The Benefits of Changing our Title -- The Time is NOW!

[ProSpectre]

20 hours ago, EMEDPA said:

6500 FOLKS signed the petition(not survey) in 3 months. the year before PAFT was founded. the folks circulating the petition became the founding board members of PAFT. AAPA did a survey with something like 48% for, 35% against, and the rest undecided, which they spun as " a majority did not favor name change" because a "majority" said no or didn't know. bad use of stats...

I think that those that are undecided should not factor into the decision when almost half of respondents advocated for a change. If the title change is heartily opposed, fine, but indecision or apathy does not equal opposition.  

How long ago was this petition done? I would be curious to see the results of a widely disseminated survey from AAPA (or similar organization) that covers this issue today. 

[Cideous]

On 1/2/2018 at 10:26 AM, Dichotomy said:

Great discussion. I'm glad we are all engage in this cause. After all, it is our duty to be proactive and fight for our rights and the future of our profession. 

Here is my take on this.

1. All PA programs shall now be the standard "more or less 27 months" + 1 year residency like the Lynchburg model,

I believe the added residency requirement will bring about 2 major changes to our profession and degree. First, It will definitely highlight the superiority......

 

And there it is..........

I believe the PA profession is moving hard and fast in this direction.  At some point it will force PA's out for 10 years to go back and do a residency just to be competitive in the job market.  Blah.

 

On the name change...here we are again.  Lots of complaints, lots of stories and a survey or two.  Yet, like the last 25 years, nothing gets done about it.  This is why those of us 20+ year folks like me hold little to no hope of the profession ever actually changing its name.  This is why NP's blaze right past us.  Apathy = Slow profession suicide  

[TrekkieByDay]

Since a "full" doctor is MD, we could be "MM" for Medical Masters or Masters of Medicine

We already have "paramedic," for "around" the doctor. Maybe we could be "InfraMedics" or "InterMedics" since we fill in the gaps.

My husband was a professor for years, with names like "Assistant, Associate, and Full." At least until the name changes, that's one way we could explain the difference to people. 

Yesterday, when I told my kids I was going back to school, I explained, "PA is like an 'Under-Doctor' where you can do everything the doctor does except surgery and open your own office."  My nine year old understood this, but dadgum GOOGLE keeps lumping us in with medical assistant and office aides. /headdesk 

[camoman1234]

26 minutes ago, TrekkieByDay said:

Since a "full" doctor is MD, we could be "MM" for Medical Masters or Masters of Medicine

We already have "paramedic," for "around" the doctor. Maybe we could be "InfraMedics" or "InterMedics" since we fill in the gaps.

My husband was a professor for years, with names like "Assistant, Associate, and Full." At least until the name changes, that's one way we could explain the difference to people. 

Yesterday, when I told my kids I was going back to school, I explained, "PA is like an 'Under-Doctor' where you can do everything the doctor does except surgery and open your own office."  My nine year old understood this, but dadgum GOOGLE keeps lumping us in with medical assistant and office aides. /headdesk 

We are not under-doctors, we practice in collaboration with a physician to take care of the same patient. Also, there are numerous PAs that have their own practice. I know a few that work within my same organization that have their own practice, but continue to use our company to bill their claims. The practice I work at is owned by a business owner and a D.O., the business owner also owns several other clinics, urgent cares, billing/coding company, and ultrasound company. The PAs that bought out some of the clinics still use his billing/coding company which is mainly for rural health clinics.  

[wdtpac]

We are not under-doctors, though I will admit it is very difficult to fully explain our profession to children.  We can and do own our own practices (I have 4 clinics, employ 2 physicians and 3 PAs and have support staff equalling 15 FTEs; been doing it for 8 years), depending on the state in which you practice (unless you own an RHC or FQHC as you are federally protected to own these entities).  I agree with camoman that we do collaborate with physicians, but not necessarily the same patient.  We have our own patient panels and see them exclusively.  Our collaboration constitutes whatever the state board deems a requirement for "supervision". 

[TrekkieByDay]

My apologies--I'm very new to this (only within the last week have I settled that I'm actually pursuing this) and I misunderstood the regulations in my state. http://scopeofpracticepolicy.org/states/md/ That's amazing that owning a practice could be in my future, and I'm glad to hear it worked out so well for you!!! 

