Alternative job titles survey

[EMEDPA]

On 11/13/2019 at 8:45 AM, GetMeOuttaThisMess said:

Especially when you'd rather have that loving feeling.

now it's gone, gone, gone....woo oh owo

[Reality Check 2]

That survey was bizarre.

Not able to NOT pick adjectives to describe something - HAD to pick words that didn't even come to mind. And no choice for WTF?

Bizarre.

Pretty sure this group was next door to a cannabis test room and they just pulled names out of orifices..........................

 

[Joelseff]

What we have to consider (and looking at the survey it probably was the case) titles like clinician or medical practitioner are common titles that cover multiple professionals and cannot legally belong to one profession. I saw a post from a PA colleague who is also a JD/Attorney on the aapa huddle about this. It is like trying to trademark "salesperson."

 

Once upon a lifetime ago, I was a Realtor[emoji2400] which was a legally protected title and reserved for use of those who belong to the association of Realtors[emoji2400] otherwise we were merely Real Estate Agents. Realtor[emoji2400] was a made up word. This would likely explain a couple of the seemingly bizarre options...

 

For those complaining and were "infuriated" by the survey... Why? I'm confused. Because the title you wanted wasn't included or you felt it too vague? Is this the end of the line for this? Maybe it is and I can understand some frustration with it but this is moving along and why don't we be patient and wait for the next step.

 

I haven't always been an AAPA fan but I think the are doing what they can to move this along... But if your mad about it, don't know what to tell you all...

 

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[PACali]

I am one of the few that is actually pretty happy about the survey, but I am biased because the title I like is in it.  

[ProSpectre]

I made a couple of comments about not being thrilled with the survey choices myself earlier; like anyone else, I have my personal preferences and opinions on this issue, but I'm passionate about the title change and advancement of the PA profession. I'm glad this research is taking place in a systematic manner, and I know this is all part of the process. Overall, I think the AAPA has really stepped up to the plate to position the profession for the future, both with working towards the title change and with other issues like OTP and reimbursement -- I recently donated to the AAPA PAC again, and encourage others to do the same to keep this momentum going forward. 

I definitely think we'll be better off as a profession after the title investigation research is completed and the subsequent vote on a new title, regardless of whether it's the title I personally vote for or not. Getting the "assistant" out of our title is the most important factor to me here, and I'm confident that goal is finally within reach after being debated for the last 25+ years.  

[deltawave]

I’m enthused that we have the opportunity for discussion and that we don’t have to all agree on anything, yet.  I’m hopeful that this progress will lead to some good outcome for our profession. I remain skeptical, see my sig line.

I’m a little upset that they spent an exorbitant amount of our money on this result, thus far.  To me, that was a push towards forcing the option which leaves the initials PA, as well as other factors which I elaborated in the other thread. (Can they be merged or can we get a sticky by the way?) I am certain there is a method to the madness, but thinking those titles were going to be received with praise was a little wild. If it was designed as a teaser.... well let’s just say if it was a movie I wouldn’t spend my $20 or whatever to go see it.

Perhaps my use of the word infuriated was a bit hyperbolic.  

Edited November 16, 2019 by deltawave

[Hope2PA]

14 hours ago, Joelseff said:

What we have to consider (and looking at the survey it probably was the case) titles like clinician or medical practitioner are common titles that cover multiple professionals and cannot legally belong to one profession. I saw a post from a PA colleague who is also a JD/Attorney on the aapa huddle about this. It is like trying to trademark "salesperson."

 

Once upon a lifetime ago, I was a Realtor which was a legally protected title and reserved for use of those who belong to the association of Realtors otherwise we were merely Real Estate Agents. Realtor was a made up word. This would likely explain a couple of the seemingly bizarre options...

 

For those complaining and were "infuriated" by the survey... Why? I'm confused. Because the title you wanted wasn't included or you felt it too vague? Is this the end of the line for this? Maybe it is and I can understand some frustration with it but this is moving along and why don't we be patient and wait for the next step.

 

I haven't always been an AAPA fan but I think the are doing what they can to move this along... But if your mad about it, don't know what to tell you all...

 

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I am not a lawyer, yet understand “protected” titles. However, Tehran are numerous good combinations that could identify the profession. Again, I haven’t seen survey so don’t speculate an of these were on there. Medical Science Practitioner, Medical Care Practitioner, Medical health Practitioner, ClinicalMedicinePractioner...and  so on. Practitioner is not in itself a protected word. It is already some what established as a word for non physician providers. There are several types of Therapists, technologists, PHYSICIAN IS a protected word and gearing to a title that maintains that association is better than assistant, but look down the road even10years, it still makes professional eternally tied to their Physician’s supervisors or collaborators(feel that is what those that will Avenida worries in10 years want).   My 2 cents will not matter, but thanks for the opportunity to express thoughts. 

