Critical Care PA pay

[leneaola]

Hi,

Trying to get some information regarding critical care PA compensation in order to present a reasonable salary and raise structure to our group with an increasing number of PAs.

- Currently we work day shifts only, 8am-8pm

- around 2 weekends per month, no extra pay

- holidays as scheduled, no extra pay

- Good health, dental, 401k 

- start at 1wk vacation per year, increases yearly by a week up to 4wks per year

- 8 hours sick leave per month

- $1000 CME, but no extra CME time off

- they pay for all licensing, DEA, etc.

 

We currently get paid per shift, our contract states 163 shifts per year, but if we work more than that we get paid the per shift rate (nothing extra for more than 3 shifts per week/ more than 40 hours per week)

 

So:

What are people seeing as starting salary for new grads in critical care and what are shifts per week to be considered full time?

What are average annual raises/ cost of living raises/ salary increases with years of experience? 

Do people generally get extra pay for more than three 12 hour shifts per week?

Differential for weekends or holidays?

Bonuses?  If so, what are they based on and how much are they?

I have 8 years experience in critical care.   Anymore with similar years of experience, what is your pay/salary?

what is your average patient load for a 12 hour shift?

 

Thanks so much for any help you all can give!

[boli]

I shadowed a PA in Trauma Surg/Crit Care/Pulmo who worked 4x12 hr shifts a week who claimed to have taken home approx 200k after the overtime was factored in on top of the night differential. That's like 81/hour assuming it was all salary with no bonuses or other compensation factored in. 

[coloradopa]

Hi,

Trying to get some information regarding critical care PA compensation in order to present a reasonable salary and raise structure to our group with an increasing number of PAs.

- Currently we work day shifts only, 8am-8pm

- around 2 weekends per month, no extra pay

- holidays as scheduled, no extra pay

- Good health, dental, 401k 

- start at 1wk vacation per year, increases yearly by a week up to 4wks per year

- 8 hours sick leave per month

- $1000 CME, but no extra CME time off

- they pay for all licensing, DEA, etc.

 

We currently get paid per shift, our contract states 163 shifts per year, but if we work more than that we get paid the per shift rate (nothing extra for more than 3 shifts per week/ more than 40 hours per week)

 

So:

What are people seeing as starting salary for new grads in critical care and what are shifts per week to be considered full time?

What are average annual raises/ cost of living raises/ salary increases with years of experience? 

Do people generally get extra pay for more than three 12 hour shifts per week?

Differential for weekends or holidays?

Bonuses?  If so, what are they based on and how much are they?

I have 8 years experience in critical care.   Anymore with similar years of experience, what is your pay/salary?

what is your average patient load for a 12 hour shift?

 

Thanks so much for any help you all can give!

We cover our ICU 24/7. We have night shift and day shift. Basically we do 3 13.33 hour shifts per week (0600-1930 or reverse). You have to work 6 shifts per 2 week pay period. 

We get PTO instead of vacation/sick time. 8 hours per pay period (400 hours per year). We also get $2000 and 40 hours for CME. 

We have differentials for nights and weekends. If you are not weekend option you get $125 per weekend day or if you cover a night you get the same (if you are not on night differential). 

For extra shifts (beyond 6 per pay period) we have have a system that is specifically not called overtime. Since we are salaried and exempt we don't get overtime. Instead we get extra duty pay (for hours beyond normal duty). It essentially works out to $75/hour for days and $100/hour for nights. You have to do it in four hour blocks. 

Our group looked at weekends and essentially from a quality of life issue doesn't want to do more than 1/4. We have a weekend night and weekend day position that carries a differential. Basically 10 FTEs give you 2 providers 24/7 with extra for vacations. 

[charlottew]

I work for a fairly large NP/PA critical care service, in an area where PA salaries are generally good but not tops. We work a rotating schedule (12 hr shifts, days and nights), 13 shifts per 4 weeks. Every 3rd weekend. We cover holidays (no differential) according to a set rotating schedule.

 

We have a pool of PTO, for new hires about 150 hrs/yr, plus holiday time (approx 80 hrs/year). 3 days paid CME, plus $2k in funds for any expenses (DEA/license from this fund). Good benefit package. Night differential. If you pick up extra shifts those are paid extra at a higher rate.

