Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

PA-S questioning my decision. When/if I should I go MD/DO???


  • Please log in to reply
37 replies to this topic

#21 OneDayAPA_Maybe

OneDayAPA_Maybe

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 40 posts

Posted 22 April 2017 - 04:29 AM

I am with you there in thinking that we only scratch the surface. However, as others have stated medicine is about being a lifelong learner. What you learn in the class is not even what you see in real life. I was talking with an ex-girlfriend- who is a fourth year med student and entering residency in July - and I had just completed my second semester of clinical medicine and pathophysiology. I was discussing what I had learned and she said "damn, I really don't think I knew half of that until I was in my rotations." PA school cuts out a lot of the fluff and we learn a lot of the basics and build on that. We as PA's can become knowledgeable in our areas, but will not be the experts in the the subspecialties we work in. I am fine with that. IF you want to be the expert in your subspecialty, then become a doctor. If you are okay with not always knowing then the answer, then PA will great for you. It is all about what you want to be. I am 100% okay will reaching out to my supervising physician with questions. You have to determine if YOU are okay with that. I wish you the best of luck! (Also, you can always keep learning and know as much as a Dr., but if not having that title erks you, then DO/MD might be the route for you)


  • climbthatmountain likes this

#22 ERCat

ERCat

    Registered

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 225 posts

Posted 22 April 2017 - 07:17 AM

Very silly that you haven't even finished your schooling and you're already wanting to jump ship, based on the assumption that PA school won't teach you all that you want to know. You'll have 50K of debt and nothing to show for it, then have to go through the hell of getting into medical school, then complete the four years of school and four years of residency. And you don't even know what being a PA is like. If you feel your knowledge is inadequate then take responsibility for it. Yes - PA school "scratched the surface" but gave us the basic knowledge we need to understand the deeper concepts. 95 percent of what I learned in PA school wasn't handed to me on a platter in the form of a PowerPoint presentation - it was knowledge I accumulated during rotations and doing my own in depth reading.

#23 stevec

stevec

    Registered

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 4 posts

Posted 22 April 2017 - 11:56 AM

At your age, if you are thinking about it now, do it. You'll have nothing but regrets later if you don't and always wonder "what if"


  • climbthatmountain likes this

#24 MainerRD12

MainerRD12

    Registered

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 64 posts

Posted 22 April 2017 - 01:37 PM

I was in your boat last year during didactic, and even throughout my clinicals, but I'm a few years older than you. Now I graduate next month and cannot wait to be working and continue learning on the job and I have a lot more faith in the process. This is the hardest it will be, going forward we will only become better, and you are responsible for what kind of PA you will be. I spend a lot of time reading and studying on my own, partly because I have an exam to pass, but honestly it is mostly because I love medicine and always want to learn more. If you love it, it's enjoyable to be a nerd and will make you a better PA ;)


  • karebear12892 and climbthatmountain like this

#25 climbthatmountain

climbthatmountain

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 4 posts

Posted 22 April 2017 - 11:35 PM

To all those suggesting I learn more on my own, I agree wholeheartedly and already engage in self-study constantly. I'd be quite naive to assume I'll get it all in a short 25 months of death by PowerPoint. What I'm realizing is that I don't believe it's possible nor practical for me as a PA to assume I'll ever be able to self-study my way up to the knowledge level of a typical residency-trained physician. No need to put them on a pedestal, and that doesn't put down the value of our profession either, just highlights the obvious fact that their training is more in-depth. I'd sure hope so for the extra years and $$$. I initially thought I was 100% OK (even preferred) the more "pragmatic" PA route, but now I've been having second thoughts.

Like I said earlier though, I'm realizing I have to keep taking a step back and just being right where I am. In a few years I'll probably have a much more grounded and (hopefully) wiser view!

