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Expensive tuition more clinical opportunities-worth the debt?


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Hello all! I've been lucky enough to be accepted to two PA programs, but I'm completely torn on where to go and was hoping I could get some advice.

One is really expensive but has extra clinical rotations with a surgical focus, which is a huge pro for me. It's in a city I could see myself living in, but it's only a few years old with only one PANCE rate to look at (100% though).

The other program is nearly 1/3 of the price and I could live at home and save money. It's been around for almost 20 years with PANCE rates higher than the national average every year. I eventually want to move out of state though.

My question is, how difficult is it to find a job out of state from where you went to school? And does extra clinical experience in the area you wish to practice in give you that much of an advantage when applying for jobs? Are the clinical experiences and prestige of a bigger name hospital worth the extra debt?

I've heard mixed opinions on this and am hoping to get more insight before I make my decision. Any advice would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!!

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I am curious to see the opinions here as well as I may find myself in a very similar situation soon. Both of my schools are well established but one is out-of-state (UAB) but with a surgical focus (which I want to eventually end up in), the other is in-state (UF) with a primary care focus (which I may want to start with to get practice with my clinical skills). Haven't been accepted at the in-state school yet so we will see. But the difference is roughtly ~$140k out of state assuming I don't get residency after the first year and about ~$80k in-state. Both of these reflecting living expenses. Definitely my top two choices so I will be going to one of them for sure.

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Thank you! I've been looking into residencies but they seem more like the exception right now, but maybe that will change with years to come? Do you think it's still fairly easy to land a surgical job despite going to a school with a primary care focus? There's one surgical rotation and one preceptorship rotation, which I would probably use to gain more surgical experience. Going to the school with more surgical opportunities seems easier fresh out of school, but that extra debt is still so hard to justify

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And henry519, congrats on both! I was missing a prereq for UAB so I couldn't apply, but it was definitely one of my top choices had I been able to. Everyone says having a choice is a good position to be in, but I almost wish I had only been accepted to one so I didn't have the chance to have regrets with the wrong decision haha

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Well I haven't been accepted to UF yet, I'll find out by January where I stand. As of now I was accepted at UAB but out-of-state tuition is so expensive. I do have a wife who plans on working full-time up there so I would hopefully be granted residency after a year. I just wanted to see what others thought IF I did get offered a position at UF. I am probably worrying for nothing. If I don't get offered a spot then I'm just going to bite the bullet and head to UAB as my other school choices were back ups and private so not as large of a difference in cost. I really loved UAB and UF.

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I agree with emedpa. Attend the cheaper program then do a residency. A couple extra rotations will not make you a valuable resource in the OR. And 140k is not worth a couple extra rotations in surgery. As a resident you will be exposed to surgery every single day for a min of one year. They will pay YOU, and you will be able to land a job with more autonomy. You do not want the extra debt, the pay differential that you would make in surgery isn't THAT much to justify the increase in tuition. On a side note, a well established program is always preferred to one that just started.

 

 

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What if I do not get into my in-state choice? Should I still attend my out-of-state choice even if it will set my back that much? Just in your opinion because I really really don't want to wait another year and reapply. Also, being married doing a residency will be tough as my wife would have to move and find yet another new job. I'm not against it I'm just saying because I think a residency is a fantastic idea...

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That's a very good point, being paid for a residency rather than paying for an extra 9 months of rotations where I don't even know how much hands on experience I'd realistically get. As far as appying to jobs out of state, is it fairly easy to still get a job? I've been told so many times the connections you make in clinicals dictates where you'll receive your first job offer, but I'm in my 20s and want to be able to experience a big city/land a job outside of michigan. Any advice as far as that? It seems hard to justify the 56k difference in tuition just so I can live in a bigger city during school, it's just what comes after that, that worries me

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That's a very good point, being paid for a residency rather than paying for an extra 9 months of rotations where I don't even know how much hands on experience I'd realistically get. As far as appying to jobs out of state, is it fairly easy to still get a job? I've been told so many times the connections you make in clinicals dictates where you'll receive your first job offer, but I'm in my 20s and want to be able to experience a big city/land a job outside of michigan. Any advice as far as that? It seems hard to justify the 56k difference in tuition just so I can live in a bigger city during school, it's just what comes after that, that worries me

If you go the cheaper route, followed by a residency, you will not have a problem landing a job regardless of the state

 

 

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Silly question, but would you all personally go to a school where you would come out of school with ~$140k in debt? I most likely will but just asking.

If I had a choice, no. If that was the only school that I got into then probably. Lol. Man that's a ton of debt, you also have to factor in living expenses and interest rates over the course of two years...that will quickly add up to a lot more

 

 

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So the general consensus is go to the school with a 40k tuition and living at home, not the 96k tuition + living expenses, even if the more expensive one might be a better experience?

The experience is what you make it. If you have the drive and desire you will learn a ton in any situation. If you are timid, don't want to touch patients, don't step up to the plate to perform procedures..then you wont learn regardless of the quality of the rotation. You stated the cheaper program was well established. I'm sure a well established program will not have sub par rotations.

