New CME Requirements - Self-Assessment & PI CME

[EMEDPA]

I was under the impression that online Cat. 1 quizzes would qualify as SA (I plead guilty that I haven't looked at it that closely yet since this won't kick in for me till 1/1/15 after passing PANRE a year early and I've already have my CME in place for 12/31/14 deadline).

I always take it yr 5 as well. I am set for cme until 2015 when the new requirements go into effect for me. hoping that CAQ prep/maintenance counts as SI.

[gbrothers98]

I was under the impression that online Cat. 1 quizzes would qualify as SA (I plead guilty that I haven't looked at it that closely yet since this won't kick in for me till 1/1/15 after passing PANRE a year early and I've already have my CME in place for 12/31/14 deadline).

Don't see it listed.

My simple interpretation of self assessment is that I am going to have to take a test covering a broad category or area of medicine.

So I dont see the possibility of online quizzes concerning one topic cutting the mustard in this department.

I do see the aapa and paea review book is listed under self assessment. Likely have to take a pretest online, see where you are weak, work on deficiencies, take a post test. If you score well enough, you get SA cme.

It does seem that a more consistent amount of my future cme monies will be going to an aapa approved activity than in the past.

G 

[GetMeOuttaThisMess]

As EMEDPA stated earlier, some states don't require NCCPA certification once licensed and I happen to be in one of them. May be time to let it go at some point since I don't plan on taking PANRE again.

[bradtPA]

As EMEDPA stated earlier, some states don't require NCCPA certification once licensed and I happen to be in one of them. May be time to let it go at some point since I don't plan on taking PANRE again.

For me, the biggest problem with that is a lot of the insurance companies that we bill require certification.

[Guest Paula]

Is this a subversive attempt by AAPA to make us all join so we can get the right SA/PI?   I'm beginning to think so.  I do a lot of free CME and can get it free from Indian Health Service on-line.  I sure hope it qualifies for SA.

 

I don't know about anyone else but I find NCCPA explanations of SA/PI a bit difficult to understand.  Why, oh why do they have to make it so confusing for those of us that work diligently every day and don't have time for this crap. 

 

My idea:  Grandfather those of us who have 10 years left to practice with permanent certification and then we just do our 100 CME every two years without all the SA/PI requirements.  Aren't the MDs putting forth an effort to change their Maintenance of Certification?  I see blogs on this quit frequently and they are just as frustrated as  the PAs. 

 

Money maker, heck yeah!  

[maryfran123]

Hell yeah Paula!! Sign me up because that is about what I have left in my career!!!!

[Guest Paula]

Hell yeah Paula!! Sign me up because that is about what I have left in my career!!!!

 

If only I had the power..........

[mainiac]

Just a shout out to any PA's that are ATC's!

 

The NATA has also changed their requirements for the 50 CEU's.

10 of them now must be "EBP" Evidence Based Practice

check out their page: http://www.bocatc.org/ats/maintain-certification/continuing-education 

for full details.

But once again, looks like a money maker!

Only NATA/BOC approved EBP CEU's count. If you are a non-member of NATA, their CEU's are $25/CEU; if you are a member it drops to $15/CEU.....

The other options are outside providers charging their own fees/CEU.

 

This is also NEW! So most events are live, very few options for home study;

& not transferable to PA req's....

 

Oh & the hits just keep coming!!

[begingri]

Has anyone started/completed the AAFP METRIC PI CME? I am trying to figure out what exactly it entails before potentially starting it.

 

If not this one, any PI or SA CMEs at all? Any advice?

[armyapache1974]

Are you kidding? The new CME Self-Assessment & PI-CME is just a money maker and more BS for all PAs. I have better things to do than add this on. Who has this time. I noticed the cost is $6.25 per Cat 1 CME and you have to have 20 CME of these kind to complete the requirement($125) about every 2 years. More money that does not stay in our pocket. Under paid and over worked, It does NOT enhance our careers. Just like some who wanted Ph.D course for PAs thats fine but it does NOT do anything for those who are in the trenches. If you want an Ph.D, then go medical school. PAs were designed to be part of the Patient care team and the supervising Physician is the head of this team. I have seen the changes since 1970s to today. First it was AA , then BS now Master's degree. It changes again to make PAs to obtain PhD(its only a matter of time). I understand education is good but as a profession the patient outcomes are the final factor how well we are doing! This sounds more like a research projects than CME.

