jlhdw3 Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Hi there, I was hoping I could get some insight from others about PA programs being put on probation. A program I am interested in was put on probation and that is concerning to me. If it is the only school I am accepted to, is it worth going? Will my reputation suffer as a graduate from their program. What sort of implications will I face in the future if I choose to attend this program? Any insight is helpful. When I applied the program was not on probation so this is a shock to me. Thank you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PACdan Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but as I understand it: You may attend a school that is either provisionally accredited or on probation, and as long as you graduate while the school has either status in effect, you may still sit for the PANCE and become certified. Should your school lose accreditation or fail to obtain it before you graduate, you will be ineligible to take the national certifying exam. Sent from the Satellite of Love using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cinntsp Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 I believe that is incorrect. AFAIK you are eligible to sit for the pance as long as the program is accredited at the time of matriculation. Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcreek Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Prior to my acceptance at the University of Utah, one of the other programs I was accepted to was the A.T. Still / Arizona School of Health Sciences - which is currently on probation. Probation means it is still accredited, they just need to get their act together or risk losing accreditation. Most programs really take great efforts to get off of probation if that happens to them, and come out better in the end. If you matriculate into a program that is on probation, you are still eliglible to sit for the PANCE when you graduate - even if they lose accreditation entirely while you are in the program. It would definitely hurt your chances of getting into a PA residency if that is your goal, but not taking the PANCE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PACdan Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 Thanks guys, that makes more sense. Sent from the Satellite of Love using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cinntsp Posted January 9, 2014 Share Posted January 9, 2014 It would definitely hurt your chances of getting into a PA residency if that is your goal Says who? I doubt a candidate would be faulted for something out of their control. If they performed well, scored well on the pance, and have great LORs I fail to see the problem. Accreditation probation is often an issue of paperwork and administrative issues. It doesn't necessarily imply that the program or its curriculum is weak. Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlhdw3 Posted January 9, 2014 Author Share Posted January 9, 2014 Thank you for the replies. I guess ideally if I attended a program that was on probation I would seriously think about a residency in order to boost my skills and increase my experience before entering the job market. I read someplace once that it could affect licensure in some states. Does anyone know about this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cinntsp Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 Thank you for the replies. I guess ideally if I attended a program that was on probation I would seriously think about a residency in order to boost my skills and increase my experience before entering the job market. How do those relate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlhdw3 Posted January 10, 2014 Author Share Posted January 10, 2014 How do those relate? So the most recent thing on my resume would not be a school that was on probation and the stigma attached to that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cinntsp Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 So the most recent thing on my resume would not be a school that was on probation and the stigma attached to that. The people doing the hiring don't know and don't care about your school's status as long as you have the "C." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AREID Posted January 10, 2014 Share Posted January 10, 2014 It won't hurt your chances of doing anything. If it's accredited at the time you start, you can sit for pance Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G. Davenport Posted January 11, 2014 Share Posted January 11, 2014 This seems to come up a lot. I will ask two questions 1.). Will your diploma state the school was on probation? 2.). Will your transcripts stare the school was on probation? Answer to both is "no!" A potential employer rarely knows the status of a PA program. They want to see your NCCPA certificate, pa license, and transcripts. They want to meet you and determine the fit. Bottom line, the only one that this matters to is the applicant. You must determine if the probation status will have a negative impact on YOUR education. If they are on probation because they struggle finding OB/gyn sites, who doesn't. So it's all about your comfort. After you graduate, no one cares. NCCPA cert, license, and good transcripts is what it takes to open your doors. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlhdw3 Posted January 12, 2014 Author Share Posted January 12, 2014 So I was accepted and they sent a certified letter stating why they were put on probation. It does not sound very good at all. There are several deficiencies in many areas. The letter also stated that attending a school on probation WILL affect which states I can gain licensure in and practice in. I have not been able to find much about that on the internet but at this time I am leaning towards holding out for the other schools I interviewed at. I appreciate all the great information and am open to more! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rcreek Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 Says who? I doubt a candidate would be faulted for something out of their control. If they performed well, scored well on the pance, and have great LORs I fail to see the problem. Accreditation probation is often an issue of paperwork and administrative issues. It doesn't necessarily imply that the program or its curriculum is weak. Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk Many residency programs specifically state that they require graduation from an accredited program. If someone's program lost accreditation prior to their graduation, even though they passed the PANCE, that's great but they still didn't graduate from an accredited program - did they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rpackelly Posted January 13, 2014 Share Posted January 13, 2014 I really have never heard of a state not licensing an applicant if they are certified. In the past, many programs have come and gone and if the program was considered accredited when you matriculated, you are considered as a graduate of an accredited program. Plus, the decision to completely withdraw accreditation is seldom sudden and, when it occurs, which is very rarely, there is plenty of warning. The last instance I heard of where the university itself lost accreditation (not the program), another state program accepted the students in transfer. Another program that has been on and off accredited, on probation, and then provisionally accredited suspended its program and admissions for a year so no student would have an interrupted status.......i.e., students graduated from a program on probation and then new students were admitted two years later to a program that was provisionally accredited. I think you could be pretty sure that the