To military PAs

[Acebecker]

Need some advice.  Our site has been disqualified for the NHSC loan repayment which I had received.  Due to our disqualification, I cannot re-apply for continued loan repayment help.  I need to find a program through which I can get loan repayment help. 

 

We have maxed out our state loan repayment at my site so I cannot get that either.

 

I'm looking at military options - Army reserve specifically - as there may be a way to achieve at least some loan repayment over the next 6 years.

 

The questions:  what are the chances I can get a contract stating that I will not get deployed?  (My wife and I have talked about this extensively and deployment is a no-go). 

 

What are the chances that I can get a duty station within a days drive of my home? 

 

Finally, what are the physical requirements?  I was turned down by an Army recruiter straight out of high school for some medical issues that I have and I'm wondering if they Army is more likely to grant waivers for that kind of thing now that demand has increased. 

 

Thanks for any input.  I know I need to talk to a recruiter, but I would prefer to have an idea of what I can expect before I go in. 

 

Andrew

[sas5814]

Need some advice.  Our site has been disqualified for the NHSC loan repayment which I had received.  Due to our disqualification, I cannot re-apply for continued loan repayment help.  I need to find a program through which I can get loan repayment help. 

 

We have maxed out our state loan repayment at my site so I cannot get that either.

 

I'm looking at military options - Army reserve specifically - as there may be a way to achieve at least some loan repayment over the next 6 years.

 

The questions:  what are the chances I can get a contract stating that I will not get deployed?  (My wife and I have talked about this extensively and deployment is a no-go). 

 

What are the chances that I can get a duty station within a days drive of my home? 

 

Finally, what are the physical requirements?  I was turned down by an Army recruiter straight out of high school for some medical issues that I have and I'm wondering if they Army is more likely to grant waivers for that kind of thing now that demand has increased. 

 

Thanks for any input.  I know I need to talk to a recruiter, but I would prefer to have an idea of what I can expect before I go in. 

 

Andrew

absolutely zero. you join you may deploy...period.

[Acebecker]

Even with medical waivers in place, Scott?

[sas5814]

You enlist you are deployable and if you have a medical condition that prevents you from deploying you can't enlist. There is no free ride.

[Acebecker]

Not looking for a free ride.  Thanks for the input. 

[sas5814]

I didn't mean it that way. The military is the military first and foremost and all things done are to the benefit of the military and its mission. Your #1 role whether you are a PA, an infantryman, a cook, or a mechanic is to be combat ready. That is where everything begins and ends and everything else is secondary. So by "free ride" I mean if they give you money and benefits and/or pay your tuition your first job is to be ready for combat and deploy if called on to do so. By free ride I meant military enlistment without that service. If you can't deploy... well you can't enlist. It is sometimes a hard thing to articulate to a civilian. You think if you enlist and take care of patients but don't deploy you are earning your pay and that, in the military, is called a civilian employee. In all liklihood as a new enlisted PA you would be assigned to a combat unit. Your responsibility would be to care for a batallion of soldiers and maybe their families depending on where you may be assigned. Then if that unit deploys you are their medical officer during their deployment.

My 3rd deployment was during Desert Storm and we were awash with physicians who had been taking money and benefits for being in the reserves for years and mewled and whined about how much money they were losing being deployed. I wanted to slap each and every one of them. You take the check you take the mission.

 

let me say this is the Army I am talking about since you mentioned them in particular. I can't really speak for other branches.

[Acebecker]

I absolutely understand what you mean re: deployment.  For what it's worth, I would be glad to serve in that regard - being able to take care of our guys over there would be a dream come true.  I am married with children which changes my penchant for being attached to a line unit.  I have other duties now.  But if I could fill a role stateside I would like to.

 

Background - from the age of about 13 I had planned to join.  Diagnosed with muscular disease at 16 and was in good shape, so still planned to try.  Destroyed ACL and meniscus at age of 17 playing lacrosse.  When I graduated I talked to recruiters and told them about my medical issues and they were not interested in me at that time.  I did not have any skillsets they wanted.  Now that I do, I'm wondering if they would grant a waiver that would make it acceptable for me to serve. 

 

I do appreciate the information, though.  My brother-in-law is on the infantry side of things so he can't answer my questions.

[karebear12892]

You must be ready, willing, and able to deploy if you want to be in the military. This is especially true for physician assistants; since we are able to transition between specialties, PA's tend to deploy more frequently than physicians. Doesn't matter if you've received postgraduate training in a particular area of medicine. The military's needs will always come before yours, so you'll need to be flexible. 

