OR PA?

[Desiree84b]

I'm in a major dilemma. I am currently a surgical PA in General Surgery. Due to low productivity by our surgeons they are trying to transfer me to the OR. I will be only in the OR assisting. Is this right? They even said I would need to clean rooms! I am pretty sure they are breaching my contract as a PA. What should I do?!

[JtheWorker]

Have you done any first assisting so far as a PA in gen surg? This is typically a major component of someone in your position, along with seeing patients in clinic (a lot of post ops.) I believe many OR PAs would not mind doing full time assisting. Others would miss the clinic. Decide where you fall in this spectrum. Also, 3 things:

 

1) You should not be cleaning rooms. There should be an OR staff that does this.

2) Only way to check if this breaches your contract is to read your contract. No one hear can tell you one way or another. 

3) Are there other PAs in the group? How many surgeons?

[andersenpa]

Agree that you will not (will not, not should not) clean rooms. I would leave a job on this basis alone.

I've seen the opposite situation before where the surgeons volume is down so they put the PAs seeing postops and routine visits so surgeons can focus on consults and generating new cases.

 

As a surgical PA it is valuable to have operative and perioperative experience. This is good cross training for you, unless you have already had your share of OR and want to focus only on clinic.

[Febrifuge]

I'm not sure I follow. If you are a Surgery PA, why would going to the OR be a transfer situation? A surgical PA should be spending something like 50% of their time in the OR anyway, or else they're basically a post-op or surgery clinic PA. Maybe a wound-check PA.

[Desiree84b]

Thank you for input! I have been working in General Surgery for 5 years. I assist, round, see hospital consults and have a post op clinic. We have 3 surgeons and 1 other PA. She is staying in her current position. I work with a slower surgeon. He sees half the amount of patients the other 2 surgeons see. So it boils down to my productivity and budget for the hospital. I asked them for a new job description. They wanted me to sign the "surgical assistant" job duty contract.

[Desiree84b]

I would be spending 100% of my time in the OR.

[CorpsmanUP]

Leave.  You are a PA, not a surgical tech.  That the hospital even thinks you are interchangeable is ridiculous.

[KMD16]

Something doesn't smell right.

 

Low volume...meaning, you're not profitable, thus, your employer either are losing money or aren't earning enough off of you to keep you.

 

It sound like this is an attempt to show you the door. Oh by the way. You we've decided to amend your job description as a PA to include cleaning after the surgeon.

 

Find another position my friend!

[greenmood]

Ugh. Come on.

 

SA is a totally different job and training. It sounds like they are trying to "demote" you, but I'm not even sure they could legally hire a PA to fill an SA position. Maybe?

[andersenpa]

This is not as bad as some of you are saying; it is not a downgrade as a PA, it is simply a matter of taking a role as a first assist, that can also be performed by SAs or RNFAs.

There are MANY PAs that work 100% OR, and they are not any less of a PA.

You will lose some patient management skills of course, but that is the tradeoff.

 

The "cleaning the room" situation is a completely different matter.

 

The loss for the practice is that you have high value skills in your ability to practice medicine outside the OR, and they would be losing that productivity.

 

If you are only working with 1 surgeon you should train to work with all of them to make yourself more versatile, if that's an option.

[greenmood]

Not intending to imply that a PA doing first-assist is "less" of a PA. 100% OR time would be pretty great in the right circumstances.

 

But I can't think why a place would try to contract a PA as an SA (instead of a PA with first assist duties) unless they were trying to get away with something. Either paying less or restricting autonomy, or something. Also, our SAs here certainly do not clean operating rooms. I have no idea why that would be in the contract either.

[Desiree84b]

I just met with the director and I was given a choice to take the full time OR position with required duties of mopping, preparing carts and getting the rooms ready or to leave it. Ridiculous! I guess I will start the search for a job. Thanks for all of your advice.

[thinkertdm]

What was your response?  How did you leave it? 

[Desiree84b]

I told them that's not proper utilization of a PA and that I would not agree to have that added to my job description. He said then there was no position for me.

[Guest Paula]

Then you should be eligible for unemployment compensation  while you search for another job. 

[Walkoffshot]

Wow, that is completely ridiculous.

 

First, I thought what you meant by "cleaning rooms" was that you would just help flip them for the next patient. That is understandable to an extent (as long as there is nothing more productive you could be doing... Seeing patients between cases or charting etc). Then They drop the hammer and state and you are REQUIRED to mop? What the frick? I would have laughed in there face, threw the contract in the air and walked out with my 3rd phalanx up.

 

I help flip all of the time. That includes some cleaning if I have time. It's my own doing because I like to help, not because I am required. I do it because we usually have 2 rooms and we get in and out quicker. Means less time in the OR and more effective use of our time... Or more leisure. This does not supercede patients in the office or charting.

 

Blow that Popsicle stand.

[KMD16]

I told them that's not proper utilization of a PA and that I would not agree to have that added to my job description. He said then there was no position for me.

I smell this coming! See post #8.

 

 

[andersenpa]

I told them that's not proper utilization of a PA and that I would not agree to have that added to my job description. He said then there was no position for me.

If this post is legit you need to report this to your state chapter and the AAPA. They need to know whats going on in your state. 

Don't let his perpetuate to another victim.

[CAAdmission]

Is this a privately owned surgicenter or something like that?

[Delbert]

One major difference between the two professions is the type of education required. Whereas physician assistants qualify through a more general medical examination, called the PANCE, and are not required to complete a residency

[PA-S LP]

I am working with a surgical PA that ONLY works in the OR. Zero patient interaction except maybe introduction in pre op. She loves it because she enjoys the surgical part of surgery but not the clinic part which I get.

 

But she does not and should not clean rooms. That should be the job of EVS, and if they are low in volume, nurses and techs should help out.