OGBT Posted December 4, 2013 Share Posted December 4, 2013 I was just wondering what your guy's thoughts were on an offer at a Large Teaching Institution in Maryland in the Orthopedic Department: - Base Salary: $80,000 - 3 weeks vacation (changes to 4 weeks after 1 year) - Major Holidays off, with 2 floating holidays - 12 sick days - Healthcare benefits (plenty of options to choose from) - $2000 CMEs - Annual Performance Eval with up to 2% increase in salary - No mention of licensing, DEA, 401k matching, Professional Organization, or Malpractice. (will ask about in near future, is there anything else that I'm missing?) Thank you guys! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMD16 Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 Your duties? E.g # days in the OR first assisting & # days in clinic? Calls q-wk...Typically, at larger institution w/ an establish orthopedic residency program, the resident & fellow scrub in on cases or are first assist. Will you be Dr. Bone PA or PA for the entire group (translation >>$)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGBT Posted December 5, 2013 Author Share Posted December 5, 2013 I would be in clinic three days per week with first-assist duties in the OR the remaining two days per week. There is no nights, weekends, or call duties. Residents rotate every 10 weeks. I would solely with one surgeon. I hope this clarifies things. Thank you so much for your response. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMD16 Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 For a new grad the offered not bad. I would recommend AAPA salary survey. Most employer would pay for your malpractice & it must be individual not as an add-on. I would ask for more if youre responsible for your malpractice ins. Your duties must be clearly define in your contract. Don't be lowball! Bennies must be clearly define to include 401K or 403B. Good luck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloradopa Posted December 5, 2013 Share Posted December 5, 2013 For a new grad the offered not bad. I would recommend AAPA salary survey. Most employer would pay for your malpractice & it must be individual not as an add-on. I would ask for more if youre responsible for your malpractice ins. Your duties must be clearly define in your contract. Don't be lowball! Bennies must be clearly define to include 401K or 403B. Good luck. It is unusual for academic institutions to pay for separate malpractice insurance. Most are self insured and you are covered by their group plan (which covers all providers in the institution). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrthoSurgeryPA Posted December 8, 2013 Share Posted December 8, 2013 If you base this salary on an 8 hour day and work 5 days a week this comes out to only $42/hour. Sounds like you will be working a lot more than that with a lot of contract factors not present. I would run...or re-negotiate? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kem2127 Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 If you base this salary on an 8 hour day and work 5 days a week this comes out to only $42/hour. Sounds like you will be working a lot more than that with a lot of contract factors not present. I would run...or re-negotiate? Is $42/hour supposed to be bad? That is by far the highest offer I received as a new grad in a large teaching hospital in NY. City hospitals (which many are unionized) are paying $35-38/hr for new grads in my area and there is definitely no ability to negotiate, regardless of related experience. In fact all new grads are offered the same starting rate regardless of primary care or specialty. Their reasoning is that our salary is calculated as "0 years of PA experience." The only thing that pays higher is per diems (for obvious reasons) and those offers in my experience are $45-47 for days and $50-55 for nights. From the other new grad postings that I have been seeing on here, it seems like 75-83k seem to be the average starting salaries in many areas of the country. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Woody85 Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 I just checked the 2010 aapa salary report for someone with < 1 year of experience in ortho surgery in NY. It was $80,000 for 40 hr./week. Considering it is almost 2014, I would say you are at the bare minimum of what they should pay you...JMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discogenic Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 With many new PA programs coming into existence and therefore more new-grad PAs in the near future, isn't it conceivable that some of those new grads will take that $80k offer? So the next offer will be $75k, and someone will take it. Then $65k, and on and on. In other words, will the increasing numbers of new PAs drive salaries down despite the projected increased need, and particularly if specialist incomes will be declining as some predict? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjm7 Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 When I graduate, I intend to find an employer that will treat me with respect and not low ball me. Consider this: http://www.forbes.com/sites/brucejapsen/2013/12/08/doctor-nurse-vacancies-soar-amid-obamacare-rollout/?partner=yahootix We're needed, and very soon we will be needed even more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
discogenic Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 When I graduate, I intend to find an employer that will treat me with respect and not low ball me. Consider this: http://www.forbes.com/sites/brucejapsen/2013/12/08/doctor-nurse-vacancies-soar-amid-obamacare-rollout/?partner=yahootix We're needed, and very soon we will be needed even more. Decent article, although I'm not sure this line describes very well what we do: "Most of these new models use primary care doctors as a quarterback of sorts to nurse practitioners and physician assistants who reach out to the patients, making sure they are taking their medications, eating properly and adhering to doctor’s orders." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kem2127 Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 I just checked the 2010 aapa salary report for someone with < 1 year of experience in ortho surgery in NY. It was $80,000 for 40 hr./week. Considering it is almost 2014, I would say you are at the bare minimum of what they should pay you...JMHO I definitely agree, of course I wish offers were higher! But after getting offers with 4 different hospital systems and hearing offers from classmates and other program graduates, it seems to be what every new grad is getting regardless of MSPA/BSPA degree, specialty, gender, age. Though from my understanding offers for salary differentiate a new graduate (no work experience) and <1 year of experience (as meaning a few months to just shy of a 1 year for work experience) and is compensated differently. I haven't seen the AAPA salary report so I can't confirm their interpretation of <1 year. If anyone is willing to share that with me, I'd appreciate it. Plus if you wait around for the perfect job, by the time you find it and get through the credentialing process, another 6+ months goes by. In the end you just lost 6 months income and you have less paid work experience, actually giving yourself a disadvantage, no? As someone else said, in another thread, work for a year to get experience and move on if need be. I don't think anyone should accept 65k, nor have I seen anyone offering that, but anything 75k-80k seems fair game (unfortunately). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjm7 Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 Decent article, although I'm not sure this line describes very well what we do: "Most of these new models use primary care doctors as a quarterback of sorts to nurse practitioners and physician assistants who reach out to the patients, making sure they are taking their medications, eating properly and adhering to doctor’s orders." Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrsmurf Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 Screw what people are saying about lowballing. In my exp, jobs at academic institutions are rare. Furthermore, you typically get a better learning experience than at a private hospital. I would rather take a 33% pay cut to actually learn medicine than to take a higher salary at a mediocre position esp for a first job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjm7 Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 Screw what people are saying about lowballing. In my exp, jobs at academic institutions are rare. Furthermore, you typically get a better learning experience than at a private hospital. I would rather take a 33% pay cut to actually learn medicine than to take a higher salary at a mediocre position esp for a first job. The point is that the more people take jobs that undervalue them monetarily, the more likely it becomes that the rest of us will have to play the game of choosing between a "higher salary at a mediocre position" and "a 33% pay cut to actually learn medicine." You're creating a false dichotomy. We should all expect quality positions where we are valued as practitioners, monetarily and otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cbrsmurf Posted December 9, 2013 Share Posted December 9, 2013 Well, that's capitalism, right? I value such an experience and am willing to be paid less for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustPassing Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 Screw what people are saying about lowballing. In my exp, jobs at academic institutions are rare. Furthermore, you typically get a better learning experience than at a private hospital. I would rather take a 33% pay cut to actually learn medicine than to take a higher salary at a mediocre position esp for a first job. This If $80k is an amount you are comfortable with, you think you will ENJOY working there, and there is no current data supporting they are attempting to low ball you, take it. Great opportunity to learn and make yourself more marketable. In 6-12 months if they do not pay your more or you do not feel 80k is adequate, you will now have work experience, negotiating experience, and a better grasp as to what you are capable of offering, and can take your skills elsewhere. If they were offering you 65-70k for this job, I would say you are doing you and all PAs a disservice by accepting such a low offer. But this does not seem to be the case. Further more, learn to live off this amount ( actually less) and continue to do so even after you start making the desired chedda= FinancialWinning Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wjm7 Posted December 11, 2013 Share Posted December 11, 2013 ...and there is no current data supporting they are attempting to low ball you, take it... If they were offering you 65-70k for this job, I would say you are doing you and all PAs a disservice by accepting such a low offer. But this does not seem to be the case. We're expressing the same point in different ways. I agree completely with your statement. My point was that if the data shows you are being lowballed, and you accept a position where you are undervalued, you are negatively affecting the next PAs ability to find a position that compensates them fairly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OGBT Posted December 12, 2013 Author Share Posted December 12, 2013 I recently just got another job offer from a different teaching institution: Base pay: 87,500 CME: $2000, 5 days PTO: 3 weeks All major holidays off DEA/Controlled/NCCPA paid for Working 13/28 days Malpractice paid by Institution (should I get my own, just to cover my own rear) 3-5% annual raise based on Performance 403(b) and medical and dental I am leaning towards his offer? Would this offer be more reasonable? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KMD16 Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 I recently just got another job offer from a different teaching institution: Base pay: 87,500 CME: $2000, 5 days PTO: 3 weeks All major holidays off DEA/Controlled/NCCPA paid for Working 13/28 days Malpractice paid by Institution (should I get my own, just to cover my own rear) 3-5% annual raise based on Performance 403(b) and medical and dental I am leaning towards his offer? Would this offer be more reasonable? 401K? Are you vested after 6mo or a yr? Is the offer negotiable? If it's not, then, run with it (accept the offer). If the institution will pay for your malpractice, then, you don't need to get your own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted December 12, 2013 Moderator Share Posted December 12, 2013 looks like a better offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ncsugrad09 Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 Starting 92K base +benefits/malpractice/cme/401k, rotating 3 shifts/wk at large academic hospital in Chicago. New grad last year w/ no prior experience. We'll only get paid the salaries we accept. Keep negotiating and raising the bar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coloradopa Posted December 12, 2013 Share Posted December 12, 2013 401K? Are you vested after 6mo or a yr? Is the offer negotiable? If it's not, then, run with it (accept the offer). If the institution will pay for your malpractice, then, you don't need to get your own. A 403 (b) is a 401k for a non-profit. It works pretty much the same. The thing I would ask is what percentage match and when it vests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alainfranco Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 Miami area Ortho position: $70,000/ year and almost 10hrs a day On call week= $750 Health insurance offered OR= more than 4 cases Mon and 3 onTue Clinic= more than 35 pts/day Wed and Thu Check calls/ faxes and anticoagulants every day Somebody can tell about this offer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GetMeOuttaThisMess Posted February 19, 2014 Share Posted February 19, 2014 $33/hr, excluding call ($70K/40 hr. week x 52 weeks, excluding call). How do you feel about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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