[sas5814]

I absolutely understand what you mean re: deployment.  For what it's worth, I would be glad to serve in that regard - being able to take care of our guys over there would be a dream come true.  I am married with children which changes my penchant for being attached to a line unit.  I have other duties now.  But if I could fill a role stateside I would like to.

 

Background - from the age of about 13 I had planned to join.  Diagnosed with muscular disease at 16 and was in good shape, so still planned to try.  Destroyed ACL and meniscus at age of 17 playing lacrosse.  When I graduated I talked to recruiters and told them about my medical issues and they were not interested in me at that time.  I did not have any skillsets they wanted.  Now that I do, I'm wondering if they would grant a waiver that would make it acceptable for me to serve. 

 

I do appreciate the information, though.  My brother-in-law is on the infantry side of things so he can't answer my questions.

I understand that totally. In the 12 years I was married and in the Army I was either deployed, away in school or training, or in the field almost 6 years. It can be a terrible burden on the spouse and kids and isn't much fun for the deployed soldier. There is an old saying that is so so true.... they also serve who sit and wait. good luck!

[Acebecker]

Thoughts on likelihood of a waiver with ACL injury and a mild form of muscular dystrophy? 

[south]

Zero.  You are wasting your time.  Your time has passed for that, just as mine did.  It happens.  

 

Recruiters lie.  If there was a way to force you through somehow, which I would be stunned but I have seen it, you're already hot for deployment and they haven't even cut your hair yet.

 

No offense, but I tend to speak plainly...you and the military want and need opposite things and don't belong within shouting distance of each other.  No offense to either party, and I hope you part as friends, but reality is a really cold thing.  

 

The military is a life you choose, and you take it freely and honor your contract, which is their needs come first.  You aren't remotely willing to do any of that.  Not a judgement - you wrote it here plainly and each to their own.  Me either, anymore.

 

Veteran of 13 years, deployed for most of that, when I wanted things to change, I went to go do something else.

[Acebecker]

I think I should have written my questions in reverse order because the last one is really the first one I need answered.  It seems this is coming across as if I want to serve without having to sacrifice or fulfill a contract which is not even remotely the case. 

[d2305]

Check out Indian Health Service or the VA as they never deploy. 

[sas5814]

Ace you are missing the core message like we are trying to hurt your feelings. You don't approach the military like you are negotiating a new job. There are regulations about physical requirements for enlistment, renlistment, becoming a comissioned officer, everything. The expectation is that you meet these basic requirements as a starting point. Then you go to some kind of basic training which includes rigorous physical fitness training and testing. Then advanced training which requires more of the same. Every 6 months you are tested on your physical fitness and failing a PT test makes you immediately ineligable for promotions, schools, tranfers to better assignments and puts you in the crosshairs for discharge. For an officer to fail a PT test is a near guarantee of never getting promoted again. Physical fitness and readiness for combat deployment is the hub around which everything rotates.

What to you is a minor physical ailment will prevent you from being physically fit and combat ready according to military standards. When I was being comissioned after being a Warrant Officer and after 13 years of service including 3 combat deployments I had to get a waiver because 20 years earlier I had a bee sting reaction. It was a new standard for a new circumstance. It delayed my commissioning by 4 months. Since I retired we have been at war for 12 years. The wellness and safety of your comrades depends on your fitness.

You do not meet the standards for enlistment. Move on.

[Acebecker]

Question answered. Thank you. I was not certain if my physical issues (which have not kept me from maintaining fitness in general - I am able to exert, lift, run, climb, etc) would make me ineligible or not. It seems that they would. Ergo, this is not an option. I appreciate the help.

[d2305]

One can swim or ride a bike now for the PT test. I did physical screening exams on Army Reserve/ National Guard personnel, and profiles (exemption) for running were commonplace.

[sas5814]

i would like to see the look on my Bn Commander's face when I was the Bn Surgeon for a combat arms unit when I told him I was going to ride a bike for my PT test. Not to mention the mockery of every soldier I served with. I don't think starting a military career as the lowest acceptable standard is really what anyone expects or would encourage.

[sk732]

i would like to see the look on my Bn Commander's face when I was the Bn Surgeon for a combat arms unit when I told him I was going to ride a bike for my PT test. Not to mention the mockery of every soldier I served with. I don't think starting a military career as the lowest acceptable standard is really what anyone expects or would encourage.

 

Best way to build trust as a medical provider in the military is ensuring you're able to do what everyone else does - that means keeping up physically as a start.  The more pointy end the unit, the more it's expected.

