david89 Posted April 24, 2015 Share Posted April 24, 2015 Hello all, please share you thought on this preliminary offer for a new grad...thank you very much these are some of the things they told me over the phone at the end of the phone interview. now i'm just waiting for the initial contract to send to me. and i'll counter for sure lol. starting salary: $90,000 with bonus structure (still unsure how it structured) vacation/pto/sick/cme: 10 days and $500 for cme (not happy with this at all) holidays: 7 holidays (unsure paid or not) 401k: after 1 year, they will automatic put in 5% and I don't even have to put in 5% physician on site 100% malpractice: cover, but did not mention any tail. i asked but they said even if i leave the practice and theres a lawsuit, i'm still covered (sounds like tail coverage to me, unless i need to look up what tail coverage really is lol) patient load: 3-6 pt per hour bc they do 50% urgent care ( but still too much?) ON CALL: couples time per week insurance: they mentioned but forgot to clearify it with them :/ 2 years contract: after signed contracted, i'm not allow to work anywhere else during that time. hours: 40 hours per week (available shift 8 hr, 10hr, 12hr), able to pick extra shift. if i pick extra shifts, i forgot to ask if that would be paid as overtime or not. but usually it should right? license: Not covered or reimbursed (not happy with this) please let know how i should counter offer them and what other factors i'm missing thank you very much Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenmood Posted May 1, 2015 Share Posted May 1, 2015 Is this a large practice or a smaller office? I'm not the best person to answer this... 90K for new grad family medicine sounds pretty good to me. I would argue against the moonlighting ban. CME days should be separate from PTO. You should be getting at least three weeks of PTO plus a few days of CME. Ask if CME days are fully paid, and what the approval process is. $500 will cover registration for one conference, so what about travel, lodging, meals, etc? Salaried employees are rarely, if ever, paid overtime. I'm not sure what compensation they are considering if they are offering you extra shifts as a positive thing and not requiring them without pay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david89 Posted May 1, 2015 Author Share Posted May 1, 2015 thank you for your response. this is in california and they have 4 clinics around the areas. and thank you for your suggestions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator rev ronin Posted May 2, 2015 Administrator Share Posted May 2, 2015 Terrible deal. I wouldn't even bother negotiating with an offer like that on the table--they're looking to use you up and spit you out, hence the contract limitation on moonlighting and non-compete, which probably isn't even legal in California. They are not investing in developing you into a long-term provider, they're luring you in with a shiny high base number and essentially nothing else up to market. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator ventana Posted May 2, 2015 Moderator Share Posted May 2, 2015 Without going into details this is a horrible awful, 3 to 6 patients per hour is unreasonable, they're profiting from you in a huge way in going to burn you out. I would never sign a contract which restricts me from working somewhere else, nor would I sign anything with a noncompete clause. If they demanded that I sign this I would say they needed to purchase that from me, at the rate of $50,000 per year. There has to be some consideration for a noncompete to be valid. I honestly would walk away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
treejay Posted May 5, 2015 Share Posted May 5, 2015 6 patients per hour way too much for a new grad even 3 patients per hour too much for a new grad (let alone 6, ha!) 10 PTO days super crappy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david89 Posted May 9, 2015 Author Share Posted May 9, 2015 thank you everyone...i'll walk on this offer lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Paula Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 I'm curious.....did you first counter offer with some of the suggestions given here? What did they say? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator rev ronin Posted May 9, 2015 Administrator Share Posted May 9, 2015 I'm curious.....did you first counter offer with some of the suggestions given here? What did they say? There's a reason I specifically advised him not to: the offer is so insultingly unreasonable that it's clearly a waste of the OP's time to negotiate, and that the best thing he can do is send a loud and clear message that it's so ridiculous it's not a legitimate offer at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david89 Posted May 9, 2015 Author Share Posted May 9, 2015 when they first told me the 10 days for cme/vacation/pto with just $500 all together, i was pretty insulted by that and was going to negotiate. but now reading more about this whole non-compete clause thing, i guess i won't even bother with the renegotiation lol thank you every one for the inputs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
david89 Posted May 9, 2015 Author Share Posted May 9, 2015 i have a follow up question. is there a proper method to turn them down professionally? or do i just mention stuffs like " oohh,, ur benefits are very below the national level and if i take on ur contract i am doing a disservice to my profession?" is that too blunt and unprofessional? lol thank you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator rev ronin Posted May 9, 2015 Administrator Share Posted May 9, 2015 I'd say something along the lines of "You're obviously looking for an entirely different sort of employee, so I won't waste your time replying with a counteroffer." Alternatively, you could add "... or your HR department is completely out of touch with current market compensation, and this undermines my confidence that I would be treated equitably by your practice." When in doubt, you could just leave them hanging, and if they ever call you back, say "Offer? I never received one..." :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
loliz Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 It could only help the next person for you to be more constructive in your decline of the offer... maybe say something like what Rev Ronin said above, but add in the specifics i.e.. won't waste your time with a counter offer since the non compete clause, low PTO and CME are unacceptable for a professional contract. May not help you at all, but it doesn't hurt to tell a company why their offer is unacceptable so that the adjustments can be made along the way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbrothers98 Posted May 9, 2015 Share Posted May 9, 2015 If you have plenty of offers to choose from but like this place, take everything from your best offer and insert into this offer. Send it back to them and see if they respond. There are reasons for low ball offers, some because of ignorance, some due to other reasons. I think it is professional to provide an answer to every offer because that is what you are, a professional. When you lay out what a professional expects, you differentiate yourself (and our profession) from the rest. I also suggest since you had some elements of your offer that you were not clear on afterwards, that you develop a checklist to refer to in the future. This can save you from making a bad decision in the future if you have a clearer picture and can make an unbiased and logical decision. Some of what you list are just as important as time off or base salary. For example, health insurance. I have seen offers where there is a tremendous range of coverage and expected contributions. You may get all the things you want and then realize at the first paycheck that you are contributing hundreds of dollars of income to health insurance every month that you thought were going into your pocket. I also think that most places dont care one bit what you think of their offer. A quick thank you but no thanks can suffice. If they take the time to ask why, a very factual response is fine ie the median salary in this specialty and in this area is x amount, this offer is y percentage below that standard. Good luck G Brothers PA-C Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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