 

Salaries and PTO are on a graduated scale based on tenure (and ability on the job/independence). Once you are fluent, there is a bonus (< 10% of base salary) which is linked to meeting goals for productivity and participation in training. New hire salary is in the typical new PA range for this area,  I'm 2 years in, my base is $110k before any differential/bonus/extra shifts, PTO 180hr + holidays. $200k would be possible for me in a year, but it would mean picking up a fair number of extra shifts with a degradation of lifestyle.

 

If a shift is fully staffed, it's generally 5-6 patients per LIP (we work alongside residents) on days. 7-9 patients/LIP nights. Average 0-2 admission per LIP per shift days, 1-3 per shift nights. 

 

Hope that helps!

 

Edit: actually our shifts are 12hrs + (unpaid) signout, which varies from 5 minutes (!) to 75 minutes, depending on context

[MediMike]

Evening!

I started as a new grad in a cardiac ICU of an academic medical center.

$108,000 --> $114,000 in 1.5 years

8a-8p, 12 shifts/month

144hrs PTO/year

$1500 CME + 36hrs

Probably have sick time...don't really recall the accrual process

401K, pension, state retirement plan option, dental blah blah

Extra shifts available at $125/hr (days) $150/hr (nights)

Load per APP ~3-5 during day, 10-15 if sole nocturnist

[Chasenab]

On 6/9/2017 at 1:32 AM, boli said:

I shadowed a PA in Trauma Surg/Crit Care/Pulmo who worked 4x12 hr shifts a week who claimed to have taken home approx 200k after the overtime was factored in on top of the night differential. That's like 81/hour assuming it was all salary with no bonuses or other compensation factored in. 

Where abouts did you find this Trauma surg/crit care PA that allowed you to shadow? I've been trying to find one of those here around middle TN with no luck. I found one hospital that had some at a Level II, the trauma director said he didn't mind if I shadowed. However, the hospital had made a policy of no more shadowing. :(

[boli]

Where abouts did you find this Trauma surg/crit care PA that allowed you to shadow? I've been trying to find one of those here around middle TN with no luck. I found one hospital that had some at a Level II, the trauma director said he didn't mind if I shadowed. However, the hospital had made a policy of no more shadowing. :(

I used to work at a level 1 trauma center in the ED/Trauma bay so I just asked one of them while at work. I live in the Midwest though, so I’m not sure how to go about shadowing at a place where you don’t work


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[Chasenab]

Ah, I see. I know this is off topic, maybe you could PM me if it would be annoying to others in the thread. Would you mind telling me what the duties of a Trauma surgery PA are? How Autonomous? Do they do more during surgery, because there might be more then one thing that needs to be done at the same time (like two equally life threatening injuries in separate places of the body)?  Thanks ahead of time.

[ccc1180]

I'll revive this thread since it has died down and will be useful to me going into review season.

I work in New England in a Medical ICU with a good amount of autonomy (solo at night at two community hospitals as well as regular shifts with some Intensivist support at a tertiary care teaching hospital). The pay is not very good, given our scope of practice (H&Ps, consults, intubation, line and tube placements), and compared to what others are getting but may be related to New England (interested to hear what others have to say here).

$115,000 for 3 - 13.33 hour shifts per week. One weekend per month and one third nights. Night differential is an extra $150 per shift.

PTO and 401k are pretty standard for a large hospital system. 

[charlottew]

32 minutes ago, ccc1180 said:

I'll revive this thread since it has died down and will be useful to me going into review season.

I work in New England in a Medical ICU with a good amount of autonomy (solo at night at two community hospitals as well as regular shifts with some Intensivist support at a tertiary care teaching hospital). The pay is not very good, given our scope of practice (H&Ps, consults, intubation, line and tube placements), and compared to what others are getting but may be related to New England (interested to hear what others have to say here).

$115,000 for 3 - 13.33 hour shifts per week. One weekend per month and one third nights. Night differential is an extra $150 per shift.

PTO and 401k are pretty standard for a large hospital system. 

Same geographic area, similar setting, similar schedule, similar scope - similar base salary and night differential.

You didn't specify how many years of experience you have, we have a scale with various metrics. Also, we get incentive bonuses which amount to <10% annual pay.

Hope that helps.

[ccc1180]

That does help....and yes, experience is an important part of this. I have about five years of ICU experience. 
 

Though we have billing goals, we have no incentive bonus structure. 

[MediMike]

In the PNW, nocturnist coverage with rare day coverage (q8wks there is 5 days).  Tubes, lines, bronchs.  H&P, consults, most cross coverage managed by intensivist in the tele-ICU.

