sscheinfe Posted March 11, 2015 So, before PA school, I was an EMT for many years....as PA, I have only worked in cardiac diagnostics, and thus far I have not been able to find any work in my chosen field (ER) due to, you guessed it, lack of experience. I have an interview coming up for an Urgent Care center. I'm sure, they will want to know that I can hit the ground running with minimal supervision, as we are talking about NYC here. Addmittedly, I have zerio PA experience in the field (depsite my EMS experience) and this has been the "thanks but no thanks" moment at every interview I've had so far for emergency/urgency. What is some decent way to approach this? Honesltly, I haven't diagnosed and treated a URI or sutured a cut since PA school 5 years ago, and if I was being honest, I would have to admit this...of course, honesty may not be the best policy if I intend to ever, ever break into this field. Should I try to be as...well, not lie, but tell as little of the truth as possible? Or perhaps should I offer to come in, for free, on weekends, and observe the PAs and MDs until I feel I am ready to roll? Or something else? I'm not sure of the best angle here, but I'm exhausted of the "come back when you have a few years experience" response that I implicitly get at all these places. I want to get the darn experience!! Thanks all.
db_pavnp Posted March 11, 2015 Curious what responses you get as this strikes me as a major challenge.
SoCalPA Posted March 11, 2015 Consider Hurley 10 week Trauma Fellowship. http://education.hurleymc.com/allied/trauma-advanced-practitioner-panp-fellowship/hurley-fellowship-course-outline
jmj11 Posted March 11, 2015 You know, I don't think you have to tell them things they don't ask, however, I would never try to mislead them as it will come back to haunt you. I think the best approach is to be honest about the the things they ask but be confident in what you can do and can quickly learn. I took a Urgent Care moonlighting job 15 years ago and I had not sutured in about 15 years before that. Yet, I was confident that I could step up and do a good job and it was, as they say, like riding a bike. I felt very confident from day one and compared to my day job (headache consulant at Mayo Clinic) it was a piece of cake. It temped me to go into urgent care as a career. I remember the ER director (who was a bit anal) was most concerned about my availibility and willingness to adapt to their way of doing things. Now that I'm a employer, the biggest red light for me when I intervew a perspective employee (including some PAs) is when they ask, first thing, "what's the salary." That communicates to you that they don't give a damn about the job, only the money, and will leave the second they find more money somewhere else. So, in your case, being an EMT is valuable in quck and confident decision making skills and not getting your feathers ruffled in a crisis. Pull from your cardiac experience as a plus as the last thing they would want is someone coming into the urgent care with shoulder pain, that turned out to be anginia and pending MI. Your cardiac judgement could put you ahead of others. Just my thoughts.
db_pavnp Posted March 11, 2015 I can empathize with wanting to get to the chase on salary, though. God knows how many HR departments and employers are only gunning for the cheapest and least qualified they can find. I have had two interview disasters getting strung along and along only to find an offer so low I simply walked on the spot.
cinntsp Posted March 11, 2015 It might be time to do a residency. Rather than wasting more time in fields that aren't your first choice, you could have excellent experience in 12-18 months. Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk
Moderator EMEDPA Posted March 11, 2015 Moderator Agree with Chris- there are several fine em residencies in NYC and surrounding areas...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted March 11, 2015 Moderator I can empathize with wanting to get to the chase on salary, though. God knows how many HR departments and employers are only gunning for the cheapest and least qualified they can find. I have had two interview disasters getting strung along and along only to find an offer so low I simply walked on the spot. really depends on your thought process- are you there for the job/scope of practice/autonomy or are you there for the money. at my last interview salary was never discussed. I knew I wanted the job because of the scope of practice/autonomy/etc (solo rural ER coverage) and would have worked there almost for free. I applied every year for a decade before I even got an interview. I knew they would give me a fair wage and they did (in fact, more than I expected). .
