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If this happens, the profession as we know it is done for......


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Guest Elpatodog

I think that article is right on track with what the NP wants to do. We need to take the lead and follow because we are behind. I can see it in the hiring practices in my local area but that is not why I commented. Anyway.......

The main reason I really commented is that we don’t have to re invent the wheel they are giving us great ideas on how to advance our profession and they are educating us on how to do it. We need a web site like that !! They are changing in these times and we need to do the same. It’s the adaptable that survive and can change with the times.

I have been a PA since 2002 and notice that the NP’s are making great strides in bridging that gap of of what a doctor is.

A doctor in a complete sense of the word is someone who takes care of the whole person and in my opinion that does not just mean an MD. It also means PA, NP etc......

So in the end these are just a bunch of titles fighting for the same positions.

Lets fight harder :) but kindness does matter and we should all be able to work together peacefully for the same goal in the end....To take care of our patients to the best of our ability together.

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3 hours ago, Elpatodog said:

A doctor in a complete sense of the word is someone who takes care of the whole person and in my opinion that does not just mean an MD. It also means PA, NP etc......

"Doctor: a qualified medical practitioner; a physician; someone who holds a doctorate"

We can split hairs and focus on the beginning of the definition or we can take the "complete sense of the word" and understand that doctor = physician (in the medical world).  Unfortunately there are many that have pushed to make themselves feel more important than they are and introduce themselves as Doctor Smith (DPT, DNP, DNS ,etc, etc, etc.).  Even worse is that many fall for this crockery.  And worst of all is that it creates significant confusion for patients.

To push to make a PA the equivalent of a physician is wrong.  We are not equivalent.  Does that mean we are bad medical providers or shouldn't be able to have some level of autonomy?  OF COURSE  NOT!

In my opinion, the much better route is to have a PA to MD/DO bridge that makes sense and takes full advantage of our experience and education (this is being discussed in several other threads).  The other option is that the AAPA must begin taking hospitals and other employers to task for posting jobs only for NPs.  Personally I have never run into this issue, and I know my clinic much prefers PAs, but there aren't enough to go around so they often hire NPs simply because the PAs are already established in good jobs.  Others are claiming NPs are literally taking their jobs.  If this is true then it must be handled with swift action...unfortunately our governing body believes that swift is somewhere between 20-30 years.

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1 hour ago, mgriffiths said:

"Doctor: a qualified medical practitioner; a physician; someone who holds a doctorate"

We can split hairs and focus on the beginning of the definition or we can take the "complete sense of the word" and understand that doctor = physician (in the medical world).  Unfortunately there are many that have pushed to make themselves feel more important than they are and introduce themselves as Doctor Smith (DPT, DNP, DNS ,etc, etc, etc.).  Even worse is that many fall for this crockery.  And worst of all is that it creates significant confusion for patients.

To push to make a PA the equivalent of a physician is wrong.  We are not equivalent.  Does that mean we are bad medical providers or shouldn't be able to have some level of autonomy?  OF COURSE  NOT!

In my opinion, the much better route is to have a PA to MD/DO bridge that makes sense and takes full advantage of our experience and education (this is being discussed in several other threads).  The other option is that the AAPA must begin taking hospitals and other employers to task for posting jobs only for NPs.  Personally I have never run into this issue, and I know my clinic much prefers PAs, but there aren't enough to go around so they often hire NPs simply because the PAs are already established in good jobs.  Others are claiming NPs are literally taking their jobs.  If this is true then it must be handled with swift action...unfortunately our governing body believes that swift is somewhere between 20-30 years.

I am not sure Elpatodog is saying we should call ourselves "doctor", but to fight forward as the NPs are doing. Please correct me if I am wrong Elpatodog, but I agree we MUST move our profession forward as the NPs are doing. 

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Guest Elpatodog

I am not calling us doctors I was using the broad sense of the word to take care of patients. My maIn point seems to be missed. Just saying that NP’s are doing a great job at advancing themselves and that maybe we could learn from them.

 

Again not intending to call any of us doctors. Just looking at the bigger picture of how we can advance ourselves. I didn’t think this was a conversation about titles.

 

By the way I am very proud to be a PA-C and have always represented myself as such and have always corrected patients if they call me a Doctor.

 

Please look at what this conversation was actually talking about and sorry if I ruffled anyone feathers.

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Guest Elpatodog

I wish we would all ban together as PA’s and not just through our national organization but in every city and county and communicate more with local and nationwide colleagues. 

We seriously need to just do something. In my 15 plus years I have seen a trend and in my opinion I just feel we are not as strong. We could start on this forum and throw around ideas. Heck anything would be good.

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Guest Elpatodog

Just some info I would like everyone to know.

I applied for a position (in the last week) in Cardiology at Southern Illinois University (SIU) Springfield Illinois.

So I decided to follow up with a call in regards to my online application. So the person in charge told me that they don't utilize Physician Assistants because of the billing issues and the only way they would consider us is for a surgical position.  

SIU has a PA program and this mind set continues to happen. 

This is just an example of one of the things we need to change. 

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12 hours ago, Elpatodog said:

So the person in charge told me that they don't utilize Physician Assistants because of the billing issues and the only way they would consider us is for a surgical position.  

SIU has a PA program and this mind set continues to happen. 

This is just an example of one of the things we need to change. 

Absolutely agree, but this has nothing to do with pushing for independent PA practice, or chasing the ridiculousness of the NPs.  This should be the state PA association, with support of the AAPA, fighting to change said billing issues.

Unfortunately the AAPA has often been too busy chasing social justice reforms instead of fighting for things like this.

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Outside looking in guy - are you actually required to belong to AAPA to do your job?  Here, our membership in CAPA is required to maintain our certification (still figuring that one out - the PACCC [our NCCPA] in theory should be separate and accreditation by one shouldn't be dependant on membership with the other, but that's something else altogether)...in fact, no CAPA Number, no write national exam.  If not, more people need to either make their own association like PAFT and push for it as something that should be legally recognized as AN/THE association that represents PA's (or whatever the new title will be) the way PA's want to be represented.  I'm kind of lucky here, as the CAPA president is a buddy of mine and the number of practicing PA's in Canada is minuscule compared to the US - if one of us sneezes, many of us get sprayed.  Maybe new/newer associations need to push the legislative envelope on your behalf as well, if the people elected to lead the profession aren't up to par.  But, if you don't belong and you don't vote, much like those that spoil a ballot or plain don't vote in civic/provincial/state/national elections, you really don't have a right to bitch/snivel/complain about what the result is.

Again, outside looking in...though truth be told, I have two CAPA numbers - I was a non-PA member when it was first formed, then left for awhile before coming back to the fold to write my exam...and I've participated as much as possible since then, even running for regional chapter president in last year's elections.  If you don't try though, the answer will always be the bird...and sometimes regret.

SK

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Guest HanSolo

Any non-physician that calls themselves a doctor in a clinical settting is just insecure.   It’s clearly become pervasive across many disciplines. I can only hope we don’t get to that point because then we’ve lost all integrity.

Respect gets respect. Don’t try to be something you’re not. 

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