#26 JMPA

JMPA

    Registered

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 564 posts

Posted 23 April 2017 - 01:44 AM

To all those suggesting I learn more on my own, I agree wholeheartedly and already engage in self-study constantly. I'd be quite naive to assume I'll get it all in a short 25 months of death by PowerPoint. What I'm realizing is that I don't believe it's possible nor practical for me as a PA to assume I'll ever be able to self-study my way up to the knowledge level of a typical residency-trained physician. No need to put them on a pedestal, and that doesn't put down the value of our profession either, just highlights the obvious fact that their training is more in-depth. I'd sure hope so for the extra years and $$$. I initially thought I was 100% OK (even preferred) the more "pragmatic" PA route, but now I've been having second thoughts.

Like I said earlier though, I'm realizing I have to keep taking a step back and just being right where I am. In a few years I'll probably have a much more grounded and (hopefully) wiser view!

troll are we? what do you call a doctor who graduates at the bottom of his class?



#27 rev ronin

rev ronin

    Moderator

  • Moderators
  • PipPipPip
  • 4,984 posts

Posted 23 April 2017 - 02:05 AM

The point of college isn't to learn; it's to learn how to learn.  Graduate school, even more so.  By the time you're in a graduate program you should already know how to learn and think for yourself.  That's not to say that pure PBL is the only way to go, but the knowledge gained in PA school is secondary to the mental models of thinking about learning medicine: Evidence based medicine, though generally hated by my peers, was clearly the most important class in my PA program.



#28 south

south

    Registered

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 280 posts

Posted 23 April 2017 - 04:05 AM

troll are we? what do you call a doctor who graduates at the bottom of his class?

 

You lost me.  OP asks for opinions, then says thanks and adds that they are food for thought.  So...


PA-C, SICU

USA


#29 camoman1234

camoman1234

    Registered

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 79 posts

Posted 24 April 2017 - 02:31 AM

The OP created their account on April 20th 2017. I bet anything this is Over the horizon. Always against PAs.

#30 south

south

    Registered

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 280 posts

Posted 24 April 2017 - 03:37 AM

The OP created their account on April 20th 2017. I bet anything this is Over the horizon. Always against PAs.

 

I doubt it, but I like the way you think...good answer...I'll be watching you...

 

(professor Turgeson reference...I still can't figure out how to post an image)


PA-C, SICU

USA


#31 Simon94

Simon94

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 5 posts

Posted 24 April 2017 - 01:45 PM

PA school is only one part of your medical practice. Once you graduate, it's up to you to cultivate your practice into what you want it to be. Never stop studying or learning. You'll know if and when it's not enough and becoming a doc is right for you.

I second him!



#32 mmiller3

mmiller3

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 123 posts

Posted 24 April 2017 - 02:37 PM

You lost me.  OP asks for opinions, then says thanks and adds that they are food for thought.  So...

 

I am getting the same vibe as JMPA. The OP is saying all the right things, but a few of the comments seem similar to what one might read from a medical student.


Former US Navy Corpsman.


#33 amy bonk-chanin

amy bonk-chanin

    Newbie

  • Members
  • Pip
  • 4 posts

Posted 24 April 2017 - 03:03 PM

I have been a practicing PA since 1988.  It was an awesome choice at that point.  If I were to advise you I would tell you to become a NP instead of a PA at this point.  NPs are getting Full Practice Authority around the country (I think the count is 22 states at this writing) and PAs are not even getting close to doing so, although we talk about it a lot.  The PA education is excellent, we spend more hours in clinical rotations getting hands-on experience but our political/professional status at this time is problematic.  I love being a PA and own my own practice, but still have to pay a hefty monthly fee to a supervising physician.  I do call him for advice or to go over a case with him if I feel like I could be missing something or just want a pair of fresh eyes on the presenting problem.  He also calls me from time to time about a patient situation of his own.  This is the same process I use with other PAs and physicians (specialists) when I need some input.  It is collaboration rather then supervisory.  

There are certain specialties  you can enter into after Med School that will allow you the balance you are looking for.  Dermatology and Radiology are both well paid and more of the 9-5 schedule or part-time schedule you are looking for.  

 

Good luck,

 

Think hard about the PA vs NP if you are sure you want to be a Mid-level vs MD/DO.

