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Follow up after job interview - lack of professionalism


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I have recently been interviewing for full time jobs or per diem jobs to improve my income.

 

What has transpired has me a bit baffled and I have learned from local colleagues that this seems to be the new norm.

 

I interviewed with a Community Health System that operates multiple Urgent Cares. My original application was met with a timely call to interview. The interview went quite well, in my opinion. There were 2 positions available. Office manager walks me out and says we will be in touch.

 

A colleague had interviewed with them last year - she is an MD. She didn't hear anything - no emails, nothing after an interview. I had even been contacted as her professional reference.

 

She phoned and had a hard time getting through and was told she had missed her second interview - one she never knew she had as no one had contacted her - no call, no text, no email. NOTHING. She was astonished and embarrassed. She tried to reschedule her second interview. No apologies - they made an appointment for her.  An outside medical issue arose and she couldn't take the job but she was mortified by how it had been handled.

 

Fast forward to my interview.

 

Two full weeks after the interview - I have heard NOTHING - no email, calls or texts. 

I timidly call at the 2 week mark thinking - it is time for someone to tell me what is going on.

I get a voice mail for the HR person - zero response in 3 days. I send a polite email to her mentioning my voice mail.

ZERO RESPONSE.

 

At the 3 week mark, I call and get a receptionist. She asks me to leave a voice mail. I politely say no as my first voice mail was never returned, nor my email and it has been 3 full weeks since my interview. Within 10 minutes I get a call from the HR person telling me they chose someone else but I needed to re-interview for the other location. Okay - I can do that. She says I am in the system, application complete - interview to be scheduled. 

 

I am more than qualified for this job.

 

Ten days later - NOTHING. No call, no email. I sent another email to her telling her I was ready to go for interview.

 

NOTHING.

 

Today, I decided to be a tad more bold. I know who the medical director is and I spoke with him giving my colleague her reference. I sent him a very professional email outlining my experience and professional beffudlement at not having had calls returned.

 

No lie - within 30 minutes of my email to the medical director, a voice mail appears on my phone while seeing a patient. Same HR person - she says the other Urgent Care "chose to go in another direction" "best wishes in my endeavors" "we look forward to seeing your application for other positions". 

 

In my opinion - COMPLETELY unprofessional to leave a candidate hanging for 3 full weeks without prefacing that it could take that long and then not returning or even acknowledging an email or voice mail.

 

Medical Director will not even speak to another professional in the community and suddenly, I am not the candidate they are looking for. 

 

Contacted some other colleagues in the community and this appears to be the new professional norm, regardless of organization. Don't call us - repeat DON'T CALL US - ever. We will get to you when we get to you and we will put you on the bottom of the pile if you call.

 

I have applied to at least 4 other jobs through indeed.com and other corporate (sigh) sites. ZERO responses in 10-14-21 days. Not even so much as "thank you, you are not the candidate we are looking for". 

 

Nothing - not even from the Navy Reserve. 

 

What is up? Just me? Just my gray hair? Just my region? Just the way it is now? 

 

I don't like this and don't find it professionally inspiring or acceptable.

 

Any opinions or ideas?

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Going through the same process, with the same results. I always seem to be the one making contact, being left to believe that I am possibly being considered (post interview), and then nothing.

My most recent worst experience didn't even get to the interview stage. After almost three months of getting the run around with EmCare via numerous online job sites, their own website, their recruiter for the region, and the lead recruiter in another state but, at the corporate level, I sent a cannonball right across the bow. No response of course but, this time I gave them good reason not to reply.

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I don't think this behavior has anything to do with the applicants themselves. I think there are two contributing explanations. The first is that many HR organizations are staffed by poorly educated people with little or no professional experience. I accepted a new job recently and the HR person on the phone who handled the interview and hiring process actually sounded mentally retarded. I don't say that as a slight of individuals with MR. I actually think she may have been someone with a very low IQ and marginally functional. I looked at her resume on LinkedIn. She had a degree from a College that is located in a slum part of the city where the firm is located. They only have online education. Just 2% of its matriculants graduate.  The second issue why the hiring manager won't respond is that they don't want to get sued. If they say they didn't hire you, the applicant will likely ask politely "what led you to go in a different direction." Then, if the hiring manager responds with specifics, they might open the door to getting sued. So, HR wants to control the conversation so there is no risk for liability. 

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Essentially the same.  From the look of my notes, I think between 19 to 24 people owe me some sort of response after i've done what they ask.  .  So far, I have had two responses.  

 

One facility I know for a fact has open positions they are trying to fill cannot even tell me who hires them - the facility or staffing company.  I have burned down both with calls and emails - it has been two weeks since the last response from a staffing company  promising a substantial response with whether or not a position exists.  I have never reached a live person at facility HR.  I am to the point of walking in there.  

 

So, yeah.  It's a thing.  

