debt anxiety

[skyblue3]

I have been accepted to a PA program that I will be attending in the fall and am incredibly excited..however, as the months tick by, I am getting more and more anxious at the prospect of being in so much debt. I already have about 55K in debt from a previous Masters program and anticipate that I will be in between 85-100K for PA school. I am so used to working and bringing in a paycheck that the idea of taking out loans again to supplement my livelihood is really starting to stress me out. :/

[generalfluff]

The loan amount you have is quite typical, and much lighter than someone else pursuing a much longer field of study, like medicine.

 

As a PA, you can reasonably expect to earn 80k or more (higher with surgery and EM) fresh out of school. There are NHSC scholarships and loan repayments available if you're willing to work primary care at far-flung areas. 

You can opt to do a second per-diem job, like Urgent Care to bump your earnings as well. They pay by the hour at a higher rate than salary-based jobs, but without benefits (which your first job should have).

There is also a public service loan forgiveness program available provided you're willing to commit to 10 years of service in a government/public healthcare facility, while making minimum Income-Based Repayments. It is tax free.

 

It is painful to take loans out again, but consider it a business expense to acquire a valuable asset that will pay off over time. Live below your means while doing any of those suggestions above. This means living on a 2000/month budget on a 7000/month salary. It never matters how much you earn, when your spending matches it.

 

The loan should not stop you from pursuing a career you truly want to attain. There are so many ways around it, provided you're willing and determined.

[tunafish]

Welcome to the club!!! Same situation here. 0 debt and 75K a year salary and about to dive into the red ink where even have to finance my child support obligations...

[tunafish]

on the other hand I put my ex through optometry school and I remember the shaking when she gave her notice at work and started school. We had 2 kids and a house and 4 long years to do it. Things tend to work out and happen for a reason... just my 0.02

[Simplify]

The loan amount you have is quite typical, and much lighter than someone else pursuing a much longer field of study, like medicine.

 

As a PA, you can reasonably expect to earn 80k or more (higher with surgery and EM) fresh out of school. There are NHSC scholarships and loan repayments available if you're willing to work primary care at far-flung areas. 

You can opt to do a second per-diem job, like Urgent Care to bump your earnings as well. They pay by the hour at a higher rate than salary-based jobs, but without benefits (which your first job should have).

There is also a public service loan forgiveness program available provided you're willing to commit to 10 years of service in a government/public healthcare facility, while making minimum Income-Based Repayments. It is tax free.

 

It is painful to take loans out again, but consider it a business expense to acquire a valuable asset that will pay off over time. Live below your means while doing any of those suggestions above. This means living on a 2000/month budget on a 7000/month salary. It never matters how much you earn, when your spending matches it.

 

The loan should not stop you from pursuing a career you truly want to attain. There are so many ways around it, provided you're willing and determined.

 

Curious.  I had always thought that a Masters in Medical Science,  earned at a top-tier medical school was pursuing the field of medicine.

[generalfluff]

Let me clarify my mistake then.

 

Medicine as an MD/DO with a residency has a higher debt load, and low-end salary while pursuing a residency for board certification. All in all, these MD/DOs pursuing medicine have a harder financial burden than a PA also pursuing medicine.

[LT_Oneal_PAC]

Curious.  I had always thought that a Masters in Medical Science,  earned at a top-tier medical school was pursuing the field of medicine.

I wish I could like this a thousand times. And with the IBR and the money docs make, I assure you they have a easier time paying their loans.

[generalfluff]

Working 80+ hours as a resident for 3 years at a minimum, while making 40k a year is easy?

 

Note that you have to split that 40k between your living expenses (tough luck when you're single with kids, or depended as a breadwinner) and the Income Based Repayments. The latter assumes of course that your loans all from the federal government, and don't forget that sweet 6.8% annual interest rate on what is most likely a 200k+ loan. You won't make a dent on it over your residency either, which gets worse if it's something like surgery, which requires 5 years at minimum.

 

People tend to think that being a doctor is a free pass to the upper class.

 

It's not.

 

Split the hours they work per week for that salary, and you'll see that the newly graduated PA makes that relatively lower salary much sooner (and gets to six figures with a few years of experience), and with less debt to boot, than the MD/DO.