ARC-PA would arrange something like that for current students. I would never worry about not being able to practice in a state or get a job because you were a graduate of a PA program that is currently on probation or even defunct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlhdw3 Posted January 19, 2014 Author Share Posted January 19, 2014 Many residency programs specifically state that they require graduation from an accredited program. If someone's program lost accreditation prior to their graduation, even though they passed the PANCE, that's great but they still didn't graduate from an accredited program - did they? This is a question that I would really like answered. If it eliminates my chance at a residency, that is a deal breaker in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cinntsp Posted January 19, 2014 Share Posted January 19, 2014 Many residency programs specifically state that they require graduation from an accredited program. If someone's program lost accreditation prior to their graduation, even though they passed the PANCE, that's great but they still didn't graduate from an accredited program - did they? This is really unlikely to happen. It is pretty hard for PA programs to lose accreditation as there is a lot of time given once put on probation to correct the issues. The one recent case where the actual school(not the program) lost regional accreditation ended with another PA program taking in those students. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jlhdw3 Posted January 20, 2014 Author Share Posted January 20, 2014 The letter they mailed out states there are problems with administration, curriculum design and sequencing, clinical rotations, and self-assessment. These seem like substantial areas to me. I spoke with the important people in my life to get other perspectives and everyone seems to support my decision. It is a very tough one but I am going to hold out for a program that is a better fit for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrsmurf Posted January 21, 2014 Share Posted January 21, 2014 Have you checked the ARC-PA website? Is there someone you could contact there? They would be institution with the real answers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
10Messi Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 My question concerns provisional accredited schools. If you read the ARC-PA description of who is eligible to sit for the PANCE, a person who started at a provisional school would not be able to take the PANCE even if their school was to gain accreditation before they finished their studies (didactic or clinics). See attached from ARC-PA: The program I am considering has provisional accreditation. What happens to me as a student if it does not receive accreditation?Provisional accreditation is an active accreditation status. Prior to 2003, those graduating from a PA program that held an active accreditation status at any time during the student's enrollment were considered graduates of an accredited program, and thus were eligible to sit for the NCCPA exam. This policy changed in 2003 and in order to be eligible to take the PANCE, students must successfully complete a program that was accredited at the time the student matriculated. It is best to check with the NCCPA concerning exam eligibility criteria. I interpret this to say that the program must be fully accredited when the student is admitted to the program for this student to sit for the exam. So what happens to all the students that enter a provisional program that graduate when the program does become accredited although they entered under provisional status. Do they not get to sit for this exam? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arthropathy Posted November 19, 2014 Share Posted November 19, 2014 Not true. If you matriculate to a provisional accredated program you are eligible for the PANCE. As for probation status... I would be way more concerned with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patho Posted November 20, 2014 Share Posted November 20, 2014 This seems to come up a lot. I will ask two questions 1.). Will your diploma state the school was on probation? 2.). Will your transcripts stare the school was on probation? Answer to both is "no!" A potential employer rarely knows the status of a PA program. They want to see your NCCPA certificate, pa license, and transcripts. They want to meet you and determine the fit. Bottom line, the only one that this matters to is the applicant. You must determine if the probation status will have a negative impact on YOUR education. If they are on probation because they struggle finding OB/gyn sites, who doesn't. So it's all about your comfort. After you graduate, no one cares. NCCPA cert, license, and good transcripts is what it takes to open your doors. Good luck. Doing a job search for PA off indeed.com for Maryland, most PA jobs require a state license, and to get one the following must be met. "B. Education. (1) An applicant who passed the physician assistant certifying examination administered by the National Commission on Certification of Physician Assistants before 1986 is not required to meet the education requirements specified in §B(2) or (3) of this regulation if both of the following are true: (a) The applicant has met the continuing education requirements and recertification requirements of the National Commission on Certification of Physician Assistants on a continuous basis since passing the examination; and (b) The applicant has been employed and practicing as a physician assistant on a continuous basis since passing the examination. (2) Except as specified in §B(1) of this regulation, an applicant shall graduate from a physician assistant educational program that was accredited at the time of graduation by the Commission on Accreditation of Allied Health Education Programs, the Accreditation Review Commission on the Education for the Physician Assistant, or their successors. http://www.dsd.state...10.32.03.04.htm So while you can take the PANCE and be certified, finding a job or residency program would be difficult w/o a license. What are your thoughts on this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalPA Posted November 21, 2014 Share Posted November 21, 2014 I'm not sure what you are asking. You cannot practice as a PA without a license. You may begin looking for a job or applying to residency before you graduate but they will want you to actually graduate and pass PANCE before you can be credentialed or begin practicing. Most programs are ARC-PA accredited. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patho Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 I'm not sure what you are asking. You cannot practice as a PA without a license. You may begin looking for a job or applying to residency before you graduate but they will want you to actually graduate and pass PANCE before you can be credentialed or begin practicing. Most programs are ARC-PA accredited. If the OP attends this program on probation in summer of 2015 and the program ultimately loses accreditation in the fall of 2015, then they can still sit for the pance, but Maryland won't allow them to have a license because it requires that the program they attend is accredited at the time of graduation. It is worth it to attend a program and be certified and not be able to attain a license to practice? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalPA Posted November 22, 2014 Share Posted November 22, 2014 That's correct. Here's my understanding... 1. Graduate an ARC-PA accredited program. 2. Take and pass PANCE. 3. Apply for state license. Someone correct me if I missed something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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