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I have grown tired of email, voicemails, texts and the like.....

 

nothing replaces face to face

 

 

and yes I think it is crappy now.......  we are all "just employees just like the garbage man or janitor"

 

 

Face to face..... stop in and say HI

 

 

as for not getting hired -  probably a good thing..... place sounds horrid.....

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Same exact experience from a TON of employers. One called me 3 weeks after an interview to ask if I was interested in interviewing for a completely different position. No mention of the one I had interviewed for already. I was forced to ask whether I should assume it had already been filled. Needless to say I avoided anything further with them.

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Occasionally a ball gets dropped; that's why we should follow up. If it gets dropped over and over again by the same place, it's a sign of a disorganized organization where you'd probably not want to work.

 

Generalizing bad experiences is a way to get depressed and become pessimistic enough that you stop trying. Not a good place to be.

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I have had similar experiences. I applied for a federal job (yes I know it is the government and they do things their own way) had a great interview, was basically told I had the job and then nothing....... calls not returned...emails not answered. I move on.

Three months later I get a brusque email from someone at HR telling me what documents to send to start my employment. No welcome aboard...we are happy to have you...just a washing list going back to my conception of paperwork they need. I basically laughed and told her nobody just sits around for 3 months waiting for a job to happen and I had long ago started employment with someone else.

 

Fast forward to my most recent experience. Send an email to a large system recruiter expressing interest in an open position. Get a response within an hour and we have a phone call that day. Interview 5 days later and meet 4 key players (4 different interviews...I am inexperienced in large systems and am pretty amused by the process) and have a verbal offer that afternoon and a written offer in 3 days with a start date as soon as they can get me credentialled. They fast track my credentials because they need me and shave a month off that process. New job,good money,  great bennies, wonderful people. THAT is how it should go.

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Maybe my generation is used to it but I've been "ghosted" by many potential employers. My dad always told me that if you dont hear back in a week, just call them. No harm in being assertive. But if I was getting ignored like that I would forget them after the first strike. I developed a similar standard when I was dating: if a girl didnt follow-up or respond to me after a date (assuming it went well) I'd message her one time. If her response was delayed or never came---on to the next. Interested people call you back.

 

Two examples from my life: 

 

1. My current employer followed up within 48 hours of each of 3 interviews, and said they would. Formal offer 1 day after the final interview. Professional.

 

2. When my wife and I were dating she never ignored any of my tests, always followed up positively after every date, and never went out of touch. Still to this day she answers every text and call or explains if she is delayed. 

 

If you have to question whether or not a party is interested in you or respects your time, the answer is always no.

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Agree with Bruce- every job offer I have applied for as an EMPA I got an answer at the time of the interview. Most of my recent jobs I have actually been scouted and didn't even interview. someone who knew me talked to the right folks and I got a phone call asking if I was interested in working for them.

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I am running out of options in our town. Corporate control and one in the middle of a buy out that won't be complete for several months - hiring freeze - a good change but I will have to wait.

 

The other corporate I have worked for and have interviewed for other jobs with them but they suddenly have made an offer to someone else when I interview.

 

Not much left as far as employers. They know this and get away with being unprofessional because they know we are trapped. 

 

Moving is not really a viable option with kids in school and my husband's job right now. 

 

I feel like I am too old, too qualified or somehow I must ask too many questions and not be a good little drone - therefore not what they want.

 

I have to work, I need to work. My current situation is not great but, I guess, livable for now.

 

Just bites that folks don't care about professional decorum and habits because they know they are in control and options are few.

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I am running out of options in our town. Corporate control and one in the middle of a buy out that won't be complete for several months - hiring freeze - a good change but I will have to wait.

 

The other corporate I have worked for and have interviewed for other jobs with them but they suddenly have made an offer to someone else when I interview.

 

Not much left as far as employers. They know this and get away with being unprofessional because they know we are trapped.

 

Moving is not really a viable option with kids in school and my husband's job right now.

 

I feel like I am too old, too qualified or somehow I must ask too many questions and not be a good little drone - therefore not what they want.

 

I have to work, I need to work. My current situation is not great but, I guess, livable for now.

 

Just bites that folks don't care about professional decorum and habits because they know they are in control and options are few.

Sorry to hear about all of that. Any networking options?

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Yes, it's the same everywhere.  I worked for an UC/FP practice full and part time for 5 years.  They changed hands and closed for a while to renovate.  New management contacted me about weekend work, and I responded affirmatively.  No answer to that email.  No answer to subsequent phone calls.  They recruited me, but didn't respond when I moved forward with the request.  I said the he&& with it and am enjoying having weekends off for the first time since 2011.

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Sorry to hear about all of that. Any networking options?

 

 

I have networked a ton. I know almost everyone in town. Specialists like me but no jobs right now. 

 

Jobs are actually a bit scarce overall right now.