[tunafish]

I think if you go to the field of medicine with a $$$ sign in your eyes you are doomed even if you are in plastics in beverley hills. But truth to be told, there is no such thing as a poor doctor.

 

I would agree with the notion that residency is a job. It is not easy, but it pays enough to have an ok living and you can push your loans till you graduate. Residency starts at upper 40s and last time a checked it is median FAMILY income for many states. People manage to live their lives on the resident's income. There are ample opportunities for moonlighting too and rates of $100/hr are very real. it is a job, not "school" when you live off ramen noodles.

[tunafish]

 

People tend to think that being a doctor is a free pass to the upper class.

 

It's not.

 

Split the hours they work per week for that salary, and you'll see that the newly graduated PA makes that relatively lower salary much sooner (and gets to six figures with a few years of experience), and with less debt to boot, than the MD/DO.

it is. There is no doubt to that.

There are different six figures - some start with 1 and some start with 3 ))))

[EMEDPA]

_{40k/yr is a bit low today. also many pgy-2 and pgy-3 docs moonlight and can bring in $100/hr+ doing so.}

_{would I trade my current position/salary for an md pgy-1 spot with their salary? in a heartbeat because the next yr I would moonlight and make> 100k/yr then after completing residency would make > 250k/yr.}

_{yes, medical school and residency is hard. I have all the respect in the world for folks who do it. the debt doesn't need to rule your life though. live sensibly, pay more than the min on your loans, don't drive a porsche right out of residency and you are set for life. an md/do degree is a license to print money. not to mention the autonomy, sciope of practice, respect in the community, etc.}

_{I work with an em doc who paid ALL of his undergrad and medschool loans off in 2 years. he lived reasonably during those years, kept the apt and car he had as a resident, etc.  now he takes off several months/yr to go surfing and still makes twice my salary.}

[EMEDPA]

it is. There is no doubt to that.

There are different six figures - some start with 1 and some start with 3 ))))

agree. I know very few PAs who make> 200k/yr.

the only docs I know who make less than 200k work inner city primary care. all the hospitalists and em docs I know make way north of 200k working less than 1/2 the days of the month. docs in my group work 12-14 8 or 9 hr shifts/mo for 350k+. that's 126 hrs/mo max. I sometimes work that in 2 weeks for 1/3 their salary.

[LT_Oneal_PAC]

Working 80+ hours as a resident for 3 years at a minimum, while making 40k a year is easy?

 

Note that you have to split that 40k between your living expenses (tough luck when you're single with kids, or depended as a breadwinner) and the Income Based Repayments. The latter assumes of course that your loans all from the federal government, and don't forget that sweet 6.8% annual interest rate on what is most likely a 200k+ loan. You won't make a dent on it over your residency either, which gets worse if it's something like surgery, which requires 5 years at minimum.

 

People tend to think that being a doctor is a free pass to the upper class.

 

It's not.

 

Split the hours they work per week for that salary, and you'll see that the newly graduated PA makes that relatively lower salary much sooner (and gets to six figures with a few years of experience), and with less debt to boot, than the MD/DO.

I stand by my statement. First, 40k is low. Second, as you move along PGY years, you get raises. You don't think 5th year residents are being paid 40k? They aren't. Further, you can make 1k EASY in one moonlight shift, usually 1200+. Also, there is loan deferment. You get 3 years of it. Lastly, let's say they the poor things have to struggle for a measly two years after using all their deferment in a surgical residency. A surgeon will come out making 300k EASY.

 

Let's says they put 20% of that towards loans, a bit more than required. Let's also say they will lose 30%, after loans are paid since those are tax deductions, to IRS. They still have 168k to play with. Let's say they did a 3 year residency and came out making 200k because they are bad negotiators, live in a sorry area, or just plain suck at their job. By the same calculation, they still have 116k to live on!

 

Now let's do it for the typically PA in ANY specialty. We'll be generous and say they make 95k because they had good prior HCE. Using the above calculation they have 53k with which to live on. We all know 95k is a great starting salary, more than most can count on.

 

So yeah, they have it easy when it comes to paying loans.

 

Don't believe me? Go to the military forum on SDN, you'll see post after post of them telling people not to join the military for money, don't worry about the loans, they're scary but you can actually pay them off easy on an attending salary in any specialty besides FP.