10 (12) hour shifts/month

137,500 w/ $10k bonus up to 10 years of experience

10+ years experience = 147,5000 w/ $10k bonus

[LT_Oneal_PAC]

1 hour ago, MediMike said:

In the PNW, nocturnist coverage with rare day coverage (q8wks there is 5 days).  Tubes, lines, bronchs.  H&P, consults, most cross coverage managed by intensivist in the tele-ICU.

10 (12) hour shifts/month

137,500 w/ $10k bonus up to 10 years of experience

10+ years experience = 147,5000 w/ $10k bonus

 

[BrianR]

Northeast, 500 bed hospital, 29 bed ICU, mostly medical. About 1/4/ - 1/3 of patients are neurosurgery, managed by their PAs.  We consult on request for vent management and other medical issues.

Nocturnist, 3 x 12 consecutive nights weekly.  Hospital-employed.

PA and a PGY-2 overnight.  Resident does all the admission H&Ps.  PA either performs or supervises procedures, primarily tubes/lines.  Keeps residents from killing patients.

A bit over $160k.  No bonuses, no extra shifts, no incentive.  200 hours PTO annually plus hospital holidays. Standard hospital benefits, CME, 401k, health/vision/dental coverage, licensing and DEA fees, etc.

I'm the only one at present.  One year of CCM experience, but 30+ years of EM before I came here.

And yes, we need another PA.  No one with the requisite experience wants to work at night.

[MediMike]

8 hours ago, BrianR said:

And yes, we need another PA.  No one with the requisite experience wants to work at night.

Gawd. Ain't that the truth.  

I miss working in an academic setting, bet it's fun to have a resident around... sometimes.

[GetMeOuttaThisMess]

5 minutes ago, MediMike said:

I miss working in an academic setting, bet it's fun to have a resident around... sometimes.

Not when I was doing the VA thing.  Talking about "dumpety, dumpety, dump".  I always wondered if they were THAT lazy in residency then what kind of physician would they make in the long haul?    Didn't help matters when while dumping they'd miss a clear leukemia (my first week there).

Edited July 14, 2020 by GetMeOuttaThisMess

[MediMike]

12 minutes ago, GetMeOuttaThisMess said:

Not when I was doing the VA thing.  Talking about "dumpety, dumpety, dump".  I always wondered if they were THAT lazy in residency then what kind of physician would they make in the long haul?    Didn't help matters when while dumping they'd miss a clear leukemia (my first week there).

There was a CLEAR difference when the resident was interested in the specialty. I was in the CCU, if we had one who wanted to match cardiology they were incredibly helpful, taking on all the admits etc, while if we ended up with a heme/onc wannabe...it was terrible, resuscitating a patient and the resident said "Oh! Well I'll just wait outside the room and put in orders"

[ccc1180]

That sounds pretty good, especially with consecutive nights. Any weekends?

For me, nights are the part of the job that kills me. Unfortunately there doesn’t seem to be many strictly day jobs out there.

[BrianR]

16 hours ago, GetMeOuttaThisMess said:

Not when I was doing the VA thing.  Talking about "dumpety, dumpety, dump".  I always wondered if they were THAT lazy in residency then what kind of physician would they make in the long haul?    Didn't help matters when while dumping they'd miss a clear leukemia (my first week there).

Fortunately, ours are pretty decent, want to learn and work hard.  Most of them are grateful to have a PA here, as they are terrified.  A few are indifferent, and it is the very rare cocky one who will try to give me any grief.  If that happens, they are promptly put in their place by the ICU director.  It's only happened once in the year I've been here.  

[BrianR]

13 hours ago, ccc1180 said:

That sounds pretty good, especially with consecutive nights. Any weekends?

For me, nights are the part of the job that kills me. Unfortunately there doesn’t seem to be many strictly day jobs out there.

When I came, we were fully staffed with two PAs, one of whom has since left.  So we worked either Sun-Mon-Tues nights or Wed-Th-Fri.  No Saturday nights.  They put a second resident on Saturdays.  That was the hospital's choice.  We told them we could cover six nights, and it was up to them which one was uncovered.  Every six weeks we'd swap, so every three months you'd have 7 consecutive nights off without using any PTO.  (Of course, every three months you also work six out of seven, but it's tolerable.)

We just don't have any need for daytime coverage, as there are usually two attendings around, multitudes of residents, sometimes a fellow for part of the day.

I love nights.  You couldn't pay me enough to work days.  But that's just me; I understand a lot of people just can't do it.