I would like some type of recognition of an advanced degree in the PA name, though. So many professionals are called "counselors/therapists" when their qualifications could range from LCSW all the way to a PhD, and the naming does them a disservice too. 

[camoman1234]

57 minutes ago, wdtpac said:

We are not under-doctors, though I will admit it is very difficult to fully explain our profession to children.  We can and do own our own practices (I have 4 clinics, employ 2 physicians and 3 PAs and have support staff equalling 15 FTEs; been doing it for 8 years), depending on the state in which you practice (unless you own an RHC or FQHC as you are federally protected to own these entities).  I agree with camoman that we do collaborate with physicians, but not necessarily the same patient.  We have our own patient panels and see them exclusively.  Our collaboration constitutes whatever the state board deems a requirement for "supervision". 

I have my own panel of patients, I just meant we are taking care of all patients when I said "the same patient." We as PAs do not just see the "easy" patients, but the same type of patients as the doc does. My CP comes into the clinic 4 hours every other Tuesday.  

[corpsman89]

On 1/4/2018 at 10:34 AM, TrekkieByDay said:

Since a "full" doctor is MD, we could be "MM" for Medical Masters or Masters of Medicine

We already have "paramedic," for "around" the doctor. Maybe we could be "InfraMedics" or "InterMedics" since we fill in the gaps.

My husband was a professor for years, with names like "Assistant, Associate, and Full." At least until the name changes, that's one way we could explain the difference to people. 

Yesterday, when I told my kids I was going back to school, I explained, "PA is like an 'Under-Doctor' where you can do everything the doctor does except surgery and open your own office."  My nine year old understood this, but dadgum GOOGLE keeps lumping us in with medical assistant and office aides. /headdesk 

Medical Masters? Masters of Medicine? No.... Sorry, but No. 

Physician Associate is the obvious choice, and probably has the highest chance of passing. Medical Practitioner is still the most ideal name that I have seen thus far. It sounds good, makes sense, and is completely appropriate. Unfortunately it might be hard to persuade as its a new name and a new idea. 

All this talk about doctorates and residencies is fine and these decisions will come with time, but I really do think that the MOST important issue that PAs face right now is name recognition. It should be the next thing we tackle. After this achievement we can start tackling other issues like doctorates and residencies. 

[StevieK]

On 12/22/2017 at 4:50 PM, Marinejiujitsu said:

But what if patients start calling us the physician's associate? Hmmm.

I don't see that as a problem, Marine.  Associate suggests a collaborative relationship, regardless of the possessive contraction('s).  
 Being someone's assistant brings up much different imagery, on the order of the old "secretary" title.  People can imagine us getting coffee, and running errands. 

But it seriously looks like we'll never have a consensus in this forum.  

S.

[StevieK]

On 1/5/2018 at 5:41 PM, corpsman89 said:

Medical Masters? Masters of Medicine? No.... Sorry, but No. 

Physician Associate is the obvious choice, and probably has the highest chance of passing. Medical Practitioner is still the most ideal name that I have seen thus far. It sounds good, makes sense, and is completely appropriate. Unfortunately it might be hard to persuade as its a new name and a new idea. 

This.  
It really sums up the sensible portion of the discussion we've heard.  There is the ideal choice, and then there's the one that could actually happen. 

S.

[Marinejiujitsu]

I don't see that as a problem, Marine.  Associate suggests a collaborative relationship, regardless of the possessive contraction('s).  
 Being someone's assistant brings up much different imagery, on the order of the old "secretary" title.  People can imagine us getting coffee, and running errands. 
But it seriously looks like we'll never have a consensus in this forum.  
S.

You do have my vote for physician associate but when we deal with the public and a lot of egotistical docs we are going to be owned by someone. Lol. But MD/DOs also feel they are owned by the hospital management team.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

[NEQuadrant]

I agree with what was previously said that Medical Practitioner, when abbreviated, sounds extremely close to NP, especially if you're saying it quickly or the person is hard of hearing.