 

SK

[BruceBanner]

As others have said, zero chance. I looked into it a couple years back as the weight of my loans was dawning on me. Bottom line is if you enlist in any branch whether it be reserves or active duty, you may deploy. Non-negotiable. I'm sure there are people in active service who can no longer deploy (correct me if I'm wrong), but they absolutely met the standards when they enlisted.

 

Of course you would be an officer rather than an enlisted solider, but officers deploy too. In fact I'd say it's doubly likely you would deploy with medical skills. PAs have many uses in the military and if there is a need overseas your number will be called.

 

May want to look into the USHSC. They are not part of the armed services and have mostly stateside assignments from what I understood.

[HmTwoPA]

Not to be that guy, but I hate seeing stuff like this. Its not in the cards to deploy, because I have a family? You dont think all those guys deploying have families? If you want to reap the rewards of paid college you should also make the sacrifices. I deployed multiple times and my family made the sacrifice.You are looking for a free ride if you want to join the military, but not deploy. The last thing the military needs is another bootenant, who thinks that due to him having a family he should not have to deploy. 

[boli]

I don't mean to pry into your finances but I have to ask... you said "I need to find a program with loan repayment help". Why is this a need? Is there not income based repayment plans that can help offset the minimum monthly payment? My wife is a PT and we are paying off her 100k+ of loans so I know it sucks, but is loan repayment help really a necessity, or just a desire? 

 

That being said, you could look at prison system in addition to the previously mentioned options of indian health services or VA.

[camoman1234]

Not to be that guy, but I hate seeing stuff like this. Its not in the cards to deploy, because I have a family? You dont think all those guys deploying have families? If you want to reap the rewards of paid college you should also make the sacrifices. I deployed multiple times and my family made the sacrifice.You are looking for a free ride if you want to join the military, but not deploy. The last thing the military needs is another bootenant, who thinks that due to him having a family he should not have to deploy. 

You are not being that guy, you are telling the truth and what Acebecker needs to hear. There are not free rides. I have not served in our great military, but I do serve them (doing disability exams for the VA). The last think I would consider after just talking with the hundreds of veterans I see  year is to try and get by with the lowest standards when those men and women beat themselves up mentally and physical to help each and everyone of us. I find it very offensive that you want your loans paid back without doing anything for them. I would like my loans paid off and my wives (FNP), but we suck it up and kick ass to pay them off. I will be that GUY and say your story is no different than ANY of the PAs on the forum. Get real, there are no freebies in life. P.S. Serving our great country is not about $$$ it is about heart... 

[ventana]

Need some advice.  Our site has been disqualified for the NHSC loan repayment which I had received.  Due to our disqualification, I cannot re-apply for continued loan repayment help.  I need to find a program through which I can get loan repayment help. 

 

We have maxed out our state loan repayment at my site so I cannot get that either.

 

I'm looking at military options - Army reserve specifically - as there may be a way to achieve at least some loan repayment over the next 6 years.

 

The questions:  what are the chances I can get a contract stating that I will not get deployed?  (My wife and I have talked about this extensively and deployment is a no-go). 

 

What are the chances that I can get a duty station within a days drive of my home? 

 

Finally, what are the physical requirements?  I was turned down by an Army recruiter straight out of high school for some medical issues that I have and I'm wondering if they Army is more likely to grant waivers for that kind of thing now that demand has increased. 

 

Thanks for any input.  I know I need to talk to a recruiter, but I would prefer to have an idea of what I can expect before I go in. 

 

Andrew

 

 

Do the military a favor

 

Stay away

 

If you join they own you - you are theirs - and this is the mission

 

If you are not willing to offer this type of committment, then stay away - our gals and guys deserve someone that will go the distance with them - not someone looking for easy loan repayment 

 

 

 

 

 

this is a military guy......

http://articles.latimes.com/2007/dec/01/local/me-doctor1

SAN DIEGO — When Marines came to his door a year ago to tell him that his eldest son had been killed in Iraq, Bill Krissoff reacted like any father: with confusion, devastation, then numbness.

Nathan Krissoff was so young, a lover of poetry, a champion athlete, a leader whose maturity and selflessness had impressed fellow Marines.

The father in Krissoff found no resolution to his grief. The physician in him did.

At an age when many people think about retirement, Krissoff decided earlier this year that he would enlist as a doctor. He was 60 years old, decades above the military's preferred demographic.

Still, with a medical degree from the University of Colorado and specialty training at San Francisco General Hospital and UC Davis, Krissoff seemed easily qualified for a reserve commission in the Navy medical corps, which tends to Marines.