 

The buyout of the one corporate might change some things for the better for all levels of employees and perhaps clean out the limiting factors for once.

 

One contract job for a correctional facility made the news for letting patients dwindle and have bad outcomes - not a great option for employment. No one wants to work for them and the lawsuits will abound.  The other options are a sketchy pain clinic system - the reboot of Seattle Pain and its holdouts who did not lose their licenses. I cannot see becoming a pill pusher unless I actually don't have a job and then all pickiness goes overboard. 

 

The VA here isn't hiring PAs really at all and has some bizarre salary cap for ALL PA positions of $93K regardless of experience, specialty, etc. I have an insider there at the VA in a position of power who can't figure this one out or how to get around it. They still can't fill positions and their ER is still not open 24/7 - three years after a massive investigation.

 

One position for interventional radiology that I am truly not qualified for unless someone wants to teach me - I haven't tapped a baby in 18 years and I have never done some of the procedures. Could be interesting but definitely not plug and play for me. 

 

Several jobs say NP ONLY and one highlights that the docs PREFER (yes, in all caps) an NP over a PA - great advertising - very encouraging. Also a one hour commute. 

 

So, the world is small here and the jobs not bountiful. The HR folks are not professional or even really kind.

 

Another vote for me to look at opening my own clinic - a walk in neighborhood minor care. Never done it before. Would need capital, a doc and to do a huge amount of homework. I know where the clinic is needed and have talked it up with some local colleagues and lay people who live in the area - all think it is a great idea but what else would they say?...

 

Lottery tickets aren't working - so, gotta do something. I can stay where I am now but knowing I am not getting paid enough for what I do tends to leave a mark after a while. Having a job is better than no job.....most days.

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Traveling position? Week on, two off?

 

Maybe 12 hour or 24 hour ER shifts in a CAH

 

Look in next closest major city for a 3x12 position - hospitalist?

 

Contact locums recruiter - NEVER as 1099 BTW - employee, big bucks only....

 

Think outside the 9-5 box

 

I am in corrections now, and have a great supportive environment, but we are one of only 300 facilities (out of 4500) nationwide wide with triple certification, and have excellent staff...... surprising......

 

Admin in local hospital

 

Legal medicine

 

Urgent care in a big city - work 2x12 on weekend and ask for 40 hours pay?

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I have networked a ton. I know almost everyone in town. Specialists like me but no jobs right now.

 

Jobs are actually a bit scarce overall right now.

 

The buyout of the one corporate might change some things for the better for all levels of employees and perhaps clean out the limiting factors for once.

 

One contract job for a correctional facility made the news for letting patients dwindle and have bad outcomes - not a great option for employment. No one wants to work for them and the lawsuits will abound. The other options are a sketchy pain clinic system - the reboot of Seattle Pain and its holdouts who did not lose their licenses. I cannot see becoming a pill pusher unless I actually don't have a job and then all pickiness goes overboard.

 

The VA here isn't hiring PAs really at all and has some bizarre salary cap for ALL PA positions of $93K regardless of experience, specialty, etc. I have an insider there at the VA in a position of power who can't figure this one out or how to get around it. They still can't fill positions and their ER is still not open 24/7 - three years after a massive investigation.

 

One position for interventional radiology that I am truly not qualified for unless someone wants to teach me - I haven't tapped a baby in 18 years and I have never done some of the procedures. Could be interesting but definitely not plug and play for me.

 

Several jobs say NP ONLY and one highlights that the docs PREFER (yes, in all caps) an NP over a PA - great advertising - very encouraging. Also a one hour commute.

 

So, the world is small here and the jobs not bountiful. The HR folks are not professional or even really kind.

 

Another vote for me to look at opening my own clinic - a walk in neighborhood minor care. Never done it before. Would need capital, a doc and to do a huge amount of homework. I know where the clinic is needed and have talked it up with some local colleagues and lay people who live in the area - all think it is a great idea but what else would they say?...

 

Lottery tickets aren't working - so, gotta do something. I can stay where I am now but knowing I am not getting paid enough for what I do tends to leave a mark after a while. Having a job is better than no job.....most days.

Any psych options? I know a couple colleagues that make big bucks.

 

Also, to second ventana, hospitalist or traveling options?

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I think, in general, working in HR is a terrible job.  Also, you hold a lot of power over people - and answer to damn near no one.  When you deal with the public at large, and answer to no one and have no one to please, you don't treat the public very nicely.

 

This is one of those 'race to the bottom' scenarios.  Customer service is generally a waste of time and money when your competitor has terrible customer service.  Same goes for HR departments.  A polite HR department is a waste of resources when everyone else has an impolite one.

 

There is a hospital local to me with a terrible bunch of losers running the HR.  Half the hospital is staffed by traveling nurses in a city of 6mil and over FIVE nursing schools.  Makes no sense.  Hospital is dead broke.