cbrsmurf Posted March 11, 2015 You should ask yourself whether you want to work in a new specialty that has little training or backup. Floundering about in a new specialty is not my idea of fun
sscheinfe Posted March 11, 2015 Author Thanks all for your replies. My thoughts: Curious what responses you get as this strikes me as a major challenge. They never give responses per se'. At the major hospitals, my application is nearly always rejected or never answered at all; the two measly interviews I have actually secured in the past three years rejected me with no comment in particular. I am fairly certain of the reason though....it's simply a matter of supply and demand. Here in NYC there is an endless stream of highly experienced PAs, so an inexperienced (in that field) PA with no personal connections (it's almost always who, not what, you know in big hospital hiring) doesn't stand a chance. Now that I'm a employer, the biggest red light for me when I intervew a perspective employee (including some PAs) is when they ask, first thing, "what's the salary." That communicates to you that they don't give a damn about the job, only the money, and will leave the second they find more money somewhere else. So, in your case, being an EMT is valuable in quck and confident decision making skills and not getting your feathers ruffled in a crisis. Pull from your cardiac experience as a plus as the last thing they would want is someone coming into the urgent care with shoulder pain, that turned out to be anginia and pending MI. Your cardiac judgement could put you ahead of others. Just my thoughts. I can and do try to stress those things. As for salary, I never ask unless they ask first, and even then, I stress I am flexible as my goal is to learn, not to make millions. It might be time to do a residency. Rather than wasting more time in fields that aren't your first choice, you could have excellent experience in 12-18 months.Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk The few residencies has extremely limited acceptance (about two students each per year), and I have tried that as well. Probably wouldn't survive financially on what they pay, but I would still try...but nop luck there either. Last one rejected me for two very-far-out-of-state candidates. really depends on your thought process- are you there for the job/scope of practice/autonomy or are you there for the money. at my last interview salary was never discussed. I knew I wanted the job because of the scope of practice/autonomy/etc (solo rural ER coverage) and would have worked there almost for free. I applied every year for a decade before I even got an interview. I knew they would give me a fair wage and they did (in fact, more than I expected). . Nope, I make very clear I am there for the love of E-Med. Salary is a far secondary. I too would have worked for free at one point and offered this too, haha! Still, it's been 5 years, and zero dice. You should ask yourself whether you want to work in a new specialty that has little training or backup. Floundering about in a new specialty is not my idea of fun Haha absolutely!! E=-med was my goal long before I even considered PA schools. ------------------------- That being said, what do you all think about asking them to let me come in for free on weekends and observe at the urgent care?
Moderator EMEDPA Posted March 11, 2015 Moderator Did you apply to all 20ish? Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk 27 now...although 2 are service connected.
jmj11 Posted March 11, 2015 Let me add that when I mentioned asking about salary as the first and only concern is a bad sign for me. However, I've paid each of my empoyees higher than what they asked for when we did get to salary. So not talking about salary first doesn't imply that the employer is going to short change you in the end. As a PA if I did get the point if they were going to offer me 50 K a year, then the sooner I know, the less time I could have wasted, but I suggest that you bring salary up secondary. I'm thinking about your question. If I offered a job to someone and they said, "I want to make sure it is a good fit, can I come and observe first?" I would probably say yes. It is easier to stay out of any situation than to get out. So I would not want someone who was not a good fit. Now, if you say I want to come and observe so I can learn about urgent care because I don't know a lot now, I'm not sure that would help your chances or not. As an employer, if I had a good candidate in all areas except experience and they said to me, "I will work hard to learn. Let me have a 90 day period to learn and to prove myself at 60% of the salary (you need) and then if both parties are satisfied, give you 110% of the salary from that point on . . . I would take that risk. I'm doing that with an MA right now, but I gave her 90 days at what she asked for, and if she finishes the 90 days with good marks, I will hire her long-term at 110% of what she asked. For a PA it is more complex as there are upfront costs of insurance credntialing, malpractice, DEA fee and etc. If you are confident in what you can do, and you really want the job, you could even offer to reimburse some of those costs if you are not retained. If I had a PA with that kind of confidence, I would hire them. I'm actually facing that right now as I'm looking for a PA or NP and virtually all of those with headache experience are far away and love their present jobs.
sscheinfe Posted March 11, 2015 Author Thanks! Let me add that when I mentioned asking about salary as the first and only concern is a bad sign for me. However, I've paid each of my empoyees higher than what they asked for when we did get to salary. So not talking about salary first doesn't imply that the employer is going to short change you in the end. As a PA if I did get the point if they were going to offer me 50 K a year, then the sooner I know, the less time I could have wasted, but I suggest that you bring salary up secondary. I'm thinking about your question. If I offered a job to someone and they said, "I want to make sure it is a good fit, can I come and observe first?" I would probably say yes. It is easier to stay out of any situation than to get out. So I would not want someone who was not a good fit. Now, if you say I want to come and observe so I can learn about urgent care because I don't know a lot now, I'm not sure that would help your chances or not. As an employer, if I had a good candidate in all areas except experience and they said to me, "I will work hard to learn. Let me have a 90 day period to learn and to prove myself at 60% of the salary (you need) and then if both parties are satisfied, give you 110% of the salary from that point on . . . I would take that risk. I'm doing that with an MA right now, but I gave her 90 days at what she asked for, and if she finishes the 90 days with good marks, I will hire her long-term at 110% of what she asked. For a PA it is more complex as there are upfront costs of insurance credntialing, malpractice, DEA fee and etc. If you are confident in what you can do, and you really want the job, you could even offer to reimburse some of those costs if you are not retained. If I had a PA with that kind of confidence, I would hire them. I'm actually facing that right now as I'm looking for a PA or NP and virtually all of those with headache experience are far away and love their present jobs.
Davo Posted March 12, 2015 Seems like EMS experience might be a good thing to have if a patient rapidly deteriorates and an ambulance isn't yet there. Just something to consider.
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