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Cideous

Teaching at an NP program....as a PA-C?

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Has anyone ever done this or heard of it being done?  There are a LOT of NP programs popping up and for someone interested in transitioning into a teaching position I was curious if this was possible.  This would essentially double the size of perspective places to teach vs just PA programs alone.  

Thanks!

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Has anyone ever done this or heard of it being done?  There are a LOT of NP programs popping up and for someone interested in transitioning into a teaching position I was curious if this was possible.  This would essentially double the size of perspective places to teach vs just PA programs alone.  
Thanks!


Perhaps, but I’ve also heard of NP programs that won’t let PAs precept NP students.


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Invest your time to teach future PA. We’re been out numbered by NP and you’re enhancing their effort by your decision to teach.

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Invest your time to teach future PA. We’re been out numbered by NP and you’re enhancing their effort by your decision to teach.

This! I actually am finishing up my last NP student. Only taking PA students now. Partially for the reason you stated but also the quality of NP students I have gotten were inconsistent. I precept both currently for 3 schools.

 

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BON in my state apparently decided two years ago that NP students could not be precepted by PAs; this, after two were scheduled with our practice for six week rotations each.  One of these students had been (unsuccessfully) seeking a women's health rotation for eight months previously.  When she contacted the nurse administrator at the hospital where she was currently completing a rotation for clarification, she was advised to attend the rotation with me anyway, but to have the CP sign all her paperwork and complete her evaluation.   She was further advised not to even mention me or my PA credentials by name.  As the MD was in the office approximately 3 hours per week and would have had absolutely minimal contact with the student, I refused this "suggestion."  If I am good enough to precept and train the student, then I am good enough to do the evaluation and be on record for having done so.  

With this kind of inter-professional animosity, I'd agree with the above: Focus your educational efforts on future generations of PAs. 

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I would never take a full time NP teach position

 

Why help a different profession when you should be helping you own??

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1 hour ago, ventana said:

I would never take a full time NP teach position

 

Why help a different profession when you should be helping you own??

Do you have the same opinions about MDs teaching/precepting PA students?   To this day, the one single person who taught me the most about my field is an older PA, back when I was a new resident.  I would hate it if PAs could only teach PAs, or NPs only NPs or MDs only MDs.  I think we'd all be poorer for it.  When I read EMEDPA's posts about a clinical topic, I always learn something new about emergency medicine.  I think that's great.

I don't know. I'm old fashioned - if you have knowledge to share, you should share it freely.  I think it's an important part of our profession (and part of most version of the hippocratic oath).  I think you can advocate and fight for the advancement of your profession but also be open to teaching people if they want to learn.

Edited by lkth487
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It was more about expanding the number of potential places to teach than promoting one profession over another.  ?

 

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Just now, Cideous said:

It was more about expanding the number of potential places to teach than promoting one profession over another.  ?

 

Fair enough!

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lkth487,

I agree fully with your sentiments.  It was not me, but the BON, that made this an untenable situation.  I have, on many occasions, and would happily and enthusiastically continue, to share my knowledge with all who sought it.  But not under the arrangements proposed, which I found quite honestly to be fraudulent.

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I have been a preceptor for PAs and NPs for many years and will continue to do so.  I believe PA training is far superior but that does not negate the duty to pay it forward to all participants in the healthcare industry. FNP students  need PAs and MDs to help guide them to be competent clinicians. 

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I've attempted applying for NP teaching positions and never get an interview or am specifically to they can't hire PAs.  Sadly, I can't even get my local PA programs to take any interest in my desire to even give a guest lecture.  

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On 10/8/2018 at 9:40 AM, lkth487 said:

Do you have the same opinions about MDs teaching/precepting PA students?   To this day, the one single person who taught me the most about my field is an older PA, back when I was a new resident.  I would hate it if PAs could only teach PAs, or NPs only NPs or MDs only MDs.  I think we'd all be poorer for it.  When I read EMEDPA's posts about a clinical topic, I always learn something new about emergency medicine.  I think that's great.

I don't know. I'm old fashioned - if you have knowledge to share, you should share it freely.  I think it's an important part of our profession (and part of most version of the hippocratic oath).  I think you can advocate and fight for the advancement of your profession but also be open to teaching people if they want to learn.

 

MD can precept anyone as they are the top of the pile

 

I am loyal to my profession and I don't feel like advancing another competing profession that sometimes uses a lot of smoke and mirrors (advanced nursing not medicine being the biggest one)

 

As well I have seen entire hospital systems favor NP over PA simply due to the admin types being RN's - I don't harbor ill will against them at all and think they are great clinicians, but I am not, nor would I ever, work to advance their profession at the expense of my own.

 

If teaching is that important then work with a PA program to advance our own profession

I have and would precept NP students

 

Just my crusty old 2 cents worth....

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I've attempted applying for NP teaching positions and never get an interview or am specifically to they can't hire PAs.  Sadly, I can't even get my local PA programs to take any interest in my desire to even give a guest lecture.  


Maybe the program doesn’t have a need to your specific area or in general. To set your foot in the door, I would consider precepting student first.

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20 hours ago, KMD16 said:

 


Maybe the program doesn’t have a need to your specific area or in general. To set your foot in the door, I would consider precepting student first.

 

I've been a preceptor for 11 years and have precepted for my local programs.  I have practice experience in multiple specialties and one of which is psych.  Not many psych PAs out there.  

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I have taught at numerous NP programs and have taught NP faculty to prepare them to teach certain subjects such as Suturing Workshops. You never know when you may be in a rural area where the only provider is a NP . Are you going to be like a foolish MD or DO who would not accept an NP or PA provider in a rural area only to die from a ruptured diverticulitis because they became septic? Think , folks, think. I have mentored both PAs and NPs although many more PAs and have found strong and weak students in both professions. It's the quality of the student and their desire to earn that is the tipping point.

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I stopped taking NP students due to quality and skill issues.

Then the NP schools said no PAs. Then they ran out of preceptors and came back and said PAs are ok. Ummm, never mind now.

I would not teach on faculty because the education is soooo different and I would promote PA education for students more readily - I walk the walk, know the education standards and have the expectations that can actually be met.

Currently training residents......

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I've never taught at an NP program, but wouldn't be opposed to it either. I have written test-review style questions and CME for FNP products, as well as for USMLE, PANCE, and other health professions examinations. 

As lkth487 said, we should all share knowledge with one another and not keep it inaccessible to our colleagues in other professions. We're all treating the same patients at the end of the day. 

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Brian, I like your style and your openness. I observe that you are a part of jordan's group at Modern MedED. this is a great place to continue your writing. also consider Doximity as they get your manuscripts out to the entire medical community.

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Surgblumm, BrainAndCo is the name for the free, clinician-facing medical writing part of Modern MedEd. I go by BrainAndCo here and places like Figure1 because I write a lot about, well brains and stuff. If you are interested, check out my latest case and see if it's worth following me there too! The next one I think will post tomorrow (usually Sundays once or twice a month).

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