 

Remember: "whether you think you can or you think you can't, your right"

 

 

 

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Well I haven't been accepted to UF yet, I'll find out by January where I stand. As of now I was accepted at UAB but out-of-state tuition is so expensive. I do have a wife who plans on working full-time up there so I would hopefully be granted residency after a year. I just wanted to see what others thought IF I did get offered a position at UF. I am probably worrying for nothing. If I don't get offered a spot then I'm just going to bite the bullet and head to UAB as my other school choices were back ups and private so not as large of a difference in cost. I really loved UAB and UF.

I think for UAB, 140K is just the tuition for out of state students. No living expenses included. Also, AFAIK, you can not change residency status after you matriculated.

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We are planning on living off my wife's income for our living expenses. And I thought you could, I need to show proof that my spouse has worked in Alabama for at least 12 months plus anything else we do to show we plan to stay in Alabama indefinitely and fill out the appropriate form(s). I could very well be wrong though.

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We are planning on living off my wife's income for our living expenses. And I thought you could, I need to show proof that my spouse has worked in Alabama for at least 12 months plus anything else we do to show we plan to stay in Alabama indefinitely and fill out the appropriate form(s). I could very well be wrong though.

what you say is correct if it applies before the matriculation. From their website"Documents supporting a reclassification application should be dated, issued, or filed the twelve (12) consecutive months prior to your initial enrollment at a Alabama institution of higher education." One of the reasons UAB interviews out of state applicants first. A drastic difference in tuition. I was accepted to another program where in state is 35K and out of state is 90K - no way to get it once you there. For UAB you could look into southeast alliance of the universities, if your state is one of them and doesn't have a PA program you can get in state tuition as part of that agreement. I do not know if it is true for any states though for PA specifically.

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Ah, well then that changes the ballgame slightly. I'm from Florida so there is 1 public university (UF) with a PA program and numerous private schools (Nova, South, Barry) so the Southeast Alliance wouldn't work. I have yet to hear from UF but have gotten into one of the Novas but since it is private it is only slightly less expensive than UAB. UAB has a better program I feel with more hospitals around for rotations and my wife to get a job as a nurse. So, I feel the UAB while more slightly expensive than Nova is a better investment than Nova. I am figuring this based on the idea that I am not offered a position at UF. Would you say that I would be justified in my decision? 

 

I'm sorry I'm asking about all of this stuff but I am personally stuggling with this decision. My wife does not like the Ft. Myers where I got into the Nova program so I'm trying to answer this question for myself but I love hearing feedback from others currently in, soon-to-be-in PA school to provide some insight. Thanks everyone!

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I went to a "prestigious" PA program and am currently job searching out of state from the PA program I attended. In choosing a program, it was more about my fit with the program and the vibe I got from other potential students, and the PANCE pass rate. I interviewed at programs within my home state but just didn't get a great vibe, the students all seemed kind of distant with each other. So in the end it wasn't so much about the money for me.

 

However, I have found that out of state the prestige of my program is not well known. A lot of my fellow students that stuck around had connections from rotations and landed jobs pretty quickly. I have needed to push harder to get my foot in the door, frequently call recruiters and HR, etc. I needed to talk myself up more, wave around papers with pie charts showing the procedures I've done, notes written, etc. 2 months into actively searching for jobs, applying, and interviewing I finally have a few offers baking in the oven.

 

I also applied for a residency (didn't get in though, not enough slots BUT they did offer me a surgical residency spot as they had a lot of extras there so good new for you!) and I would say that's a great idea and would echo the advice of everyone above. If the cheaper school gives you a good vibe and has a good PANCE pass rate, do that and apply for the residencies. Most likely you'll have to move out of state then and can spread your wings.

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Ah, well then that changes the ballgame slightly. I'm from Florida so there is 1 public university (UF) with a PA program and numerous private schools (Nova, South, Barry) so the Southeast Alliance wouldn't work. I have yet to hear from UF but have gotten into one of the Novas but since it is private it is only slightly less expensive than UAB. UAB has a better program I feel with more hospitals around for rotations and my wife to get a job as a nurse. So, I feel the UAB while more slightly expensive than Nova is a better investment than Nova. I am figuring this based on the idea that I am not offered a position at UF. Would you say that I would be justified in my decision? 

 

I'm sorry I'm asking about all of this stuff but I am personally stuggling with this decision. My wife does not like the Ft. Myers where I got into the Nova program so I'm trying to answer this question for myself but I love hearing feedback from others currently in, soon-to-be-in PA school to provide some insight. Thanks everyone!

the only way your wife could help if she would be a nurse at UAB. UAB employees have an educational benefit for spouses, but it would translate into maybe 2-3K every 6 month for tuition. I do not know if it applies to out of state residents, part timers and if it applies to Health Services Foundation, which is technically part of UAB ( and is a likely true employer for the nurses that work at UAB). Myself, I am yet to find the answer about the value of a program prestige beyond the obvious (site and clinical rotations). The field is so new and so rapidly changing that historically there was no time to form true "schools" with traceable academic achievements looking even 20 years back.

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Thank you all so much for the advice! The schools I'm choosing between are Wayne state and rush university. Rush seems great and I've heard great things about its medical and other science colleges, but it's still so new so I don't know how far that "prestige" would carry, with the extra 56k of tuition

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Please please please attend the cheaper program. It's established and will have a solid rotation base. Often specialty rotations are available if you look for them (you may need to set them up if your school doesn't have something you want already). I don't think you could convince me that the more expensive program is worth that much extra debt.

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