Perhaps something like Medical Extender? I've heard the term extender come up when referring to PA's and NP's and I think it does address what our scope has become lately, extending access to medicine. I know it comes close to ME in terms of medical examiner and mechanical engineer, but I don't think people use that abbreviation frequently. 

[ProSpectre]

46 minutes ago, NEQuadrant said:

I agree with what was previously said that Medical Practitioner, when abbreviated, sounds extremely close to NP, especially if you're saying it quickly or the person is hard of hearing.

Perhaps something like Medical Extender? I've heard the term extender come up when referring to PA's and NP's and I think it does address what our scope has become lately, extending access to medicine. I know it comes close to ME in terms of medical examiner and mechanical engineer, but I don't think people use that abbreviation frequently. 

I don't think having our initials sound like NP is an issue. Medical Practitioner is the name that's most descriptive of what PAs are and do. NPs currently are way ahead on gaining independent practice (leading to them being preferentially hired in many areas and hospital systems), and our profession needs to get on the ball with this is well. While I don't like being lumped in with NPs, it unfortunately happens commonly in many health care settings anyway (as being APPs, or midlevels). Having initials that sound similar or completely different isn't going to change that, but having a name that is descriptive of what the profession actually has become will allow us to continue to grow into the future, and compete with NPs in the areas they are currently dominating.  

Physician Associate works as well, but Medical Practitioner is better. Either way, it is only one small component of how the profession needs to change and evolve moving forward. 

[corpsman89]

On 1/19/2018 at 7:56 PM, NEQuadrant said:

I agree with what was previously said that Medical Practitioner, when abbreviated, sounds extremely close to NP, especially if you're saying it quickly or the person is hard of hearing.

Perhaps something like Medical Extender? I've heard the term extender come up when referring to PA's and NP's and I think it does address what our scope has become lately, extending access to medicine. I know it comes close to ME in terms of medical examiner and mechanical engineer, but I don't think people use that abbreviation frequently. 

Again, sounding like NP is a good thing! They have accomplished a lot for their profession, and we are lumped in with them anyway, might as well embrace it. 

Also, unlike our current title--you know, the one that our own organization is ashamed to spell out on their website. We will actually be proud to say who we are, and our title does a good job at explaining what we do. We practice medicine in the medical model...I.e. Medical Practitioners, not MPs. 

 

[EMEDPA]

13 minutes ago, corpsman89 said:

Again, sounding like NP is a good thing! They have accomplished a lot for their profession, and we are lumped in with them anyway, might as well embrace it. 

Also, unlike our current title--you know, the one that our own organization is ashamed to spell out on their website. We will actually be proud to say who we are, and our title does a good job at explaining what we do. We practice medicine in the medical model...I.e. Medical Practitioners, not MPs. 

 

and if you are drunk and disorderly on a military base we can arrest you....wait...maybe not...

[PACali]

5 hours ago, corpsman89 said:

Again, sounding like NP is a good thing! They have accomplished a lot for their profession, and we are lumped in with them anyway, might as well embrace it. 

Also, unlike our current title--you know, the one that our own organization is ashamed to spell out on their website. We will actually be proud to say who we are, and our title does a good job at explaining what we do. We practice medicine in the medical model...I.e. Medical Practitioners, not MPs. 

 

I would just say Medical Practitioner. I never heard Physician introduce themselves as "Hi I am Pacali MD/DO" 

I actually think NPs will hate it. Medical Practitioner sound way more legit than "Nurse" practitioner.

I think title change to Medical Practitioner will open so many doors in management and administrative positions. How can an "assistant" be the manager or director of a department? 

[PACali]

On 12/22/2017 at 8:08 PM, Cideous said:

Physician associate is stupid.  Let's just be 100% honest, would ANYONE actually choose that name if it were not for the letters PA in it?  Of course not.  It is a stupid name that, once again, incorrectly defines what we do.  I am not an associate of a physician.  I am a practitioner of medicine.  Or Medical Practitioner.  Period.  Forget trying to marry the letters P and A to what we do.  If not, don't waste your time or money, just leave it as it is.  Physician Associate is ridiculous and the general public would laugh at us, not to mention what docs and NP's would think.  And yes, it does matter what they think, if most cases we are being hired by them.