I'll do what I have to do to maintain my PA requirements but this will be my first and last new 10-year recert I will take. Put a fork in me. I out of here. Us old guys have tried to make it easier but I feel sorry for our young PAs who have to endure the BS. I can see restrictions coming down the road making all PAs when they come out of PA schools that they MUST do Primary care/ Family medicine x 2-4 years before they can get into a specialty. Sounds like government getting into our business. It sound like I'm mad or pissed but I have had many years(> 15) of enjoyment in Primary care/Family Medicine before getting into other specialty fields. I have a different view from being in the trenches.

Just another former military native american PA.

[Guest Paula]

^^^^ I agree.  But a gentle correction:  PhD is research scientist degree or teaching, DHSc is administration or teaching or public health related and MD (or DO)  is the doctorate for physicians. PAs go for the DHSc and PhD to enter the arena of administration or teaching and I support them.  It is a way for PAs to have a place at the table and enhance our career paths, plus will elevate the profession to one that is more than an assistant in the eyes of the public and policy makers. It will keep the profession on the same "level" as the DNP who is our "competition" in many ways.  PAs who want independent practice apply for and go to medical school.  Several on this forum are in the process of obtaining their independence and enhancing their scope of practice by becoming DOs or MDs.

 

I am second career PA and will be taking my 2nd PANRE in 2015/16 and will be my last.  I agree all the SA/PI requirements are a money making scam.  In my personal situation I am required now by NCCPA to jump through the hoops to maintain my certification with thee new rules and the physician I collaborate with is a GP so he has NO REQUIREMENTS to maintain his GP status.  It really is disconcerting because there will be no projects we work on together as some of these SA/PI projects suggest we do.  In my small Native American clinic where I practice Family Medicine I will fly solo on required CME, etc.  My CME budget will be spent on these projects but I would rather spend my CME money on a conference of my interest rather than doing a PI.  UGH!

[andersenpa]

Been a while since I looked at it but I thought the new NCCPA requirements were meant to mirror the ABIM requirements.

I posted a link here in the last month or so about a physician opposition to it on the basis of lacking any evidence basis for improved quality of care. 

 

I DON'T favor additional cost and work

But I DO like the fact that the list of SA modules linked on NCCPA's site include those offered by the physician specialty societies. PAs and docs should be drinking from the same well.

 

The PI-CME list is a joke. Nothing that applies to my specialty. 

 

This whole process was rolled out WAY too prematurely and is inducing more angina than is necessary in the hearts of far too many PAs.

[EMEDPA]

I have taken panre 3 times and probably have 2 more to go...at least...many folks in my family work into their 80s....my grandfather, an engineer for over 60 years and dying of cancer, got a new patent the week before he died...

[Jengirl81]

I ended up purchasing the MKSAP16 through the AAPA, and it will satisfy all of my CME cat 1 and 2 (including all 20 PI credits needed.) All you have to do is answer practice questions (PANRE-like) and you get the credits. You can also delete the questions you get wrong and take them until you get the right answers. Pretty easy.

[GetMeOuttaThisMess]

E, I would die if I thought I was going to have to do this IN MY 80's! I'm not helping myself by watching Beachfront Bargain Hunt. BTW, Maui resort position offered no >$45/hr and they refused a housing option as I took the position listing to imply. Recruiter was in Omaha, Nebraska. I can see the ocean from their office...or maybe it's just street flooding. For the record, IMO recruiters are sleazy.

[EMEDPA]

E, I would die if I thought I was going to have to do this IN MY 80's! I'm not helping myself by watching Beachfront Bargain Hunt. BTW, Maui resort position offered no >$45/hr and they refused a housing option as I took the position listing to imply. Recruiter was in Omaha, Nebraska. I can see the ocean from their office...or maybe it's just street flooding. For the record, IMO recruiters are sleazy.

I don't think I will work for money into my 80s, but could see volunteering a day/week or doing a few overseas medical missions/yr. I work with an 87 year old DO anesthesiologist at a local free clinic who volunteers 4 hrs/week and still keeps his license active. guy is a machine. still runs marathons, manages a huge family farm, etc. I want to be him someday. I will probably retire from paid work in my mid to late 60s after 50 years working in EM.

[GetMeOuttaThisMess]

Now volunteer work where one is needed and appreciated for a week or two at a time might allow for some residual compassion.