 

Amy   MSPAC



#34 mmiller3

mmiller3

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 123 posts

Posted 24 April 2017 - 06:13 PM

I have been a practicing PA since 1988.  It was an awesome choice at that point.  If I were to advise you I would tell you to become a NP instead of a PA at this point.  NPs are getting Full Practice Authority around the country (I think the count is 22 states at this writing) and PAs are not even getting close to doing so, although we talk about it a lot.  The PA education is excellent, we spend more hours in clinical rotations getting hands-on experience but our political/professional status at this time is problematic.  I love being a PA and own my own practice, but still have to pay a hefty monthly fee to a supervising physician.  I do call him for advice or to go over a case with him if I feel like I could be missing something or just want a pair of fresh eyes on the presenting problem.  He also calls me from time to time about a patient situation of his own.  This is the same process I use with other PAs and physicians (specialists) when I need some input.  It is collaboration rather then supervisory.  

There are certain specialties  you can enter into after Med School that will allow you the balance you are looking for.  Dermatology and Radiology are both well paid and more of the 9-5 schedule or part-time schedule you are looking for.  

 

Good luck,

 

Think hard about the PA vs NP if you are sure you want to be a Mid-level vs MD/DO.

 

Amy   MSPAC

 

They are already almost finished with their first year of PA school, and apparently not satisfied with the level of schooling. Why would you advocate NP school?


Former US Navy Corpsman.


#35 south

south

    Registered

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 280 posts

Posted 24 April 2017 - 10:20 PM

The PA education is excellent, we spend more hours in clinical rotations getting hands-on experience but our political/professional status at this time is problematic. 

 

This right here is the key to the problem and the solution.  This problem is solvable - the NP problem is not.  

 

Think about it;  to equal out the differences in the two, is it more feasible to 

 

- increase your clinical requirements x4 and institute actual supervisory requirements for programs like PAs have?  

 

- or to chip away and continuously better the "union" while working for FPAR and such?

 

The PA political "deficiency" can be fixed, and if we continue to call for it, it could be.  We can even use the same arguments that have worked for NP.

 

The NP education "deficiency" cannot.  They are stuck with it, which is why they go in other directions (100% online joke degrees).  


PA-C, SICU

USA


#36 Hckyplyr

Hckyplyr

    Registered

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 53 posts

Posted 24 April 2017 - 10:31 PM

They are already almost finished with their first year of PA school, and apparently not satisfied with the level of schooling. Why would you advocate NP school?

 

I assume amy bonk-chanin didn't realize OP was already in PA school. IMO, PAs  will never be able to keep up with NPs....Reasoning (just a few):

-They're under board of nursing, PAs under board of medicine (MD/DOs). They can do whatever they want. 

-RNs/NPs outnumber PAs significantly, their lobbying power will never be matched by PAs. With increasing numbers and more nurses/NPs in administration and hospital positions, they hire their own, and crap on PAs. They are out to prove they are better than PAs, definitely not help them. 

-With power, larger voice and advocacy, it doesn't matter their education sucks and that their clinical and school training is inadequate. The public is largely uninformed and doesn't care/know if PA training is better. All the public hears is "Nurses have a doctorate, nurses work in "collaboration" not supervision, nurses are independent, nurses are not "assistants", etc etc. 

Unfortunately, I feel its a losing battle that PAs just can't keep up with, so I can agree amy bonk-chanin would recommend someone choose NP over PA. Do I feel PAs should role over and give up, certainly not. 


  • sas5814 likes this

#37 south

south

    Registered

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 280 posts

Posted 24 April 2017 - 10:43 PM

Style over substance essentially then, well said.  I hear you, take the point, don't agree 100%, but do agree we should fight the good fight every day.

 

Still happy with my choice and still on Team PA for newbies.  Maybe I just got the underdog thing going on.


PA-C, SICU

USA


#38 Lauren R

Lauren R

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 113 posts

Posted Yesterday, 01:12 AM

The more you learn, the more you are going to realize you don't know.  The knowledge you obtain from PA school is just the start.  Working in the medical field means being a forever student.  Your yearning to constantly know more will make you a great provider regardless of where you go to school.






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users