hear of HR invoking good faith with respect to pay and contracts, however, that's a big fat red flag for me.

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We have a saying... Playing by "Big Boy Rules"...


If we expect to be treated as professionals and ADULTS... we must present and behave as such...:heheh:


We are in a profession/business were veracity is important.


What we say we did, or will do is important.


What we say we will do or did professionally should be trusted and taken at face value to be true.


When we agree to work ... it is our professional word we have given, regardless of if its for $2.00 ... $200k... or for free/volunteer work.


It sounds to me like the employer in the original post kept their word/end of the deal. For 7 months they paid the OP what He/She negotiated.


So regardless of "right to work" or whatever... the OP sounds like the "NBA" player in Cinncinati.:wink:


Its also Laughable that the OP was a NEW GRAD a whole 7 months ago and somehow thinks that 7 months elevates them to a level where they can DEMAND more pay than any other new grad.


When in reality... PAs are still considered "new grads" until about 1.5-2yrs practicing.


The really silly part is... most PAs work yrly contracts that are re-negotiated every yr.

Rather than come across as a money hungry minimally trained douche... and prematurely poison your reputation and professional stature on the present job... the smart way to deal with this would have been to simply wait until the anniversary date of the original contract (4-5 months) and then include a salary increase in the negotiations. As this would be expected, customary and common.

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looks like contrarian didn't understand my point in this thread, but also that could be because i left some things out. i work in a prison. the two other midlevels i work with do the exact same work as i do. We all see new inmates into the facility. We share the exact same desk, same equipment, are expected to follow the exact same protocols but just switch after each of our shifts. I will very well compare myself to them because the work we do is identical, unlike the nba player. The nba player is an investment with a projected ceiling, and also compensated on current demand on a specific position. They can also go above and beyond with their individual talent. The reason they CAN bargain is because of these variables. With my facility there are no variables. I could maybe understand my corporate office offering a higher minimal range a few years down the road to a new grad due to simple market change but not 7 months. And I wasn't saying that 7 months working there elevated my bargaining ability. In fact, I used it to show how closely I still consider myself a new grad. Read the sentence one more time.


HR was even saying how if they elevated my rate, then that would place me above the midlevel who had been there for several years, and they said "we just can't do that." So it seems to me like these people want every midlevels salary to be almost identical. And again, I think that this has to do with the fact that they know the work we do is identical. My co-worker might have 10 years on me but that doesn't mean anything at this job, and thats something you have to take my word for. All you need is a couple month steep learning curve and you know almost everything you need to do to function 100% at this facility. In all honestly, I really do think they just messed up on the ad. I just wanted to know how much of a prick I should have been holding it against them.


Everything else you guys said about negotiating I agree with. Perhaps its just my setting.

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^^^ Got it ^^^

I read what you wrote above which further illuminates what you see as a problem and your justification of your actions to address that problem. I get that...


That said... maybe its generational.


What I don't get is WHY you think them paying YOU... what YOU agreed to work for is a problem and now you feel wronged.


If I agree to work for $2.00 a yr... then 7 months later another PA comes along and agrees to work for $70,000 a yr... I'm not seeing where I've been misled, mistreated, wronged, bamboozled, duped. I agreed to the $2.00.


The phrase "your word is your bond, cause if your word don't mean ish... then all else is equally worthless"... comes to mind.


I'm actually NOT trying to be argumentative... I'm genuiely curious.

Please elucidate/educate.

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