100% agree with this post. Physician Associate is just as confusing to the general public. We might as well not change it if we going to do that. I can see most of the people on this thread like the name " Medical Practitioner" I hope PAFT is aware of that. 

As of now, according to AAPA we are just "PA." I think that is a great start, by recognizing we are not just an assistant. But this is not a long-term strategy for the profession.   

According to AAPA website 

A PA is a nationally certified and state-licensed medical professional.

PAs practice medicine on healthcare teams with physicians and other providers.

This sounds like Medical Practitioner.

 

 

 

[Dichotomy]

9 hours ago, PACali said:

100% agree with this post. Physician Associate is just as confusing to the general public. We might as well not change it if we going to do that. I can see most of the people on this thread like the name " Medical Practitioner" I hope PAFT is aware of that. 

As of now, according to AAPA we are just "PA." I think that is a great start, by recognizing we are not just an assistant. But this is not a long-term strategy for the profession.   

According to AAPA website 

A PA is a nationally certified and state-licensed medical professional.

PAs practice medicine on healthcare teams with physicians and other providers.

This sounds like Medical Practitioner.

 

 

 

I couldn't agree more. If we are going to make the change, "let's get it right". No disrespect for those here advocating for "a progressive approach" (i.e.. Use Physician Associate since it has been on the radar for a while & MP is a newer idea...), however, IMO Physician Assistant = Physician Associate = PA.

Therefore, considering what we are trying to achieve here, let the title reflect who we are & what we do thereby changing the mindset of the general population & getting the respect that is due, being proud to say I am a Medical Practitioner as opposed to the current title which, in all honesty, I am sometimes ashamed to present myself as - Not because of who I am or what this profession entails, but just because of the sounding of these 2 words: Physician Assistant. So folks, let's come together and get this done right once and for all. 

Additionally, I am not sure if the titles MD, DO, DPM, DDS, RN, NP, PT, RT... have ever gone trough what we are experiencing in this our great profession. So, I think whatever title we are proposing should be definitive and yet appropriate of our profession. #Medical Practitioners!

[lkth487]

Why not something like DMP (doctor of medical practice) or DMS (doctor of medical science), if the objective is a perceived equivalency with the DNP degree?  

[Cideous]

1 minute ago, lkth487 said:

Why not something like DMP (doctor of medical practice) or DMS (doctor of medical science), if the objective is a perceived equivalency with the DNP degree?  

I hate to be captain obvious here........but because most of us only have Masters degrees?  

[lkth487]

True but so do most NPs.  I think though if a doctorate degree is a new standard, then it would be easier in the eyes of legislatures to get the type of independance that it seems most people on this forums want.  And then the existing group can be grandfathered in. 

[SedRate]

On 12/23/2017 at 11:00 AM, LT_Oneal_PAC said:

hey, independent duty clinician, or the like, isn't a bad idea I think! rah

How about Medical Clinician, or would that seem redundant?

I wouldn't mind being called Emcee as I start the music in the OR.

[jwells78]

1 hour ago, lkth487 said:

True but so do most NPs.  I think though if a doctorate degree is a new standard, then it would be easier in the eyes of legislatures to get the type of independance that it seems most people on this forums want.  And then the existing group can be grandfathered in. 

Interesting idea-  I see the angle, yet I'm not sure I want to vote in something that may give more fuel to degree creep and potentially put those without a doctorate into a bad light.

 

Besides, havent yet met 1 doctorate level PA/NP with clinical wizardry enough to make me to go back and drop the dough---  EXCEPT

 

for EMED.  

 

But he was assembled in a lab combining the minds of multiple medical professionals and parts from a T1000, soo...

[EMEDPA]

22 hours ago, jwells78 said:

Besides, havent yet met 1 doctorate level PA/NP with clinical wizardry enough to make me to go back and drop the dough---  EXCEPTfor EMED.  But he was assembled in a lab combining the minds of multiple medical professionals and parts from a T1000, soo...

:)  when you start your new job we need to grab a beer sometime and catch up.

[mmiller3]

On 1/21/2018 at 0:20 PM, B694515 said:

This thread is beyond sad. lol

Why is that, pray tell?