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Regarding Federal jobs, YES do not expect anything resembling a timely response.  One does not apply for a Federal job and not have something else on the side.  Few years ago I was unemployed and had been looking (not a PA) and the Federal process is looooong and very cumbersome.  If you think civilian HR is bad then don't even bother with the Fed!  I started in one agency and October of last year transferred to another.  That wasn't any smoother and I'm already in the Federal government.  Some agencies have their acts together but those are the exception.

The civilian jobs I applied to I never heard back from.  I called, emailed, even sent a letter snail-mail...  Hiring agencies or whatever they're called suck as well!  They love to get you in take a battery of tests (typing, grammar, math...) and get your resume/CV but all of that is merely to have a certain number of "ready applicants" to show companies...not that they ever use them.  They then come in as their HR firm...  

Sorry I cannot offer any advice.  I do know that the Navy Reserve does not respond to emails.  I just went down to the recruiters office after I got tired of waiting.  Even then only if you have all your ducks in a row do they even bother giving you the time of day.  I guess I would advise to look into the U.S. Public Health Service.  The process takes a year but if you're able to get in I hear it's a good deal.

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Unfortunately, I don't think it is horribly uncommon to hear crickets after applying for a position.  There have been many times I applied for positions and heard nothing back. Same story with friends/coworkers.  To that effect, I would recommend having someone look over your resume.  When I was ignored, I adjusted my resume and immediately started getting calls for interviews.  I have never been ignored and led on after an interview though.  Frankly, it sounds like you're better off.  The fact that this happened with a friend of yours at the same place suggests it's their problem not yours.  If you continue to have problems after interviews, I'd do some self examination to make sure you're not doing anything strange during the interviews.  Best of luck!

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I find it easier to just bypass HR.

 

Like was said in an earlier post- face to face.

 

This may be uncouth, but I find it easier to make an impression to just call the program manager directly or just stop in all dressed and ready to impress and go right to the source (program director/ect).

 

HR scurries a lot faster when an Attending hands them your CV and says "make it happen."

 

Face to face. Much better. Settle for no less.

 

If you don't get a call back after a face to face, suck it up and drive on. In the end they don't "owe" us anything, so don't take it personally.

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The access to the head honchos is awfully protected around here. No published phone numbers. Don't know where their offices are and they are heavily shielded to avoid having to talk to the peasants.

 

I bypassed HR in one place and was shut down as they see that as too forward and bossy - makes you a rebel and outlier who doesn't follow the hierarchy. Not someone likely to be a good little drone.

 

So, I completely agree but haven't been able to get to these people and the doc employees don't make decisions anyway.

 

One FP doc a few years ago hand carried my resume to her staff meeting and said "this is who I want". They told her they would only hire NPs and promptly trashed my resume - EVEN THOUGH I ALREADY WORKED THERE IN A DIFFERENT DEPARTMENT. She was told it wasn't her decision even though she is the doc who needed help with a huge panel. She left shortly after. Had a team of suits outside her rooms with a stop watch trying to tell her how to be more efficient. She had the BEST stupid Press Ganey scores and patients loved her and she was smart to boot. So, nothing of quality really mattered to them.

 

So, the political nature of where I live is still a limiting factor and I CHOOSE to not move because of my family. Folks can tell me all day that moving is the only option but you don't walk in my shoes.

 

So, I have to deal with what I have to deal with. Thus, the idea of my own walk-in cash minor care as a way to make a living and bypass the political corporate BS.

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There are pluses and minuses to having your own clinic. The cash concept is,IMHO, a good one if the climate in your area is right for it and the patients are liable to come. Because you won't be taking insurance (most particularly Medicare)  you can avoid mountains of regulatory nonsense and keep the BS to a minimum. Want to  paper chart? You can.  Don't want to pay a shredding company? You don't have to. The number of agencies that can walk in and annoy you is very very small.

The downside (having just folded my clinic a few months back) is you may not be able to make enough to pay your bills. I had a good plan in an area where I was already well known with tons of support and I basically ran out of money after almost a year. I was NOT a cash clinic but being a rural area with lots of Medicaid and Medicare I didn't have much confidence in a cash practice.

Do your homework, plan all the worst case scenarios, and if you see the possibilities are good go for it! Luck favors the prepared. Good luck!

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I feel like the entire professional world is degrading and losing professionalism, tact, courtesy and common decency, politeness. As a result, we treat folks as cogs and parts and easily disposable or replaceable.

 

Email, texting and technology are cumulative culprits that have weakened our interpersonal communication skills.

 

My personal and professional goals would be to not lose common decency, tact, etc and continue to exhibit communication skills beyond a keyboard.

 

At this point in my career it might not do much good but I don't want my kids to witness me acting otherwise. There has to be hope that people can be nice to one another.......

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