Krissoff had a flourishing private practice in Truckee, Calif. After a lifetime of swimming, kayaking and skiing, he was lean and fit.

But his age was a sticking point. His application bogged down in the military bureaucracy. He thought things might be hopeless.

Then, in late August, Krissoff and his wife, Christine, were invited to meet with President Bush after his speech to the American Legion convention in Reno.

At the end of the hourlong meeting, Bush asked Krissoff and other relatives of service members killed in Iraq and Afghanistan whether there was anything he could do for them. Krissoff mentioned his desire to enlist.

Karl Rove, then the president's top political advisor, took notes. Once back at the White House, he turned the matter over to Marine Gen. Peter Pace, then chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.

A few days later, Krissoff got a call from Lt. Cmdr. Ken Hopkins, a Navy nurse now on medical recruiting duty. With a push from the top, Krissoff's enlistment application began to speed through the process of interviews and background checks.

"Suddenly, I got all the support I needed from the bureaucracy to get this done," Hopkins said.

On Nov. 17, Krissoff, now 61, was commissioned a lieutenant commander in the Navy reserves, assigned to the medical corps. Rove sent flowers and a note of congratulations.

Because of the need for doctors and other health professionals, the military offers reserve commissions to qualified applicants.

It is not uncommon, Hopkins said, for civilian doctors at the top of the profession to look to the military for a new challenge. The commitment is light: a weekend a month and two weeks every summer.

But if a reservist wants to do more, the Navy is more than willing to put him or her on active duty at a base, a military hospital or a combat zone.

Several weeks of training in military-style medicine lie ahead, but Krissoff believes he is on his way to honoring his late son, 1st Lt. Nathan Krissoff, by deploying to a field hospital in Iraq.

He is closing up his orthopedic medicine practice in Truckee. He and his wife are moving to San Diego to be close to the Marine Corps 4th Medical Battalion.

They also will be near their other son, Austin, 24, a Marine officer at Camp Pendleton.

"I'm just a doctor who wants to help Marines; I'm not trying to change the world," Krissoff said in a telephone interview. "I'm inspired by both my sons' dedication to service."

Nathan Krissoff, 25, an intelligence officer with the 3rd Reconnaissance Battalion, was killed Dec. 9, 2006, by a roadside bomb while riding in a Humvee outside Fallouja, west of Baghdad.

Hundreds of Marines, soldiers and sailors attended a memorial service for him in the auditorium at Camp Fallouja.

Even by the mournful standards of such events, the memorial was emotional. Marines hugged one another, and many had tears in their eyes. Officers and enlisted personnel eulogized Krissoff, a graduate of Williams College, as a natural leader, charismatic but humble.

Lt. Col. William Seely, the battalion commander, said the young officer had shown "great courage and steadfast dedication" against "oppression, tyranny and extremism."

Sgt. Maj. Kenneth Pickering barked out the "Final Roll Call," calling Krissoff's name three times. With no response, a lone bugler played taps.

The difference between practicing medicine in Truckee and tending the wounded in Iraq is lost on no one involved in the enlistment. Krissoff will get refresher training in trauma medicine.

"Operating in a well-lighted surgical theater with air-conditioning is different than operating in a tent in a field," said Hopkins, who served in Iraq during the assault on Baghdad in 2003.

Krissoff concedes a kind of role-reversal is at play. "Usually it's the father who tries to lead the sons by example," he said. "In this case, my sons led me."

And what would his son Nathan think of his desire to enlist and deploy to a war zone?

"He'd just say, 'Way to go, Pops,' " said Krissoff, a slight quaver edging into his voice.

tony.perry@latimes.com

[corpsman89]

I think Acebecker was just misunderstood in this thread.

 

Many of you seem to be vilifying him as someone who thinks they don't need to do a deployment because they have a family. I think he was trying to get some clarification. Since Acebecker has not served I could see the confusion of what happens in the military and who gets deployed. He may be thinking that PAs don't get deployed that much. There are indeed certain fields in the military that do not get deployed all too often. It was a fair question. Lets calm down a bit.

 

Acebecker-- as someone who has deployed to Afghanistan, I am not offended by your questions.

 

I would be slightly frustrated if you continued to argue that you shouldn't deploy because of your family situation, but you didn't, so thank you.

[Boatswain2PA]

I would rather him ask this question now, and accept the answer now, than do what many professional reservists did during GW1.  They played military one weekend a month and 2 weeks a year, collecting good pay and benefits, but then dropped out when they were asked to deploy