[traumajd]

On 11/13/2019 at 9:58 PM, BayPAC said:

It's easy to know which title we will have after completing this survey. Anyone agree? 

I felt like the ridiculous ones set us up to say “I like ________” (the one that keeps the initials the same). Why wasn’t physician assistant an option?  Shouldn’t they compare peoples perceptions of the new ideas vs what we already have also?

I’m not a proponent of changing the name at all. I can’t see how it is demeaning. I haven’t had to explain what a physician assistant is in years and don’t see an issue at all.  Are we that upset at being called assistant? Doesn’t bother me. Are nurse practitioners considering a name change so people don’t think they are “just nurses”? 
 

All this is going to do is make me spend the next 10 years of my career explaining what a ____________  ____________  ___________ is. Ugh!

[LT_Oneal_PAC]

40 minutes ago, traumajd said:

I felt like the ridiculous ones set us up to say “I like ________” (the one that keeps the initials the same). Why wasn’t physician assistant an option?  Shouldn’t they compare peoples perceptions of the new ideas vs what we already have also?

I’m not a proponent of changing the name at all. I can’t see how it is demeaning. I haven’t had to explain what a physician assistant is in years and don’t see an issue at all.  Are we that upset at being called assistant? Doesn’t bother me. Are nurse practitioners considering a name change so people don’t think they are “just nurses”? 
 

All this is going to do is make me spend the next 10 years of my career explaining what a ____________  ____________  ___________ is. Ugh!

We already did a survey on the physician assistant title and know what PAs and the public think of it. No reason to ask again as it would be superfluous. And yes, some of us don’t like having assistant in our title, but more than that it’s what others think of the title, which we have proven the perception of which doesn’t match what we do. As far as having to explain it, sounds like a “because this is how we’ve always done it” argument. The benefits, in my mind and apparently most of the PAs that care enough to fill out the survey, outweigh staying with the status quo.

[traumajd]

10 hours ago, LT_Oneal_PAC said:

We already did a survey on the physician assistant title and know what PAs and the public think of it. No reason to ask again as it would be superfluous. And yes, some of us don’t like having assistant in our title, but more than that it’s what others think of the title, which we have proven the perception of which doesn’t match what we do. As far as having to explain it, sounds like a “because this is how we’ve always done it” argument. The benefits, in my mind and apparently most of the PAs that care enough to fill out the survey, outweigh staying with the status quo.

It Is not a “this is how we’ve always done it” argument. Of course, if you ask someone what the word “assistant” means, they’ll say something that sounds subordinate. I get that. My point is that the term “physician assistant” is well known. I don’t think, just because it says assistant, that it means an unqualified lackey to people. A lot of people know what it is, even if the term is outdated. 

I know it’s too late to do anything about it. I will vote for whatever name seems next best to me when the time comes. I’m simply expressing my opinion that I don’t like the change simply because of having to explain, all over again, whatever the new name is means. I think it is going to cause a lot of confusion.

Do I need to call myself a retail product procurement specialist because customer sounds like I’m dependent on the salesman?

[BayPAC]

My title of choice would be  PJ = physician junior.  

"I'm so and so, your PJ. How can I help you today?" 

[LT_Oneal_PAC]

1 hour ago, traumajd said:

It Is not a “this is how we’ve always done it” argument. Of course, if you ask someone what the word “assistant” means, they’ll say something that sounds subordinate. I get that. My point is that the term “physician assistant” is well known. I don’t think, just because it says assistant, that it means an unqualified lackey to people. A lot of people know what it is, even if the term is outdated. 

I know it’s too late to do anything about it. I will vote for whatever name seems next best to me when the time comes. I’m simply expressing my opinion that I don’t like the change simply because of having to explain, all over again, whatever the new name is means. I think it is going to cause a lot of confusion.

Do I need to call myself a retail product procurement specialist because customer sounds like I’m dependent on the salesman?

I appreciate the concerns you have, but we have quantifiable research now from patients and stake holders that the name doesn’t fit and confuses them now on our capabilities. 
 

as far as your example, a more apt illustration of the problem here is imagine there is a position called District regional manager assistant. Is that someone who you call to schedule An appointment with or is that someone who can fire you? We both know that does not sound like an executive level position.

[sas5814]

yea like when we were having VIP visits and it was the 3rd undersecretary to the vice assistant deputy of the secretary of defense.

*eyeroll*

[rev ronin]

All: Since Huddle is not currently (no longer?) censoring discussion of the specific alternate professional names mentioned in the survey, will will no longer do so either.  Members are feel free to continue to discuss things in generalities if they prefer, but we are never going to be MORE censored/moderated than Huddle.

@LT_Oneal_PAC@EMEDPA@ventana FYI

[deltawave]

Nice. No more secrecy, here are the options:

Praxician

Clinicist

Medical Care Practitioner 

Physician Associate

 

Now tell me those first two aren’t the dumbest thing you’ve never heard.

