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Official, that the program director ramos has stepped down !!


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To the Bears and Mikes and others who did not want to believe the probation status, I wonder what their thoughts are, when they apply for a job and the first question is 'why is your school on probation, the answer, ummm blame arc won't help, ha ha ha. I wonder if your faculty will help.

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I applied to Chatam for the 2013 cohort. There is so much back and forth on this thread but I haven't seen anything concrete about what is so awful about this program? Is it the PBL? Certainly Chatam can't be theory program run this way? Do any of you new grads feel like you,we're unprepared for the PANCE or for your first PA job? Can someone please give actual examples of these alledged "problems" ?

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Throw them out huh? So are they throwing out those who are above the standard set by the program or throwing out those below the standard? Are they throwing them out according to the policies and procedures? I mean every program has expectations set and falling below them is grounds for dismissal and they usually make these very clear in a handbook or presentation or both prior to the start of the program.

 

So if you are not meeting the expectations, they should keep a student? Even though they were fully aware of the expectations? How is that beneficial to anyone? Some things (poor lecturing/poor facilities/unavailable faculty and such) are ok to complain about, but complaining about a program following a set/clear policy is not cool and a waste of time. yes it would be nice if they had some sort of recycling program for students (take time off and join the next class) BUT Im hearing not many programs work that way--you do poorly and youre out and that kind of consideration shouldnt be expected/demanded if it wasn't already outlined as a possibility in the policies and procedures.

 

Would I be upset if it were me? Yep, but I could only blame myself for doing poorly in the first place but not everyone thinks like me...

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Check the facts. Compare the students. Where is the standard ?

You and someone else could have done the exact same thing but will be marked differently. And talking of a standard, the standard is a reference book or the guidelines set by peer reviews, not what the person thinks of is right. Besides many of us come from a non medical background and all this stuff is new to us, so the standard should be set at par with the learning level of the average of the students not to a teacher who has been out in the field for say x number of years. Yes there are students who do not do well, but is there a system to help them and guide them appropriately, so they can come up to a certain level. Are students at a disadvantage yes. The reason being if you have a friend there who graduated or a roomie from a year ahead, you will do much much much better as you will have a lot of material that is there for the tests. Facts remain facts. The handbook, the policies, the procedures are a lame excuse. If you want to churn out great empathic PA's the faculty has to work hard to bring out the best in them, not threaten or cite them for violations or honor code issues.

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Lol at thinking theres moments in any program where two people dont get two different marks. Standardized testing is one thing so if its happening there then yes, yes you have something to be upset about; but yeah it happens all the time when having SOAP notes and standardized patient encounters graded and why? Its all subjective. Guess what....it's like that in the real world as well, but you're a PA so you know that. I have two academic advisers that grade my SOAPs and they do that ALL THE TIME. Yes its annoying but we also have a preceptors that we meet with every other week to see a patient through the week and even he wants to see/hear things differently. Friends have been telling me presenting/techniques ect vary from clinical site to site because everyone does things differently.

 

Sorry I dont agree about something else...policies and procedures are there for a reason. They are there so that everyone is treated on the same level....how fair would it be to give exceptions to one and not another simply because that person came in with no HCE....I'd say that was their choice. Learning standards are set so that the students churned out are similar in standard to all other programs and meet the expectations of the accreditation boards as well as the level necessary to pass the PANCE. You do not lower the bar because your students have no HCE.....the students are expected to raise theirs to meet the standards. They have certain things they must teach in a certain period of time and if a person cant keep up and their excuse is that they have no previous hce.....what is the program to do? A program that does not follow the policy and procedures is a program doomed to fail from chaos. A program that does not set the standard that puts graduates on level to pass the PANCE will eventually see itself on probation From what I have read so far.....the standard was already too low according to PANCE scores and the accreditation agency.

 

PS I dont need to check facts, the people spitting out non-substantiated information. Policies/procedures/standards are all facts and set in place for a reason if if someone doesnt like it. People are always ok with the expectations of a program until they dont meet them. They are always ok with policies and procedures until they have to deal with them. It's like the habitual speeder who gets mad at a cop for giving them a ticket.

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