whoRyou Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 college algebra at least so you can understand graphical data. How well would you say in your opinion do you need to know Algebra? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acozadd Posted December 3, 2009 Share Posted December 3, 2009 Most pa programs do not require a full year of Ochem. Reaction mechanisms are taught during second, and third quarter Ochem, and are really only good for (some) biochem concepts, but mostly useful for pharm tox, or when you are taking about intermediary metabolism (glucogenisis, lypogenisis, sterol synthesis, protein synthisis, etc, etc.) I took 1 semester of organic chemistry and we were doing mechanisms by the 3rd or 4th week. I'm in biochem now and organic chem has come up a few times, but not THAT much. Understanding general and organic chemistry does provide a good foundation to build an understanding of more complex biological processes however. To the question about algebra, most of us have been taught algebra since about 7th grade. It isn't overly complex, and will come up frequently in daily life situations and throughout school. If you do not understand algebra now, I'd recommend you pick up a book and get up to speed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starvingstudent Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 How well would you say in your opinion do you need to know Algebra? algebra for organic chem? ... used strictly for interpolation and extrapolation of graphical data i.e solubility, saturation point, enthalpy,conversions, stoichiometry etc, etc.... level of algebra all depends on the school and professor teaching the course. why do you ask? dont worry, dfferential equations are not used in ochem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_me Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 My chem professor said that biochem is more applicable than o-chem BUT he said o-chem is easier than biochem if you are a memorization type person Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sparkles9708 Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 O-Chem I think teaches you how to study and for us there wasn't a whole lot of math involved. It was like whjat just_me said its alot of memorization and its alot of visual learning. Some of the structes and figuring out whether it was like R or S configuration was just basic problem solving. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiesOutHere Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 A&P didn't teach me to study effectively. I loved the material. I went through my book like it was a novel. O-chem required discipline from me because it bored me to death. But it did teach me how to force myself to study material that I think is a waste of time. And our teacher required a LOT of critical thinking out of us. That's another good skill to have. No, of course you'll never use the material in or out of PA school. Heck, I don't even think that pharmacists use o-chem. The only people using o-chem in the medical world are probably the organic chemists working for Pfizer. I'm just saying that there are other benefits of the class that are more abstract. Maybe PA schools use it to weed out applicants so they don't have to. One can stumble upon a lot of scenarios in life that require the ability to memorize, stay focused, and study effectively and not just in an academic setting. True, but o-chem must be darned good at teaching these things or it wouldn't have such a reputation and a line of MD/DO/PA applicants looking for a way to avoid it. We take other courses that are a waste of time for PA school, but people rarely complain about them. Do any programs require calculus or physics? What good will that do anyone in PA school? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoRyou Posted December 4, 2009 Share Posted December 4, 2009 algebra for organic chem? ... used strictly for interpolation and extrapolation of graphical data i.e solubility, saturation point, enthalpy,conversions, stoichiometry etc, etc.... level of algebra all depends on the school and professor teaching the course. why do you ask? The reason I ask is because like most of us it has been awhile since I have even looked at any equations. Funny I completely understand stats, to me stats is not math, it is more understanding graphs, charts etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Lucy Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 I'm in the last 10 days of O-chem and am counting every single second until it is done. It was a complete waste of time. And its hard, for me anyhow. Its placing an unnecessary risk on my GPA when I could have been taking something more applicable. I understand the whole business about abstract thinking and using your brain in different ways etc., but I would rather have something that I can apply to actual patient care, ethics, management, or even a language. Chem 1 and 2 were plenty. This is completely unnecessary. The only thing I can say is that it might look good on an application. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkansas Ranger Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 A&P didn't teach me to study effectively. I loved the material. I went through my book like it was a novel. O-chem required discipline from me because it bored me to death. But it did teach me how to force myself to study material that I think is a waste of time. And our teacher required a LOT of critical thinking out of us. That's another good skill to have. No, of course you'll never use the material in or out of PA school. Heck, I don't even think that pharmacists use o-chem. The only people using o-chem in the medical world are probably the organic chemists working for Pfizer. I'm just saying that there are other benefits of the class that are more abstract. Maybe PA schools use it to weed out applicants so they don't have to. True, but o-chem must be darned good at teaching these things or it wouldn't have such a reputation and a line of MD/DO/PA applicants looking for a way to avoid it. We take other courses that are a waste of time for PA school, but people rarely complain about them. Do any programs require calculus or physics? What good will that do anyone in PA school? IDK. You tell me. What good are those classes you mention? Quite honestly, I'm not even positive what calculus is other than an advanced math class I'll never take, and granted my life must be one of a simple idiot, I never find myself in a situation where some type of mathematics unknown to me would solve a problem I can't otherwise solve. I think a lot of people complain about required classes. The college kids we have at work, and the experiences I remember in college are similar in that everyone questions the reasoning in taking "the basics" since most of that is covered in high school. By this point in life, I could care less that I took those classes. However, I will say that I don't know that I got anymore out of world history in college than I did in high school. Just saying. Lots of people complain about such classes - not just those in the medical community. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkansas Ranger Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 How well would you say in your opinion do you need to know Algebra? LOL. I have the same question. :D Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkansas Ranger Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 algebra for organic chem? ... used strictly for interpolation and extrapolation of graphical data i.e solubility, saturation point, enthalpy,conversions, stoichiometry etc, etc.... level of algebra all depends on the school and professor teaching the course. why do you ask? dont worry, dfferential equations are not used in ochem. WTH :confused: Maybe I should be a nurse after all. :p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starvingstudent Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 WTH :confused: Maybe I should be a nurse after all. :p You learn all kinds of things when you change majors 3 or 4 times. ;) I like science anyway, so I dont think its a waste of time for me, and so what about my gpa that really Isnt what matters to me, unless you have a 2.0 gpa or something which I dont haha... ....all you people are a bunch of cry babies.... "I dont want to hurt my gpa, I think ochem is a waste or time, do I have to take this class, blah blah blah" - people you know its ok to use your brain every once and a while (even if it hurts), you dont ALWAYS have to cut corners.:rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkansas Ranger Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 You learn all kinds of things when you change majors 3 or 4 times. ;) lol I graduated college six years ago not knowing what I wanted to major in. I have a B.S. in uselessness with a minor in wasted time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoRyou Posted December 5, 2009 Share Posted December 5, 2009 lol ... I have a B.S. in uselessness with a minor in wasted time. LOL I am in the same boat as you, I have a BS in psych, do I need say anymore? ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkansas Ranger Posted December 6, 2009 Share Posted December 6, 2009 LOL I am in the same boat as you, I have a BS in psych, do I need say anymore? ;) lol yeah. I've got 21 hours in pysch, and still couldn't tell you the difference between operant and classical conditioning. At one time I was declared as a psych major / soc minor and was gonna do all the premed crap with it. I decided I didn't want to take two research methods classes so I changed my major. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whoRyou Posted December 6, 2009 Share Posted December 6, 2009 I decided I didn't want to take two research methods classes so I changed my major. So, what did you major in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkansas Ranger Posted December 6, 2009 Share Posted December 6, 2009 So, what did you major in? Interdisciplinary Studies ;) :rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest r0b0tafflicti0n Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 WTH :confused: Maybe I should be a nurse after all. :p I hate to burst your bubble, but you're going to have to know a hell of a lot of algebra for nursing school (specifically, about 1 semester in when you take pharmacology). Speaking of, I am thinking about dropping out of nursing school to go to PA school, but after wasting my time in "nursing theory" courses I have no more patience for wasting time in prereqs that I will (1) likely do poorly in and (2) likely not need anyway (stress upon stress upon stress!). Here's looking for programs that don't require Organic Chem. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acozadd Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 I hate to burst your bubble, but you're going to have to know a hell of a lot of algebra for nursing school (specifically, about 1 semester in when you take pharmacology). Speaking of, I am thinking about dropping out of nursing school to go to PA school, but after wasting my time in "nursing theory" courses I have no more patience for wasting time in prereqs that I will (1) likely do poorly in and (2) likely not need anyway (stress upon stress upon stress!). Here's looking for programs that don't require Organic Chem. . . What happens in PA school when you are in a course that you 1) are doing poorly in and 2) likely wont need anyway... let's not forget the stress associated with taking numerous other challenging courses at the same time, the threat of being dropped from the program, etc? I'd personally rather get used to the stress and taking courses outside of my comfort zone in undergrad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikeSpa Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 Waste of time. Take biochem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderator EMEDPA Posted December 20, 2009 Moderator Share Posted December 20, 2009 Waste of time. Take biochem. agree- I have never seen a clinical use for ochem outside of research related positions. you will learn all the organic chemistry related info you need to be a pa in pa school. ask any physician what they remember about ochem and they will tell you it was the hardest class they ever took and they forgot all the info 5 min after taking the final. biochem has clinical applications but is not on pance or panre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acozadd Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 Waste of time. Take biochem. Biochem > O chem in terms of practicality. Neither should be much of a concern for someone with good study habits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_me Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 ....all you people are a bunch of cry babies.... "I dont want to hurt my gpa, I think ochem is a waste or time, do I have to take this class, blah blah blah" - people you know its ok to use your brain every once and a while (even if it hurts), you dont ALWAYS have to cut corners.:rolleyes: pffft physical sciences suck and I do not find them the least bit interesting. I can get mental stimulation from biological sciences and I am glad my top choices do not require o-chem because I would also be one of these "cry babies" that you speak of:D I dont care what anyone thinks about it--my GPA is too important for me to experiment with a course thats not called for and not even remotely interesting to me. I'll experiement with courses like that once I have graduated from a program:D PS Im well aware that there will be courses in a PA program that I will not find interesting. The difference is that they are required and neccessary for me to do my job---cant say the same for courses like organic and physics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
just_me Posted December 20, 2009 Share Posted December 20, 2009 I hate to burst your bubble, but you're going to have to know a hell of a lot of algebra for nursing school (specifically, about 1 semester in when you take pharmacology). Speaking of, I am thinking about dropping out of nursing school to go to PA school, but after wasting my time in "nursing theory" courses I have no more patience for wasting time in prereqs that I will (1) likely do poorly in and (2) likely not need anyway (stress upon stress upon stress!). Here's looking for programs that don't require Organic Chem. . . I have taken 2 pharm courses and a medical dosage calculations course (which was covered in my pharm courses) not much algebra--dimensional analysis and conversions pretty much covered it for me:cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest starvingstudent Posted December 22, 2009 Share Posted December 22, 2009 pffft physical sciences suck and I do not find them the least bit interesting. I can get mental stimulation from biological sciences and I am glad my top choices do not require o-chem because I would also be one of these "cry babies" that you speak of:D I dont care what anyone thinks about it--my GPA is too important for me to experiment with a course thats not called for and not even remotely interesting to me. I'll experiement with courses like that once I have graduated from a program:D PS Im well aware that there will be courses in a PA program that I will not find interesting. The difference is that they are required and neccessary for me to do my job---cant say the same for courses like organic and physics well ya'll good luck trying to understand pharmacodynamics, pharmacokenetics, biochem, genetic basis of disease, etc, etc... some people like to fully understand how things work and why... others are simply happy with connecting the dots.... i am the former. i like to know how drugs work and what they do in the body... i am not comfy with just dolling out medication... just sayin yo.:cool: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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