[rev ronin]

FYI, I got PEER VIII from ACEP (and they got my name from SEMPA).... up to 55 hours of Cat 1 SA.  Now, it's probably not going to take me anywhere near 55 hours to work through the material, but at 450 questions, 4 minutes a question would be 30 hours--well more than enough for one year, and the discounted/promotional rate for that was only $50, including shipping.

 

Point being, I don't think the SA CME is going to be THAT big of a deal.

[EMEDPA]

FYI, I got PEER VIII from ACEP (and they got my name from SEMPA).... up to 55 hours of Cat 1 SA.  Now, it's probably not going to take me anywhere near 55 hours to work through the material, but at 450 questions, 4 minutes a question would be 30 hours--well more than enough for one year, and the discounted/promotional rate for that was only $50, including shipping.

 

Point being, I don't think the SA CME is going to be THAT big of a deal.

450 questions shouldn't take you that long. figure a minute a question. 7.5 hrs, say 3 sessions of 2.5 hrs each.  if you don't know it in a minute 3 more won't help.

[rev ronin]

450 questions shouldn't take you that long. figure a minute a question. 7.5 hrs, say 3 sessions of 2.5 hrs each.  if you don't know it in a minute 3 more won't help.

You get to count the time taking the initial test, studying, taking focused exams, more studying, and taking the post-test.  The 90 question pre-test took me about 45 minutes, although some of that was simply waiting for the next screen to load.  Yes, it if was only taking the test once, 55 hours would be a ridiculously long amount of CME time to allow.

[EMEDPA]

team health requires all their em pas to complete the online em boot camp once. gives 40 hrs cat 1 credit. I did it a year I didn't need any credits so claimed zero, but it took 4 hrs. total. I did it in 2 sittings.

[medic25]

FYI, I got PEER VIII from ACEP (and they got my name from SEMPA).... up to 55 hours of Cat 1 SA.  Now, it's probably not going to take me anywhere near 55 hours to work through the material, but at 450 questions, 4 minutes a question would be 30 hours--well more than enough for one year, and the discounted/promotional rate for that was only $50, including shipping.

 

Point being, I don't think the SA CME is going to be THAT big of a deal.

 

I got the same package; at $49 instead of $299 it was too good to turn down.  I plan on doing it while taking Amtrak to The Difficult Airway Course in Baltimore on Thursday; should be a CME heavy week!

[navyflyPAC]

As EMEDPA stated earlier, some states don't require NCCPA certification once licensed and I happen to be in one of them. May be time to let it go at some point since I don't plan on taking PANRE again.

Um, which states are those?  I'm newly certified in Michigan.  Not sure though if my office, hospital system or billable insurance companies would be crazy about me not completing CME and letting my -C drop off.  Any thoughts on this? 

[gbrothers98]

Um, which states are those?  I'm newly certified in Michigan.  Not sure though if my office, hospital system or billable insurance companies would be crazy about me not completing CME and letting my -C drop off.  Any thoughts on this? 

http://www.aapa.org/WorkArea/DownloadAsset.aspx?id=599

While states may allow a PA to not have a -C, you are right that your other bosses may not agree. Specifically hospital credentialing committees have quite a bit of power and if the bylaws state one must maintain the -C, then there is no arguing with that. They will just not credential you.

All states require passing the PANCE initially.

As you can see by the pdf, letting the -C drop is not synonymous with CME incompletion. 

I was surprised that my own state, Vermont, did not require the -C. But they do require CME that is the same as the NCCPA's requirement to maintain the -C. Which is why I only have to send them a copy of my NCCPA certification rather than log my CME hours with them (by hand).

My thought is that I would not lose the -C unless you are sure you will never practice in another state that requires it or are on the cusp of retirement.

As federal PAs will tell you, they did not have to have the -C for some time. Then the rule changed and hundreds to thousands had to regain this status. A state can institute the same, they may or may not have to go through the state legislature or governor to do so. Could just be a medical board directive if allowed by statute. 

Then where are you? Scrambling to take a test to keep your job or relocating to another state where you dont need the -C.

G Brothers PA-C

[Guest Paula]

Um, which states are those?  I'm newly certified in Michigan.  Not sure though if my office, hospital system or billable insurance companies would be crazy about me not completing CME and letting my -C drop off.  Any thoughts on this? 

 

Congratulations on becoming a MI certified PA.  It's a great state to work in.