Edited November 17, 2019 by deltawave

[LT_Oneal_PAC]

13 minutes ago, deltawave said:

Nice. No more secrecy, here are the options:

Praxitioner

Clinicist

Medical Care Practitioner 

Physician Associate

 

Now tell me those first two aren’t the dumbest thing you’ve never heard.

Praxician was actually the title used, but yes, ridiculous. I did google Prax and it is a real word. Clinicist also pretty bad. 
 

as for the last 2, I’m hoping MCP could become medical science practitioner. Physician associate has all the same problems, maybe not to the same degree, as physician assistant.

[deltawave]

3 minutes ago, LT_Oneal_PAC said:

Praxician was actually the title used, but yes, ridiculous. I did google Prax and it is a real word. Clinicist also pretty bad. 
 

as for the last 2, I’m hoping MCP could become medical science practitioner. Physician associate has all the same problems, maybe not to the same degree, as physician assistant.

Fixed it.

See how it can get mangled though, terrible choice.

 

I’m voting MCP for the reason that Physician Associate will lead to this debate in a few years again. 

Edited November 17, 2019 by deltawave

[Joelseff]

Nice. No more secrecy, here are the options:
Praxician
Clinicist
Medical Care Practitioner 
Physician Associate
 
Now tell me those first two aren’t the dumbest thing you’ve never heard.

I think the first two were controls. I doubt anyone voted for those. I could be wrong...

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[EMEDPA]

10 minutes ago, Joelseff said:

I think the first two were controls. I doubt anyone voted for those. I could be wrong...

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let's hope. I will never refer to my self as a clinicist or praxician. If it came to that I would say " I am one of the ER providers today" and leave it at that. 

[Joelseff]

let's hope. I will never refer to my self as a clinicist or praxician. If it came to that I would say " I am one of the ER providers today" and leave it at that. 

Well, judging from the response to those names here and in the huddle I don't think anyone voted for them lol. I had to read it a few times and after the survey thought it was "Praxian" which sounds like a Star Trek alien race... Clinicist had some logic but was still very off the mark.  

 

With those choices, it looks like the purpose was to corner us into the two choices of MCP and Physician Associate. I posted before about why Medical Practitioner is unlikely allowable (legality etc) thus the "Care" being added. Physician Associate should have been expected in any Title change conversation/survey.

 

I'm waiting for the end result. If anyone remembers I have always been for a title change and I, for one, am excited. I see the glass as half full like most PAs, though some here and on the huddle act/post like that the glass is half full of piss [emoji23]

 

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[sas5814]

Let me play devil's advocate. I don't think those are the actual titles they are considering but rather a test of tolerance for something totally different vs something warm and familiar...but I could be wrong.

Lets say we land on Praxician (which to me sounds like something your would take for menstral cramps). It is totally unique. It is all ours. We aren't titled in any way that attaches us to any other profession (physician anything). 

Initially there would be a great hue and cry. There would be ridicule and complaints, threats of suicide and leaving the country. 20 years from now we would be Praxicians. Just us. Unique profession with a unique title that belongs to it alone. Some of us would be sitting in our rockers yammering about the old days when we were the physicina's assistant and the youngsters wouldn't know what we were on about.

Big change takes time. Our lizard brains are hard wired to resist and dislike change. First it seems crazy. Then it seems tolerable. Then it becomes the new normal.

Edited November 17, 2019 by sas5814

[traumajd]

Medical Care Practitioner just sounds super vague. A nurse is a practitioner of medical care. A physician is a practitioner of medical care. I don’t think that sounds any more professional.

[Joelseff]

Let me play devil's advocate. I don't think those are the actual titles they are considering but rather a test of tolerance for something totally different vs something warm and familiar...but I could be wrong.

Lets say we land on Praxician (which to me sounds like something your would take for menstral cramps). It is totally unique. It is all ours. We aren't titled in any way that attaches us to any other profession (physician anything). 

Initially there would be a great hue and cry. There would be ridicule and complaints, threats of suicide and leaving the country. 20 years from now we would be Praxicians. Just us. Unique profession with a unique title that belongs to it alone. Some of us would be sitting in our rockers yammering about the old days when we were the physicina's assistant and the youngsters wouldn't know what we were on about.

Big change takes time. Our lizard brains are hard wired to resist and dislike change. First it seems crazy. Then it seems tolerable. Then it becomes the new normal.

That's like Realtor[emoji2400] totally made up but now every RE agent is called Realtor[emoji2400] whether they are one or not.

 

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[traumajd]

Right.  Realtor does not describe accurately what they do. But everyone knows what a realtor does.

 

oh, here’s another one: legal services provider (just as vague as MCP)

[BayPAC]

betting a dollar that we will be still called PAs 10 years from now... whatever that means.